babagan00sh 2 Posted September 6, 2018 My wife's looking to get a handgun and I'm helping out with the details. I know shotguns / trapshooting, but keep hearing horror stories about handguns and the law. Is there a page here or somewhere else that summarizes what we want to be sure to do / don't do when traveling with the handgun to go to a range? Do you need your FID on you? In the trunk, 'locked', right? Is a cable lock through the chamber, etc good enough? She has an SUV. WIl that work at all? or my sedan with a trunk is needed? Ammo in the passenger compartment, right? sitting in a bag? Or locked in another box? No deviations in travel, right? I saw the post about the gun range opening in Union and the lighthearted joke about stopping at Harbor freight... not really a joke, right? Can't even do that? Stop to use the bathroom on the way home? Stop to eat? Stop to pick up a sandwich with someone staying in the car and then eating while driving? Someone said 'I'm a member of another range that reports... so i'm covered I think I remember something about an exemption to no deviations? Anything else to know? Does anyone subscribe to the legal services that would help in these situations if you make a mistake? Which do you recommend? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted September 6, 2018 1. In the locked trunk is suffcient. If you want to use the cable lock go ahead. If you have a pickup or something like that a locked case is needed. A cable lock or trigger lock might suffice but a locked case is the best idea IMO. 2. Ammo can be anywhere you want in NJ. Out of sight is suggested. 3. Reasonable deviations are permitted. You can stop for gas, restroom, refreshments, pick up or discharge passengers, etc. You don't have to eat while driving. Here is the link for the NJ AGs guidelines on reasonable deviation, https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.state.nj.us/oag/dcj/agguide/transporting-firearms_guide.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwio_YPn3KXdAhVng-AKHQ93CYEQFjAAegQIAhAB&usg=AOvVaw2waJkjPdzd-JHz-hycvjzd 4. You do not need your FID or copy of P2P with you. If you are questioned by a LEO they can look up if you have a FID. You may want to carry it to save them the bother. It's not required though. 5. There are a variety of services for gun owners. You have to read what they offer and judge what's best for you. I got US Lawshield with national coverage. They cover legal expenses for their attorney from the start for criminal and civil actions. Some services will only reimburse you if you're found not guilty. If you don't conceal carry your coverage should be less. If you want coverage to pay for damages from civil suits that's another matter. You have to determine what fits your needs. 6. Don't consent to search. If the LEO has probable cause to search they can search (dependent on jurisdiction) or get a warrant. This is a 4th Amendment right. Don't give it away. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted September 6, 2018 Keep in mind the requirements for the Firearm Owners Protection Act for interstate travel are a bit different. You can find this on NJSP.org. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
babagan00sh 2 Posted September 6, 2018 GRIZ - that link to the AG's letter talks about 'firearms'. If I;m not mistaken / I think I saw on other threads here: driving around with an (unloaded) rifle / shotgun routinely is OK. It's handguns that have all the rules? But that letter doesn't seem to make the distinction of long guns vs. handguns. and just talks of firearms and the allowed deviation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted September 6, 2018 14 minutes ago, babagan00sh said: GRIZ - that link to the AG's letter talks about 'firearms'. If I;m not mistaken / I think I saw on other threads here: driving around with an (unloaded) rifle / shotgun routinely is OK. It's handguns that have all the rules? But that letter doesn't seem to make the distinction of long guns vs. handguns. and just talks of firearms and the allowed deviation. "They" don't want people riding around with shotguns and rifles, so "they" will never say it is lawful to do. 3 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted September 6, 2018 31 minutes ago, babagan00sh said: GRIZ - that link to the AG's letter talks about 'firearms'. If I;m not mistaken / I think I saw on other threads here: driving around with an (unloaded) rifle / shotgun routinely is OK. It's handguns that have all the rules? But that letter doesn't seem to make the distinction of long guns vs. handguns. and just talks of firearms and the allowed deviation. If you have a FID reasonable deviation doesn't apply for long guns. You can ride around with long guns in your trunk all you want. See @PK90 post above. If you don't have an FID reasonable deviation applies. Unless you have a carry permit reasonable deviation always applies if you're transporting handguns. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bjjdad 0 Posted January 17, 2019 On 9/6/2018 at 2:22 PM, GRIZ said: If you have a FID reasonable deviation doesn't apply for long guns. You can ride around with long guns in your trunk all you want. See @PK90 post above. If you don't have an FID reasonable deviation applies. Unless you have a carry permit reasonable deviation always applies if you're transporting handguns. Dear Griz, I am a newbie. Trying to find an answer concerning transportation. My wife, kids, and I routinely travel two hours south (still in NJ) to visit my sister and brother in law at the jersey shore. We usually stay over night and come back the next day. My brother in law is a shooter and retired LEO. He is a member of his local range. My question is: is it legal for me to bring one or both of my handguns (recently purchased in NJ with FID care and purchaser permits) so that i can visit his range while I'm there for the weekend? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leahcim 673 Posted January 18, 2019 N.J.S.A. 2C:39-6: Firearms must be contained in: A closed and fastened case. A gunbox. A securely tied package, or. Locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported. Within the state of NJ, no need to lock anything. But do be careful of having anything in plain site, as it could lead to a warrant-less "safety" search (https://www.thenewspaper.com/news/41/4110.asp): "Reininger believes he was targeted because of his Texas license plates. Officer Wester then looked inside the SUV with his flashlight noticed two nylon cases in the back seat. Once backup arrived, Officer Wester asked for consent to search the vehicle, but Reininger said no. Officer Wester then opened up the vehicle to search the cases "for safety reasons" any way. Reininger was arrested." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted January 18, 2019 2 hours ago, bjjdad said: Dear Griz, I am a newbie. Trying to find an answer concerning transportation. My wife, kids, and I routinely travel two hours south (still in NJ) to visit my sister and brother in law at the jersey shore. We usually stay over night and come back the next day. My brother in law is a shooter and retired LEO. He is a member of his local range. My question is: is it legal for me to bring one or both of my handguns (recently purchased in NJ with FID care and purchaser permits) so that i can visit his range while I'm there for the weekend? I'd say you should be okay with that. Thousands of people do things like that on a regular basis and have had no problems. Others will tell you that you will be thrown in the deepest depths of Trenton State Prison. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Golf battery 1,222 Posted January 18, 2019 No. He wants to stay at his bil’s house with the pistols. Thats not an exempt location. You can only travel to and from exempt locations with your pistol. Your bil’s house is none of the such 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted January 18, 2019 22 minutes ago, Golf battery said: No. He wants to stay at his bil’s house with the pistols. Thats not an exempt location. You can only travel to and from exempt locations with your pistol. Your bil’s house is none of the such You are correct. However, as I said people have been doing this for years with no problem. Reasonable deviations include picking up or dropping off. I'd like to see a prosecutor running with this. He would look horrible. A guy with his wife and kids going to the range with a retired LEO. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Golf battery 1,222 Posted January 18, 2019 I hear ya. Just needed to clarify the law to this gent. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniper 6,372 Posted January 18, 2019 31 minutes ago, Golf battery said: No. He wants to stay at his bil’s house with the pistols. Thats not an exempt location. You can only travel to and from exempt locations with your pistol. Your bil’s house is none of the such I agree with this. At first I figured no problem. But then thinking further, and the laws in the state, the stop at the BIL house is a deviation. That would be an area of concern. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bjjdad 0 Posted January 18, 2019 12 hours ago, Golf battery said: No. He wants to stay at his bil’s house with the pistols. Thats not an exempt location. You can only travel to and from exempt locations with your pistol. Your bil’s house is none of the such Thank you very much for the quick reply. Also to the other guys. I read the rules the same way and despite what might be common/practical, i'll follow these strictly. Are there any rules that restrict choice of range? For instance, I have a handful close by but in order to train with an experienced shooter, I might want to meet my brother in law at a range 1/2 way between our respective residences. I assume this would be fine assuming I stayed within the reasonable deviation standards. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniper 6,372 Posted January 18, 2019 13 minutes ago, bjjdad said: For instance, I have a handful close by but in order to train with an experienced shooter, I might want to meet my brother in law at a range 1/2 way between our respective residences. I assume this would be fine assuming I stayed within the reasonable deviation standards. If you can "prove" your destination is a range, no matter where it is, you'll be fine. Some guys have said, when they travel to PA with the firearms, they enter in a local range in their GPS near where they are going. In the case they get stopped along the way, they'll just point out that they're heading to the range, even though they passed a few already. Also, one other recommendation. Keep a copy of the COE form in your bag you received for the handguns with you. This is just another helpful point if you ever get questioned about ownership of them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted January 18, 2019 11 minutes ago, bjjdad said: Thank you very much for the quick reply. Also to the other guys. I read the rules the same way and despite what might be common/practical, i'll follow these strictly. Are there any rules that restrict choice of range? For instance, I have a handful close by but in order to train with an experienced shooter, I might want to meet my brother in law at a range 1/2 way between our respective residences. I assume this would be fine assuming I stayed within the reasonable deviation standards. You can go to any range you want. Live in Sussex County and go to a range in Cape May. You can stop to eat, get gas, use the bathroom, pickup and discharge passengers, and a multitude of other other things listed in the memo from the AG's office. These were things people did for years before the AG said it was okay. I never heard of anyone being arrested for unreasonable deviations. I've asked several times for people to find me one but no one responded. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniper 6,372 Posted January 18, 2019 3 minutes ago, GRIZ said: I never heard of anyone being arrested for unreasonable deviations. I've asked several times for people to find me one but no one responded. Those are probably the same guys who got busted for having 15+ round mags. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted January 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, Sniper said: Those are probably the same guys who got busted for having 15+ round mags. Other than the guys arrested for >15 round magazines because they were shooting at someone running away who else has been arrested for >15 round magazines? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bjjdad 0 Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, Sniper said: If you can "prove" your destination is a range, no matter where it is, you'll be fine. Some guys have said, when they travel to PA with the firearms, they enter in a local range in their GPS near where they are going. In the case they get stopped along the way, they'll just point out that they're heading to the range, even though they passed a few already. Also, one other recommendation. Keep a copy of the COE form in your bag you received for the handguns with you. This is just another helpful point if you ever get questioned about ownership of them. Thanks. COE do you mean the carbon copy of the handgun purchaser permit? Any and all other tips are very welcomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weekend_junkie 129 Posted January 18, 2019 This is overboard but I wanted to tinker with something and ended up making these two cases. Keeps things low profile. 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GRIZ 3,365 Posted January 18, 2019 18 minutes ago, weekend_junkie said: This is overboard but I wanted to tinker with something and ended up making these two cases. Keeps things low profile. Not a bad idea. Makes sense to keep things low profile. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sniper 6,372 Posted January 18, 2019 1 hour ago, bjjdad said: Thanks. COE do you mean the carbon copy of the handgun purchaser permit? It's the Certificate of Eligibility form you received along with the carbon copy. It will be a full sheet form with the serial number and dealer info on it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
myhatinthering 462 Posted January 18, 2019 50 minutes ago, weekend_junkie said: This is overboard but I wanted to tinker with something and ended up making these two cases. Keeps things low profile. great idea actually 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
siderman 1,131 Posted January 18, 2019 2 hours ago, weekend_junkie said: This is overboard but I wanted to tinker with something and ended up making these two cases. Keeps things low profile. Throw some Sam Ash or Guitar Center decals on the car windows for the final touch. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weekend_junkie 129 Posted January 18, 2019 41 minutes ago, siderman said: Throw some Sam Ash or Guitar Center decals on the car windows for the final touch. Now that's an idea I hadn't considered! 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
siderman 1,131 Posted January 18, 2019 16 minutes ago, weekend_junkie said: Now that's an idea I hadn't considered! You're welcome, now give me some hog hunt bacon 1 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
babagan00sh 2 Posted January 19, 2019 Certainly don't mean to take away from your beautiful handiwork, but that's the exact thing Evan Nappen's mentioned at some of his talks. I was trying to find one of his videos on youtube that mentioned that to post here ; ) But yeah, that's what this has come to in NJ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
father-of-three 235 Posted January 19, 2019 8 hours ago, weekend_junkie said: This is overboard but I wanted to tinker with something and ended up making these two cases. Keeps things low profile. And my extra guitar case just got a new lease on life!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites