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Range 129

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1 hour ago, Darrenf said:

I wasn't there on Black Friday Rosey, so I can't comment on what occurred that day.  i will say that I went back today, and it couldn't have gone much worse.  When they went to inspect everything this time, i took all the gun cases and ammo out of my range bag, and also asked to speak with the owner.  Someone ran and got him, and I asked him if this is going to happen every time, even for regulars.  is there some sort of system they have in place to make this less of a hassle in the future?  His response was that this was a corporate decision to insure my safety.  I replied that i agree safety is paramount, but no other range I have ever been to has done anything even close to this and that they have perfect safety records.  I was again told it was a corporate decision (I thought you were the owner).  It was obvious I would get no where, so I just went to shoot.  When I was finished shooting I came back out into the staging area and as I did that the owner was walking back in.  I told him "look, I'm not trying to be an asshole, but you have to understand that here in NJ us gunowners are treated as second class citizens, and ranges are looked at as a sort of a refuge.  We don't expect to have to pay a private individual who then shows less trust in us than even the state does.  He replied that because NJ is so messed up, this procedure can help when new people come in to see how rigid everything is, and develop their trust in the range. I said I agree it could be helpful for newbies, but you have to understand that seasoned shooters and 2A advocates, the people likely to bring the newbies into your range see this as invasive at the least. I also told him that when I stopped in the first time while my guns were being inspected, another employee asked "Is that a 10 round magazine?".  I told the owner, so now you guys are law enforcement too?  That's when another employee chimed in with "The reason I asked that question is to educate people who might not know the law"  I told him, first it wasn't you that asked the question and if that's the case then phrasing is important.  He replied "well I deal in absolutes". ( I almost laughed out loud that someone would say something so stupid, my thought was that this guy must love the Star Wars Prequels, LMAO) I again said that education is admirable but phrasing is important.  Asking someone if that is a 10 round mag isn't helpful, and I was about to tell him a better way to phrase the question but he wasn't interested. He cut me off to repeat that he deals in absolutes. LOL  I said, look, I am trying to help you here by telling you what your consumer would hope to see.  i forgot what he said but he cut me off again.  I said this is so disappointing, I've been looking forward to this range opening for almost 2 years, been telling everyone about it, let my membership at Shooters lapse, and this is the treatment they dispense.  You have a customer who is trying to tell you what they would like to see but you aren't listening.  He interjected that he is listening to which I cut him off and raised my voice a bit now and said, yes, you're listening, that's why you keep cutting me off.  Well done.  At this point I was exiting the room and told the owner, that I hope they have a meeting to get this righted soon.  I'm not optimistic, which is sad, because it's a beautiful local facility, and I'd love to see it thrive, but if this is how they plan on treating customers, they won't be in business long.  

Thanks for TOFTT

( taking one for the team)

nope... nada.. hope this range does well without our patronage. Period 

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12 hours ago, diamondd817 said:

I've bought a DPMS rifle from you. One of the best buying experiences I've had in NJ. The distance between us is the limiting factor 

I know Dave - just to the opportunity to put emphasis on our ever so popular "No Look Inside the Bag" policy.........

Lol

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1 hour ago, Darrenf said:

That would be good, the more communication the better.  The conversations in person felt very confrontational, and that isn't going to help anybody.

Well I'm thankful for YOUR communication, that's for sure!  I appreciate your AAR.  I'm saddened that Nazi "inspection" tactics & failure to comprehend the meaning of "A Shooter of KNOWN ABILITY" are displayed by this organization.  It's almost as if the management had to promise this in order to get the zoning approved (now where do ya suppose I came up with THAT one, eh--see Ramsey range thread--)? 

Are LEO's put thru this meat grinder or are they getting their asses kissed?  More Cops have ND's than anyone else after-all...  FWIW I'm not anti-Cop.  Far from it.  I run a Police Practical Pistol League at the private club i belong to. 

In today's world, Casino's in AC know how many times you flushed the toilet in yer room.  Ranges, thru the use of electronic ID cards, know what type member level you are, how many classes you took, which ones you passed, what your NRA ratings are (if any), how many national rankings you have (USPSA, IDPA, NRA Double Distinguished Expert, etc.), how much ammo you've bought & how many rental guns you've rented, SO WHY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH DO THEY NEED TO HASSLE SHOOTERS OF KNOWN ABILITY?? 

If I can hunt pheasants with a 10 ga. SxS percussion muzzy while working it out of a Possibles Bag, do I really need some kid that's still wet behind the ears search my bag?  My dad fought the Nazi's so I wouldn't have to put up with this sorta SH!T!  

And yes, I do hunt with a SxS muzzy, lol!

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1 minute ago, Smokin .50 said:

Well I'm thankful for YOUR communication, that's for sure!  I appreciate your AAR.  I'm saddened that Nazi "inspection" tactics & failure to comprehend the meaning of "A Shooter of KNOWN ABILITY" are displayed by this organization.  It's almost as if the management had to promise this in order to get the zoning approved (now where do ya suppose I came up with THAT one, eh--see Ramsey range thread--)? 

Are LEO's put thru this meat grinder or are they getting their asses kissed?  More Cops have ND's than anyone else after-all...  FWIW I'm not anti-Cop.  Far from it.  I run a Police Practical Pistol League at the private club i belong to. 

In today's world, Casino's in AC know how many times you flushed the toilet in yer room.  Ranges, thru the use of electronic ID cards, know what type member level you are, how many classes you took, which ones you passed, what your NRA ratings are (if any), how many national rankings you have (USPSA, IDPA, NRA Double Distinguished Expert, etc.), how much ammo you've bought & how many rental guns you've rented, SO WHY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH DO THEY NEED TO HASSLE SHOOTERS OF KNOWN ABILITY?? 

If I can hunt pheasants with a 10 ga. SxS percussion muzzy while working it out of a Possibles Bag, do I really need some kid that's still wet behind the ears search my bag?  My dad fought the Nazi's so I wouldn't have to put up with this sorta SH!T!  

And yes, I do hunt with a SxS muzzy, lol!

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To be fair they know nothing of my ability yet, and I wouldn't say I have any great ability anyway.  But I do follow the rules and the law and they should have some system in place for verified range goers so that we can avoid this hassle.  i would be at that range twice a week easily, I have literally 30+ new shooters anxious to get out there with me and be on their way to gun ownership, but at the moment i cannot recommend this range at all.     I'm hoping they engage us here, and even if they are unable to change this policy, at least explain it in a better way than "it's for your safety".

 

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3 minutes ago, Darrenf said:

To be fair they know nothing of my ability yet, and I wouldn't say I have any great ability anyway.  But I do follow the rules and the law and they should have some system in place for verified range goers so that we can avoid this hassle.  i would be at that range twice a week easily, I have literally 30+ new shooters anxious to get out there with me and be on their way to gun ownership, but at the moment i cannot recommend this range at all.     I'm hoping they engage us here, and even if they are unable to change this policy, at least explain it in a better way than "it's for your safety".

 

Points taken.  "Great ability" isn't needed, just being AWARE of what's going on around you & making sure all yer rounds miss the walls, floors & ceiling is all that's really needed :) .  A question on a member application asking what ranges you've shot at, which guns do you shoot most often & how long you've been shooting would be sufficient to warrant the de-Nazification I would think?  It's not rocket science after-all!

I'm going to call them tomorrow to see if they've figured-out WHEN it would be convenient for them to have me (US).

Thanks again Darren!

Rosey

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Just now, Smokin .50 said:

Points taken.  "Great ability" isn't needed, just being AWARE of what's going on around you & making sure all yer rounds miss the walls, floors & ceiling is all that's really needed :) .  A question on a member application asking what ranges you've shot at, which guns do you shoot most often & how long you've been shooting would be sufficient to warrant the de-Nazification I would think?  It's not rocket science after-all!

I'm going to call them tomorrow to see if they've figured-out WHEN it would be convenient for them to have me (US).

Thanks again Darren!

Rosey

Anyone can write anything they want on the form, so I wouldn't expect them to trust that.  The application actually does ask how often you shoot and to self assess your ability.  My wife was very excited about trying to start a SAW chapter there, so I hope they get this worked out.  Good luck Rosey!

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On 11/28/2018 at 11:31 AM, Maksim said:

Ray Ray,

The safety video is required by insurance carriers and I have zero issues with it for public ranges, you do it once and that's it.  Even here in PA they have them, but get this... some ranges even charge a "one time fee" for the safety video.

Rental and ID is once again insurance and I don't see issues with it.

Ammunition regulations I understand but don't agree with.  (in the case of reloaded ammo).  If a round go kaboom, only the shooter is likely to get seriously hurt.  steel core bullets however I do understand as it does hurt the backstop and damages it prematurely.

The bag inspections however are completely over the line.

Maybe it's because I am old school.  Maybe it's because I am an adult and I don't need a babysitter.  Maybe it's because I am used to walking into the range, paying, and then going to shoot.  No ROs watching my every move.  No bag checks.  No magazine inspections.  No safety videos.  No ID checks.  No liability signitures.  No ammunition searches.

Remember those days @GRIZ@Old School@Smokin .50!

And guess what gentlemen, nobody got shot.  Nobody got hurt.  Nobody bothered nobody.  Now, we treat everyone like kids.  

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28 minutes ago, Ray Ray said:

Maybe it's because I am old school.  Maybe it's because  am an adult and I don't need a babysitter.  Maybe it's because I am used to walking into the range, paying, and then going to shoot.  No ROs watching my every move.  No bag checks.  No magazine inspections.  No safety videos.  No ID checks.  No liability signitures.  No ammunition searches.

Remember those days @GRIZ@Old School@Smokin .50!

And guess what gentlemen, nobody got shot.  Nobody got hurt.  Nobody bothered nobody.  Now, we treat everyone like kids.  

I damn well remember those days!  I remember my High School Graphic Arts Teacher bringing US NAVY .38 Spl. TRACER ammo from his Carrier to the school & giving it to me during class and telling me to "go put it in yer locker & make sure to take it home today".  I also remember "LIGHTIN'-UP" Rays range with those TRACERS & how much fun it was!  Hell the R-O called a CEASE-FIRE & ran over to me to check it out.  Told me it's NOT allowed, then asked if HE could try some, lol!

Yeah, I'm THAT old...... 

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This is a disappointing thread to read.

Hopefully much of the behavior is due to the fact that the range is brand new and they're still feeling things out.

I haven't been to a brand new range, but I use my first experience at Gun For Hire as my measuring stick since it was relatively new when I went there.

I was alone so I gave them my FID and Drivers License.  I paid, went to my port and started shooting.  The only interaction I had with the RO was when he asked me about my Keltec Sub 2000.  It was folded when I took it out of the case so when he saw a barrel he thought he was getting swept until he realized what it was.  He hadn't seen one in person before so he asked me a couple of quick questions, thanked me, and let me get back to shooting.  They never checked ammo, magazines, range bag, etc.

Pretty much the same every time I go there.

I hope Reloaderz will follow that lead and NOT be another Range 129.

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16 minutes ago, 124gr9mm said:

They never checked ammo, magazines, range bag, etc.

This has been my experience at Shooters numerous times. The ONLY question they ask, when seeing that I'm carrying rifle cases, is what caliber they are. Then they leave us alone.

That's it. I'm sort of surprised that they don't even inquire about mags or at least have signage up reminding people about the new mag laws.

Range 129 needs to pay a visit to Shooters and learn some things.

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I'm not going to comment on whether or not all of my firearms were legal during my NJ residency.  But if I did have some guns that had features that were on some sort of list, I sure as hell wasn't stupid enough to bring that gun to a public range.

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7 minutes ago, vjf915 said:

I'm not going to comment on whether or not all of my firearms were legal during my NJ residency.  But if I did have some guns that had features that were on some sort of list, I sure as hell wasn't stupid enough to bring that gun to a public range.

Yeah, that's what EFGA was for...........

So what's the statute of limitations for NJ firearm laws? I'm asking for a, um, ahhhhhh, a friend. 

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I think a lot of it has to do with the scrutiny they are under. The police station is within walking distance so I wouldn't be surprised if they get a lot of random visits early on. The permits took forever to get, though the owner said the powers that be were more concerned about them selling guns than having the range. Maybe it's because I brought in a bolt action with a 5 round mag but my "inspection" was extremely quick.

I'll probably go Saturday morning now that I have a mat to lay on and shoot some prone.

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On 11/28/2018 at 3:06 PM, Smokin .50 said:

Well I'm thankful for YOUR communication, that's for sure!  I appreciate your AAR.  I'm saddened that Nazi "inspection" tactics & failure to comprehend the meaning of "A Shooter of KNOWN ABILITY" are displayed by this organization.  It's almost as if the management had to promise this in order to get the zoning approved (now where do ya suppose I came up with THAT one, eh--see Ramsey range thread--)? 

Are LEO's put thru this meat grinder or are they getting their asses kissed?  More Cops have ND's than anyone else after-all...  FWIW I'm not anti-Cop.  Far from it.  I run a Police Practical Pistol League at the private club i belong to. 

In today's world, Casino's in AC know how many times you flushed the toilet in yer room.  Ranges, thru the use of electronic ID cards, know what type member level you are, how many classes you took, which ones you passed, what your NRA ratings are (if any), how many national rankings you have (USPSA, IDPA, NRA Double Distinguished Expert, etc.), how much ammo you've bought & how many rental guns you've rented, SO WHY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH DO THEY NEED TO HASSLE SHOOTERS OF KNOWN ABILITY?? 

If I can hunt pheasants with a 10 ga. SxS percussion muzzy while working it out of a Possibles Bag, do I really need some kid that's still wet behind the ears search my bag?  My dad fought the Nazi's so I wouldn't have to put up with this sorta SH!T!  

And yes, I do hunt with a SxS muzzy, lol!

Image may contain: 1 person, standing, tree, outdoor and nature

you shouldn't have to qualify if you are pro or anti cop, that's the problem with people here.  Family of blue here but I'll be the first go after a bad cop or a cop acting to disgrace the profession.

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2 hours ago, myhatinthering said:

you shouldn't have to qualify if you are pro or anti cop, that's the problem with people here.  Family of blue here but I'll be the first go after a bad cop or a cop acting to disgrace the profession.

You're right of course.  It's just that so many here on both sides are overtly "touchy" about the subject. I appreciate your family's service & your principles as stated above.  The reason I brought it up (the ass-kissing & potential non-inspection) is that some ranges (like 129) have a multi-tier pricing structure giving discounts and SOME of those venues treat the citizenry as 2nd Class citizens.  A real "Class Operation" makes everyone feel welcome regardless of their haircut style.  Perhaps I could have used better phrasing to make my point, but I think you get my drift.  In any event, I don't want to derail my main point, as stated.

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13 minutes ago, Smokin .50 said:

You're right of course.  It's just that so many here on both sides are overtly "touchy" about the subject. I appreciate your family's service & your principles as stated above.  The reason I brought it up (the ass-kissing & potential non-inspection) is that some ranges (like 129) have a multi-tier pricing structure giving discounts and SOME of those venues treat the citizenry as 2nd Class citizens.  A real "Class Operation" makes everyone feel welcome regardless of their haircut style.  Perhaps I could have used better phrasing to make my point, but I think you get my drift.  In any event, I don't want to derail my main point, as stated.

Service?  that mode of thinking needs changing.  its a job, well paid, great benefits and nothing more.

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5 minutes ago, myhatinthering said:

Service?  that mode of thinking needs changing.  its a job, well paid, great benefits and nothing more.

Actually being a blue family.. it’s a job , and god bless anyone that wants to do it moving forward... because academia and msm hate you.

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Just shared a link to this discussion here to get their comment and to see what can be done.
Want them to give their view point, but more importantly figure out whether they will stick to this or not. 

How did you reach out to them, and have you heard anything back?


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6 minutes ago, Darrenf said:


How did you reach out to them, and have you heard anything back?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I don’t wanna say the word is on the street about the administration of this forum... but the word word is on the street 

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40 minutes ago, Zeke said:

Actually being a blue family.. it’s a job , and god bless anyone that wants to do it moving forward... because academia and msm hate you.

Its on blue for this hatred.  way too many shitheads wear a badge and corrupting the profession.

Far too much of a divide and special treatment hasvrun its course.  time to clean its ranks

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19 minutes ago, myhatinthering said:

Its on blue for this hatred.  way too many shitheads wear a badge and corrupting the profession.

Far too much of a divide and special treatment hasvrun its course.  time to clean its ranks

I’ve met fiddy.. only 1 bad

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