BobA 1,235 Posted June 23, 2018 I don’t think fee rates are too combatable. Look at just motor vehicle registration and fines are for example. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,895 Posted June 23, 2018 12 hours ago, brucin said: I wouldn't hold up much hope in the courts regarding fees. NYC fee is $350 for a handgun premises permit per handgun. renewable every 2 years. A court ruled it constitutional. I have no idea how but they did. I don't believe that decision was ever challenged past the state supreme court level for whatever reason. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,895 Posted June 23, 2018 4 minutes ago, BobA said: I don’t think fee rates are too combatable. Look at just motor vehicle registration and fines are for example. Driving a car is not a right, neither is owning an "adult business" like the NY court ruled. Not to mention fees for businesses are recouped. If you have to pay a ridiculous fee to exercise a right, is it really a right? or is it only something people who can afford to pay it get to exercise? If the fee is making the state money, to use it beyond a background check for eligibility, then i fail to see how it could even remotely be considered constitutional. Because now you are paying to exercise a right, and not paying for an eligibility check. Some would say, even we shouldn't have to pay for the background check. No I have to prove I am eligible, by paying for background checks? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
silverado427 10,675 Posted June 23, 2018 43 minutes ago, BobA said: I don’t think fee rates are too combatable. Look at just motor vehicle registration and fines are for example. Gov Mc Swallow raised all the dmv fees and fines to help him spend his way out of a budget crisis. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T Bill 649 Posted June 23, 2018 22 hours ago, BobA said: I wonder how the Fudds feel now. These fees, f2f sale stoppage and stopping internet ammo sales (proposed) now effect the owners of Grandpa’s shotgun. The Fudds don't care. The got their FPID already and their shotgun. Now make them renew that authorization, they you may have something. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
T Bill 649 Posted June 23, 2018 15 hours ago, njJoniGuy said: I would very much like to see Gov Gopher and Sen Sprinkler have a showdown in the middle of State Street S&W M19s at 15 paces Keep Fire-Rescue away and let them both bleed out The subjects of the Glorious PRNJ will be the winner Then you get Sheila Oliver. Be careful what you wish for. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,052 Posted June 23, 2018 Driving a car is not a right, neither is owning an "adult business" like the NY court ruled. Not to mention fees for businesses are recouped. If you have to pay a ridiculous fee to exercise a right, is it really a right? or is it only something people who can afford to pay it get to exercise? If the fee is making the state money, to use it beyond a background check for eligibility, then i fail to see how it could even remotely be considered constitutional. Because now you are paying to exercise a right, and not paying for an eligibility check. Some would say, even we shouldn't have to pay for the background check. No I have to prove I am eligible, by paying for background checks?Such a high fee is surely an infringement on the right to keep and bear arms. Even if you could buy a cheap $100 handgun, if it is your first handgun it will cost you $100 for FPID (not needed for handgun but recommended in case you want to buy a rifle one day) + $75 for fingerprints + $50 for permit + $15 for NICS + $25 minimum for transfer fee = $265. That $100 handgun is now $365. Since FFL licenses are looking to increase 10 fold I am sure the $25 transfer will increase to $35 making it $375 for a $100 handgun or $775 for your typical handgun. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bob2222 316 Posted June 23, 2018 Still less than the street price that Bloods on probation for murder pay in Trenton. https://www.forbes.com/sites/frankminiter/2014/08/12/inside-the-black-market-for-guns/#5f45ebcd181e Quote I replied, “How about with how much handguns go for on the black market?” Agent Mulham said, “Well, a quality pistol like a Glock might go for double or triple retail. Lower-quality guns, however, are often worth only $100 or $200 more than retail.” Agent Mulham and the other two agents—John Curtis and Jason Zamaloff—all weighed in and agreed there is no precise formula for what handguns go for on the street, but basically guns are so readily available the black-market price is typically just a few hundred dollars more than retail. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,052 Posted June 23, 2018 Still less than the street price that Bloods on probation for murder pay in Trenton. https://www.forbes.com/sites/frankminiter/2014/08/12/inside-the-black-market-for-guns/#5f45ebcd181e I replied, “How about with how much handguns go for on the black market?” Agent Mulham said, “Well, a quality pistol like a Glock might go for double or triple retail. Lower-quality guns, however, are often worth only $100 or $200 more than retail.” Agent Mulham and the other two agents—John Curtis and Jason Zamaloff—all weighed in and agreed there is no precise formula for what handguns go for on the street, but basically guns are so readily available the black-market price is typically just a few hundred dollars more than retail. If high fees like proposed are instituted they will expand the black market.Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniper 6,372 Posted June 23, 2018 23 minutes ago, Bob2222 said: but basically guns are so readily available the black-market price is typically just a few hundred dollars more than retail. I read an article not too long ago that said illegal guns get "passed around" on average 6 times before being recovered by police. Seems once a criminal uses it for an adventure, they play pass the hot potato to someone else. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mossburger 406 Posted June 24, 2018 6 hours ago, capt14k said: If high fees like proposed are instituted they will expand the black market. Makes you wonder if civil disobedience is more effective than lawsuits in the pursuit of civil rights. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin125 4,772 Posted June 24, 2018 On 6/21/2018 at 9:21 PM, Indianajonze said: surprised no one's mentioned this little gem. here's the money shot: The plan would raise the cost for handgun purchase permits from $2 to $50; firearms identification cards from $5 to $100; handgun carry permits from $50 to $400; retail gun dealer licenses from $50 to $500; and wholesaler/manufacturer licenses from $150 to $1,500, among other hikes. https://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2018/06/murphy_wants_to_make_it_more_expensive_to_buy.html the laughable one to me is the handgun carry permit. may as well make it $10,000 while you're at it. do you know what i want to see? a federal law mandating that legislators who sponsor and executives who sign into law bills which are deemed to be unconstitutional must be held accountable financially for their transgressions. these ppl know this stuff won't stand legal challenge, but they don't care because it's the taxpayer who foots the bill, not them. it's how you get wave after wave of ludicrous nonsense in these states. I was thinking the carry permit should be $4000. It might evoke a response by those retired LEOs who aren’t having a problem with the current changes. It will highlight that belief that “the monster will eat me last” syndrome is a bad way to think. 5 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
67gtonut 847 Posted July 2, 2018 Can we keep this discussion adult like.... 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kevin125 4,772 Posted July 16, 2018 My comment wasn’t in jest 67. Not sure if your comment was directed at me but there was nothing juvenile about my post. $4k may be excessive, but that was my point. I have an LEO friend (retired) that doesn’t seem bothered by any of the bills being proposed because they pretty much have no effect on him. Unfortunately, if LEO organizations stood up in significant ways for the 2A rights of non-LEO citizens, the politicians might actually listen. Hitting retired LEO’s with massive ccw fees might help get their attention. That might help in the fight these punitive fees and the other bills passed and still being proposed. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
67gtonut 847 Posted July 16, 2018 57 minutes ago, Kevin125 said: My comment wasn’t in jest 67. Not sure if your comment was directed at me but there was nothing juvenile about my post. $4k may be excessive, but that was my point. I have an LEO friend (retired) that doesn’t seem bothered by any of the bills being proposed because they pretty much have no effect on him. Unfortunately, if LEO organizations stood up in significant ways for the 2A rights of non-LEO citizens, the politicians might actually listen. Hitting retired LEO’s with massive ccw fees might help get their attention. That might help in the fight these punative fees and the other bills passed and still being proposed. Not directed at you..... childish post was hidden.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,052 Posted July 16, 2018 Not directed at you..... childish post was hidden.... You mean Censored. I thought you comment was directed to Kevin as well. Probably should have removed it too. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites