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Mag Ban Injunction Hearing 7/12/18

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11 hours ago, Zeke said:

No quotes... actual action 

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So by this meme you are indicating that the police and military are enemies of the CITIZENS of this nation?

 

I just want to be sure I understand.

While those numbers can be argued, I would say they are true to a degree.

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2 hours ago, USRifle30Cal said:

So by this meme you are indicating that the police and military are enemies of the CITIZENS of this nation?

I just want to be sure I understand.

While those numbers can be argued, I would say they are true to a degree.

If the military and law enforcement members are going to obey unconstitutional orders from their superiors, then YES, they will be the enemy of the Citizenry.

Just like if UN troops are sent into the US to enforce UN mandates. Isn't that why powder blue helmets glow in the dark?? :huh:

patriot_qual_target.jpg

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13 hours ago, USRifle30Cal said:

So by this meme you are indicating that the police and military are enemies of the CITIZENS of this nation?

 

I just want to be sure I understand.

Lol the average cop would gladly bust your ass here in NJ over a folding stock or 11 round magazine or whatever else such nonsense. They wouldn't even think twice. They wouldn't give a crap. It's not personal, they wouldn't care at all. Ruining your life over some bull crap would just be a regular Tuesday to them. They've got bills to pay and a pension to collect. 

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Lol the average cop would gladly bust your ass here in NJ over a folding stock or 11 round magazine or whatever else such nonsense. They wouldn't even think twice. They wouldn't give a crap. It's not personal, they wouldn't care at all. Ruining your life over some bull crap would just be a regular Tuesday to them. They've got bills to pay and a pension to collect. 
Sad but true

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

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On 8/27/2018 at 0:45 PM, PeteF said:
d5ebd999-f176-494d-9d38-8783f013a91a.jpg
 
 
THE LATEST ON ANJRPC’S LEGAL CHALLENGES TO NJ MAG BAN AND NJ CARRY LAW
 
Hold Onto Your Magazines – We Anticipate a Decision
On Our Injunction Motion in September and
Will Provide Detailed Guidance Then
 
Carry Lawsuit Moving Through Federal Appeals Court
 
 
It has been a busy summer for ANJRPC’s federal legal challenges to New Jersey’s magazine ban and unconstitutional carry laws. There has been significant activity in both lawsuits, and the following updates have been provided by attorney Dan Schmutter, Esq., who is local counsel in both cases:
 
 
The U.S. District Court held evidentiary hearings over three days during the week of August 13th on ANJRPC’s application for a preliminary injunction in the lawsuit to strike down New Jersey’s new magazine ban (which prohibits the possession of magazines with a capacity over 10 rounds). The injunction application seeks to put the new law on hold while the case is decided. 
 
The Court heard testimony from three of the State’s witnesses and then finished up the week hearing testimony from our expert witness, Florida State University Criminologist Professor Gary Kleck. 
 
The State’s witnesses offered various opinions on the nature and use of magazines with a capacity of greater than 10 rounds. Cross-examination of the State’s witnesses was thorough and crisp, and the Judge was engaged and attentive.
 
Professor Kleck testified that depriving law abiding gun owners of standard capacity magazines holding over 10 rounds will not only not reduce mass shootings, but will also make lawful self-defense more difficult.  He also addressed the opinions of the State’s witnesses, identifying flaws in their data and reasoning.
 
The parties are scheduled to submit closing briefs on the injunction motion on September 4, followed by telephonic oral argument on September 6.
 
[Important Note from ANJRPC: We have received numerous inquiries from gun owners asking for guidance on what to do with their magazines. ANJRPC will issue detailed guidance once we have a decision on the injunction motion, and we suggest that gun owners await that decision before doing anything with their magazines over 10 rounds. In the meanwhile, gun owners are cautioned not to use, transport, or attempt to purchase magazines over 10 rounds – all of which are prohibited and could result in serious criminal charges. Please see prior guidancefrom gun rights attorney Evan Nappen on this subject.]
 
RIGHT TO CARRY LAWSUIT
 
ANJRPC’S federal lawsuit Rogers v. Grewal, challenging New Jersey’s carry law, is moving forward. In May, as expected, the District Court dismissed the case, stating it was bound by a previous decision of the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit,Drake v. Filko, upholding the law. We then filed an appeal with the Third Circuit in June.
 
In July, we asked the Third Circuit panel assigned to the case to rule on the appeal “summarily,” without briefing or argument, again on the ground that the panel is already bound by the decision in Drake. We argued that Drake was wrongly decided but that a Third Circuit panel does not have authority to change that ruling. Instead, only the full complement of all Third Circuit judges, sitting together (known as “en banc”), or the U.S. Supreme Court, can overrule Drake. The attorneys for the State agreed, and we are currently awaiting a decision on our motion asking the Court to rule summarily.
 
Whatever happens, the case will inevitably work its way toward possible consideration in the U.S. Supreme Court.
 
Both the magazine ban case and the right to carry challenge were filed with the assistance of the National Rifle Association. ANJRPC thanks the NRA for its incredible support, which made both lawsuits possible. ANJRPC also thanks the law firm of Cooper & Kirk, and attorney Dan Schmutter, for their incredibly hard work in these cases.
 
 
 

 

Closest to an update we have for the time being.  In case you missed it from the last page.

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many blue in the family and let me tell you, all that matters is the contract and pension.  Cops could care less about the orders they are given to follow and agree, cops have not endeared themselves to the constitution or the people they serve.  Cops have most definitely become outsiders to their communities.

Just go in any station and listen to them refer to us as as civilians......

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43 minutes ago, myhatinthering said:

many blue in the family and let me tell you, all that matters is the contract and pension.  Cops could care less about the orders they are given to follow and agree, cops have not endeared themselves to the constitution or the people they serve.  Cops have most definitely become outsiders to their communities.

Just go in any station and listen to them refer to us as as civilians......

 

I was a Deputy Sheriff for 7 years in a full service Sheriff's Office where we answered 911 calls and patrolled streets (most Sheriff's in NJ don't answer calls or have a patrol division). I was in an area of about 100,000 locals with 2 million annual visiting tourists to Mt Rushmore every year and another 500,000 to 1 million bikers coming to the Sturgis Rally every August.  We had every crime the major cities have, just not always as often as they have it, but I know what its like to be a cop.  Job #1 is stay safe and go home at the end of the day.  That does not mean you can't treat people with RESPECT.  We had a good relationship with the community because the effort was made to be professional, even when tackling someone and had cuffing them.  I've had people apologise for resisting because I pick them up, dust them off and continue calling them sir as I put them in the back seat for that trip to jail. 

With my experience and training in the profession (I'm no longer in LE, I'm back in the military) I would agree with most of you that the culture within the law enforcement community in NJ is bad.  These cops have the perception as being assholes because they are robotic and impersonal and talk to people like they're 2nd class citizens.  They really have a bad way of projecting themselves and they are either not aware of it or do not care.  I suspect it's a bit of both. 

They probably don't care that people don't like them because they deal with 1% of society but that 1% is always the bad people.  It's easy to get into your mind that "everyone is a criminal" because everyone you deal with is a criminal.  After a while, if 100% of the people you deal with are criminals, you think 100% of society is that way and you start treating them that way.

What they probably are not aware of is the fact that a lot of citizens already have a disdain for the government as a whole because we are over-taxed, over-regulated and are sick to death of crooked politicians at every level from local school boards all the way up to the Governor.  Cops are part of the same government so their image is affected by that as well.

I'll end this here since its really off topic for the thread title.

 

   

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2 hours ago, revenger said:

sept 5th,  anything?    

I think we might need to be patient. This is probably the biggest case of this judges career. No matter what he decides, the other side will appeal to the 3rd Circuit. 

There is an excellent chance that whatever he does will be part of the record on a case that will be heard by the Supreme Court. 

He isn’t just going to bang out an answer. He is going to do his homework, research case law and dot every “I” and cross every “t”. 

Don’t be shocked if we wait a while for this.

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On 8/31/2018 at 0:04 AM, Malice4you said:

The parties are scheduled to submit closing briefs on the injunction motion on September 4, followed by telephonic oral argument on September 6.

From the email above. I wouldn’t expect to hear anything until tomorrow or later. 

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34 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

What do you mean "do nothing"?

Aren't you taking your 15 rounders to the range now?

 

The law is kind of vague. While you have 6 months to get rid of them, you aren’t allowed to transport them. In December, I guess they just need to magically disappear. 

A range my friend goes to sent an email around saying “no more 15 round mags”, but I assume most places are taking more of a “don’t ask don’t tell” approach for now. 

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I stopped at Cabelas in Maine yesterday on the way back from a Maine vacation. I have points to burn so I stopped in and was turned down for a Ruger semi .22 rifle. It has a 15 round mag and we’re already on their restricted list. 

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so from the day the law was signed until today or until it goes into effect how many of our legally purchased and owned magazines have been used by us ( law abiding citizens) to COMMIT crimes?    How many kids have been mowed down in homerooms across the state ?     One would think that if these devices are as bad as the enemy says wouldn't one think they would have been removed from our hands a long time ago rather than allow us to handle them.   this kind of shows that their law is only punitive for us republicans, constitutionalists , origanalists , patriots or what ever you wish to be called.      

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I was gonna put quote marks around that part, but was TRYING to keep calm, didn't want to start ranting. Getting more and more P.O.ed every week with what the "people in charge here" are doing to what used to be a great place to live. (and there I go,,,,,,,rant truncated)

Thank YOU for adding the proper emphasis to it for me.

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On 9/5/2018 at 2:27 PM, revenger said:

so from the day the law was signed until today or until it goes into effect how many of our legally purchased and owned magazines have been used by us ( law abiding citizens) to COMMIT crimes?    How many kids have been mowed down in homerooms across the state ?     One would think that if these devices are as bad as the enemy says wouldn't one think they would have been removed from our hands a long time ago rather than allow us to handle them.   this kind of shows that their law is only punitive for us republicans, constitutionalists , origanalists , patriots or what ever you wish to be called.      

It's death by 1000 cuts. Look at CA, they are constantly introducing firearm bills. There is no end in sight because the end game has always been to legislate the 2A out of existence. In dark rooms any of these guys would admit their preference, no gun ownership by private citizens. Everything they do is reasonable and for the children, same tropes, same playbook, different day.

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