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slickskin

breaking down the new gun laws signed by the governor

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At my last inspection, the IOI had a list of NTNs with dates. While going through the 4473s for the year, he crossed checked them. So they know who was approved and denied.

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Yes they had a NTN, but that shouldn't have any info attached to it. Now if they are cross checking your book with that NTN I certainly hope that aren't copying the names in your book. If so that would be a backdoor way to compiling a gun registration database and in violation of federal law.


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Just now, capt14k said:

 


Yes they had a NTN, but that shouldn't have any info attached to it. Now if they are cross checking your book with that NTN I certainly hope that aren't copying the names in your book. If so that would be a backdoor way to compiling a gun registration database and in violation of federal law.


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DUDE thats exactly what NJ Nics has.
Name, Date , Number , Status..

 

Just now, remixer said:

DUDE thats exactly what NJ Nics has.
Name, Date , Number , Status..

 

 

If they had the NTN they would need a date and name as well or why bother bringing the NTN numbers... what would they be able to reference to?

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it CANT lead to a registry because nics DOES NOT KNOW WHAT YOU PURCHASED.


Read what you just wrote.

If They are checking dealer books with NTN then they absolutely would know what you bought. The name of the person, caliber, make and model not in your books?

The NTN alone should have no name attached to it. Not til they see the dealer books do they have that info. That is a backdoor way towards a registry.




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Just now, capt14k said:

 


Read what you just wrote.

If They are checking dealer books with NTN then they absolutely would know what you bought. The name of the person, caliber, make and model not in your books?

The NTN alone should have no name attached to it. Not til they see the dealer books do they have that info. That is a backdoor way towards a registry.




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Again... NICS does not know what you bought. The ATF inspector CAN check what you bought.  

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If they had the NTN they would need a date and name as well or why bother bringing the NTN numbers... what would they be able to reference to?

 

They would be able to reference the NTN to the 4473. They don't need to have a name and date to match a number to a number.

 

 

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and?

 

 

And the agent takes his list of NTN and goes through your 4473 file and checks off each number as he goes along.

 

Not til he looks at the name on the form does he know the name. At least that is how it is supposed to be. Now if he looks at your book he knows name and what was purchased.

 

 

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Explain to me how the ATF brought a list of numbers to Pauls Inspection.... why would they... if they cant match to a name...

the Nics number only shows a date nics was ran. you can pickup within 30 days... so you think pauls agent brought those with the idea of checking 30 days of records for each number not knowing the name of the person. BTW even without the name it really does not matter...  You know that the Federal government can hire about 10 million illegals to search and document every single transaction we have ever done and then create a registry

 

 

Just now, capt14k said:

 


And the agent takes his list of NTN and goes through your 4473 file and checks off each number as he goes along.

Not til he looks at the name on the form does he know the name. Now if he looks at your book he knows name and what was purchased.


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For what purpose.

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Explain to me how the ATF brought a list of numbers to Pauls Inspection.... why would they... if they cant match to a name... the Nics number only shows a date nics was ran. you can pickup within 30 days... so you think pauls agent brought those with the idea of checking 30 days of records for each number not knowing the name of the person. BTW even without the name it really does not matter...  You know that the Federal government can hire about 10 million illegals to search and document every single transaction we have ever done and then create a registry    

For what purpose.

 

 

 

 OK. I will go slower. 

NICS creates a NTN this is a number to show there was an approval. You mark that number down I assume on 4473 or in book of both. This covers the dealer that they ran the NICS and got an approval.

 

NICS gives ATF agent these list of numbers that dealers were given, but just numbers with no names attached.

 

Agent shows up with list of numbers.

 

As agent goes through 4473 or book or both and each time he sees a NTN he goes to his list and makes sure it is there. If there is an approval without a number or a number not on his list I assume that could be a problem unless the dealer can show that he waited 3 days and didn't hear back from NICS so he proceeded with sale. If dealer just made up a number that would be a big problem.

 

 

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Just now, capt14k said:

 


OK. I will go slower.

NICS creates a NTN this is a number to show there was an approval. You mark that number down I assume on true in book of both. This covers the dealer that they ran the NICS and got an approval.

NICS gives ATF agent these list of numbers that dealers were given.

Agent shows up with list of numbers.

As agent goes through 4473 or book or both and each time he sees a NTN he goes to his list and makes sure it is there. If there is an approval without a number of a number not on his list I assume that could be a problem unless the dealer can show that he waited 3 days and didn't hear back from NICS so he proceeded with sale.


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Dont go slower.. just be accurate. The nics number goes on the 4473 not in the AD book.

Why bother with a list of NTN's.. just copy all the info from the 4473 and or scan the AD book. that gives you all you need...    

 

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If the feds or a state wanted to get a registry they would only have to visit every dealer in each state and just scan every single page of every single 4473 the dealer has ever filled out..
Seems like a simple task.
 


NJ since they keep records they could just look for the large purchasers.


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Dont go slower.. just be accurate. The nics number goes on the 4473 not in the AD book.
Why bother with a list of NTN's.. just copy all the info from the 4473 and or scan the AD book. that gives you all you need...    
 


Ok so agent goes through 4473 and checks off the numbers. Why would there need to be a name attached to the number to do this?


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1 minute ago, capt14k said:

 


NJ since they keep records they could just look for the large purchasers.


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Why stop at NJ... NJ has pretty much the same data as the feds minus the type of gun.. unless you live in certain southen states where more then 1 guy requires the dealer to send the ATF all the purchasing info including serials, brand, caliber etc etc..

ok im done with this debate.  

 

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The NTNs are in chronological order by date. So should the 4473s. As the IOI goes through the 4473, he checks off the number in his NTN list. I assume that is to assure there are no missing or extra 4473s. You don't need the NTN list to know who bought what. All info is on the 4473s.

 

ETA: Sorry. I am a slow typer.

 

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The NTNs are in chronological order by date. So should the 4473s. As the IOI goes through the 4473, he checks off the number in his NTN list. I assume that is to assure there are no missing or extra 4473s. You don't need the NTN list to know who bought what. All info is on the 4473s.

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Thank you so I am right that NTN has no name attached to it. They are just Matching numbers.

If they scan all 4473 or entire book they are violating federal law and it would be a backdoor to a registry.

There would be a need for them to take down purchaser info and what they purchased not just copy everyone's info.


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1 minute ago, PK90 said:

The NTNs are in chronological order by date. So should the 4473s. As the IOI goes through the 4473, he checks off the number in his NTN list. I assume that is to assure there are no missing or extra 4473s. You don't need the NTN list to know who bought what. All info is on the 4473s.

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As my point was the nics data is hardly the way to make the registry.. there are easier ways

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As my point was the nics data is hardly the way to make the registry.. there are easier ways

 

Your point was NICS data has names attached to it. No it does not. Also copying 4473 physically would be a lot harder.

 

 

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Just now, capt14k said:

 

 


Thank you so I am right that NTN has no name attached to it. They are just Matching numbers.

If they scan all 4473 or entire book they are violating federal law and it would be a backdoor to a registry.

There would be a need for them to take down purchaser info and what they purchased not just copy everyone's info.


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I dont think anyone really knows.. What info was attached to the NTN... his agents list might not be what the database has.. i would assume its name, ntn date and status

Just now, capt14k said:

 


Your point was NICE data has names attached to it. No it does not.


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You dont know that...  Fuck.... i dont know that...  You know who knows.... the FBI. :)

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I dont think anyone really knows.. What info was attached to the NTN... his agents list might not be what the database has.. i would assume its name, ntn date and status


It's not according to federal law. It is just a number assigned to a FFL. Nothing more attached after 24hrs no names of purchasers.


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BTW this entire mess wasthat NJ can make a registry based off the nics...

My point was the Feds can do exactly the same thing.... THey both have access to our books. 

Just now, capt14k said:

 


It's not according to federal law. It is just a number assigned to a FFL. Nothing more attached after 24hrs no names of purchasers.


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You actually think they delete the data?

 

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BTW this entire mess wasthat NJ can make a registry based off the nics...
My point was the Feds can do exactly the same thing.... THey both have access to our books. 
You actually think they delete the data?
 


I believe NJ keeps information.

Yes the Feds have to delete information.


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again it does not mater.  Nics is not how you would do a registry so its really pointless..

 

 

NJ NICS you could find out more info than could Feds. This state is a police state. Say No to NJ NICS get a FFL03 lol.

 

 

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again it does not mater.  Nics is not how you would do a registry so its really pointless..
 
ok im opening now... well fight later LOL
 
Agree

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NJ NICS you could find out more info than could Feds. This state is a police state. Say No to NJ NICS get a FFL03 lol.
 
 
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And buy only used antiquated junk firearms? No thanks.

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1 minute ago, capt14k said:

 


NJ NICS you could find out more info than could Feds. This state is a police state. Say No to NICS get a FFL03 lol.


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Yes thats the solution.... You know NJ can kick in your door as well :)

 

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