DOJ, SAF REACH SETTLEMENT IN DEFENSE DISTRIBUTED LAWSUIT

[NJGF 375]

DOJ, SAF REACH SETTLEMENT IN DEFENSE DISTRIBUTED LAWSUIT

Pretty amazing outcome. This is going to take the winds out of the sales of the anti's (although they will just probably ignore it).

https://www.saf.org/doj-saf-reach-settlement-in-defense-distributed-lawsuit/

"Significantly, the government expressly acknowledges that non-automatic firearms up to .50-caliber – including modern semi-auto sporting rifles such as the popular AR-15 and similar firearms – are not inherently military."

“Not only is this a First Amendment victory for free speech, it also is a devastating blow to the gun prohibition lobby,” noted SAF founder and Executive Vice President Alan M. Gottlieb. “For years, anti-gunners have contended that modern semi-automatic sport-utility rifles are so-called ‘weapons of war,’ and with this settlement, the government has acknowledged they are nothing of the sort.

[mossburger 406]

Cool so when can someone challenge the NY SAFE Act, NJ AWB, etc. or other such nonsense on these grounds?

Seems like the three young guys from NJ who just got arrested after accidentally crossing a few hundred feet over the NY border while target shooting would be a fantastic case for us to get behind. Their NJ legal guns are being called assault weapons, their handguns illegal, etc. They're facing ridiculously massive charges. A good way to get cosmetic-feature based laws and their idiocy taken apart in court.

I don't know anyone at the orgs but is there someone who can reach out to them and get this story out?

 

 

[siderman 1,137]

Won't matter to the anti movement after all they thrive on their own fictitious mantra. They got nothin without it.

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

15 minutes ago, mossburger said:

Cool so when can someone challenge the NY SAFE Act, NJ AWB, etc. or other such nonsense on these grounds?

Seems like the three young guys from NJ who just got arrested after accidentally crossing a few hundred feet over the NY border while target shooting would be a fantastic case for us to get behind. Their NJ legal guns are being called assault weapons, their handguns illegal, etc. They're facing ridiculously massive charges. A good way to get cosmetic-feature based laws and their idiocy taken apart in court.

I don't know anyone at the orgs but is there someone who can reach out to them and get this story out?

Got any more info or a link on the “inadvertent border crossing” story?

[mossburger 406]

24 minutes ago, DirtyDigz said:

Got any more info or a link on the “inadvertent border crossing” story?

https://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2018/07/3_nj_men_were_target_shooting_with_13_illegal_guns.html#incart_river_mobile_index

At worst, I could see maybe a fine for accidentally shooting in an area where it's not allowed? That's what happens in the USA generally.

[DirtyDigz 1,811]

Thanks.  @Smokin .50, have you heard about this?

[mossburger 406]

The article is short on details, and likely intentionally. 

If you look closely the semi-autos don't even have muzzle devices, I would bet dollars to donuts every single one of those guns is NJ neutered, the "high capacity" magazines are epoxied 15s, every one of those handguns was from a P2P.

Perfect test case for the unconstitutionality of cosmetic-feature based gun bans. No victim, no crime.

[voyager9 3,434]

6 hours ago, NJGF said:

DOJ, SAF REACH SETTLEMENT IN DEFENSE DISTRIBUTED LAWSUIT

Pretty amazing outcome. This is going to take the winds out of the sales of the anti's (although they will just probably ignore it).

https://www.saf.org/doj-saf-reach-settlement-in-defense-distributed-lawsuit/

"Significantly, the government expressly acknowledges that non-automatic firearms up to .50-caliber – including modern semi-auto sporting rifles such as the popular AR-15 and similar firearms – are not inherently military."

“Not only is this a First Amendment victory for free speech, it also is a devastating blow to the gun prohibition lobby,” noted SAF founder and Executive Vice President Alan M. Gottlieb. “For years, anti-gunners have contended that modern semi-automatic sport-utility rifles are so-called ‘weapons of war,’ and with this settlement, the government has acknowledged they are nothing of the sort.

The problem could be that “the government” is not a single entity and this was a settlement, not a court decision, so the above statement may not automatically be precedent anywhere. Sure, it could be admitted as evidence, but it wouldn’t have the same weight in a court case as prior court decisions/opinions. 

[JHZR2 56]

34 minutes ago, voyager9 said:

The problem could be that “the government” is not a single entity and this was a settlement, not a court decision, so the above statement may not automatically be precedent anywhere. Sure, it could be admitted as evidence, but it wouldn’t have the same weight in a court case as prior court decisions/opinions. 

That was my curiosity; this was not resolved "at law", possibly on purpose.  

I was hoping there would be a DOJ letter stating this finding, but I assume not based upon the outcome.  

And many who are out to ban guns would be too dumb to deconvolute the 3D printing part from the speech/classification part, which I believe  is the more powerful portion of the findings.

[voyager9 3,434]

29 minutes ago, JHZR2 said:

That was my curiosity; this was not resolved "at law", possibly on purpose.  

I was hoping there would be a DOJ letter stating this finding, but I assume not based upon the outcome.  

And many who are out to ban guns would be too dumb to deconvolute the 3D printing part from the speech/classification part, which I believe  is the more powerful portion of the findings.

I imagine the above statements would be part of the settlement and approved/signed by the judge. The question is whether a statement by the DOJ as part of a settlement carries any weight on a future case 

[NJGF 375]

So I guess NJ will be banning the ownership,sale, and purchase of 3D printers now. We will have 90 days to destroy them, sell them, or turn them into the PD.

[capt14k 2,052]

The way I read the settlement it also would change ITAR exports for under .50.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[brucin 923]

7 hours ago, mossburger said:

The article is short on details, and likely intentionally. 

If you look closely the semi-autos don't even have muzzle devices, I would bet dollars to donuts every single one of those guns is NJ neutered, the "high capacity" magazines are epoxied 15s, every one of those handguns was from a P2P.

Perfect test case for the unconstitutionality of cosmetic-feature based gun bans. No victim, no crime.

NY has had a 10 round limit for years so that's why they were charged for the mags. That makes the 10/22 an assault rifle under the unSAFE act. It's the handguns that really have them hosed. Under NY state law you cannot possess a handgun without a NY State Permit. Not even in your home. That's the Sullivan act and I believe it has been in force for over 100 years.

Perhaps someday soon the new supreme court will over turn these travesties.

[SJG 253]

The settlement is certainly of interest but any admissions made therein by the gov have no binding or precedential effect on any other litigation, especially, any pending or contemplated state litigation in other contexts

[NJGF 375]

It seems that even SCOTUS decisions are not binding for some district courts. Hopefully the new SCOTUS takes another case soon and sets them all straight. And Thomas should write the decision.

[oldguysrule649 397]

Am listening to Sec of State Mike Pompeo testimony to a Congressional committee.  Just started. Committee is chaired by Corker and Menendez.

In his opening statement Sen Menendez specifically expresed his concern about this ruling, completely out of the context of the hearing.  Certainly another indication of his disdain of our 2A rights.  Am paraphrasing, but he questioned why the “administration is allowing people to make their own guns that are undetectable.”  Clearly this ruling is a thorn in his.....

[Mrs. Peel 7,157]

19 minutes ago, oldguysrule649 said:

In his opening statement Sen Menendez specifically expresed his concern about this ruling, completely out of the context of the hearing.

I guess that would be ... umm, what? reason #239?... to vote this freaking idiot out of office! What a weasel.

[oldguysrule649 397]

I certainly find myself amused by his expression of concern. I very much look forward to the defcad website being back up.  I hope every 2A advocate nationwide downloads every available file.  Can’t wait to hear the ensuing msm coverage. 

[oldguysrule649 397]

I guess the left will start calling for common sense 3D “printer control”. (:-)

[NJGF 375]

14 hours ago, oldguysrule649 said:

I guess the left will start calling for common sense 3D “printer control”. (:-)

Why does anyone NEED a 3-D printer. Printers weren't around at the founding so we should have to show justifiable need why we NEED one. Your police chief, high school teachers, doctors, dentists, ex-girlfriends, etc. would have to submit notarized statements about your NEED. Ugh.

[oldguysrule649 397]

Just checked this morning and the defcad.com website is back up.  The STL files will be downloadable beginning August 1st. Also check out ghostgunner.net which is focused on the C&C machine itself. 

I have no interest in actually machining my own firearms but an interesting topic nonetheless from a strategic 2A perspective.

[GunsnFreedom 245]

To note, it's still illegal to do in NJ as it's considered manufacturing.