Jon 264 Posted September 9, 2018 Just now, capt14k said: Open door without a screen door I hope? I would be pretty pissed if cops entered my house if I had my interior front door open to allow cross ventilation. I also assume this was not in an upper middle class town? Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Depends on the factors of the particular incident. I also work in an area with both the richest and poorest people in our state. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted September 9, 2018 Depends on the factors of the particular incident. I also work in an area with both the richest and poorest people in our state. I'm guessing Jersey City or somewhere like that. Millstone Twp NJ in Monmouth County I don't see the State Police entering someone's home because their front door is open without some sort of call going out.Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jon 264 Posted September 9, 2018 Just now, capt14k said: I'm guessing Jersey City or somewhere like that. Millstone Twp NJ in Monmouth County I don't see the State Police entering someone's home because their front door is open without some sort of call going out. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Wealthy areas have lots of nosy neighbors. You'd be shocked at how many times I get called out for a neighbor claiming that the home in question is vacant and currently occupied by an unknown person. Ditto for homeowners who arrive to find an unlocked door and call us.... Only to discover that their family member was in the house. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,634 Posted September 9, 2018 These calls where you clear a structure are generally initiated by either an alarm called in by an alarm company, or a neighbor/passerby/ homeowner calling in unusual occurrence such as an open or unlocked door on their return, or unknown persons in/around the dwelling. It isn’t just - Hey, I am driving down the street and see an open door so I am going to go in the house. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted September 9, 2018 These calls where you clear a structure are generally initiated by either an alarm called in by an alarm company, or a neighbor/passerby/ homeowner calling in unusual occurrence such as an open or unlocked door on their return, or unknown persons in/around the dwelling. It isn’t just - Hey, I am driving down the street and see an open door so I am going to go in the house. Well that is how it read the first time, and even if my neighbor calls or a silent alarm goes off that doesn't give a right to enter my house without ringing my bell and announcing one's self. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 9, 2018 3 hours ago, blksheep said: This is at no one specific... Please take a class with a reputable instructor. Pistol, Rifle, Low-Light...sumtin. Jerk alert (me) If you think you need it sure, otherwise, no. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blksheep 466 Posted September 9, 2018 Everyone needs to take a class. I teach this shit everyday and still make a point to take a class as a student a couple times a year. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Regular Guy 264 Posted September 9, 2018 Interesting conversations in this thread. I have 15 years of military experience and 7 years of law enforcement experience. I have trained with a hand held light, a weapon mounted light, vehicle mounted lights and no light. In my opinion, there are general advantages and disadvantages to all 3, even in a home defense scenario. It's everyone's choice as to which set of advantages and disadvantages they want to live with. Personally, based on my training, combat, and LE experiences I have a weapon light on a handgun, long gun and I have handheld lights in nearly every room of the house because I want to conquer the element of darkness (my handheld lights are more for power-outage/disaster prep since I lose power a lot during storms). Now I understand you can simply turn on a room light but that evens the playing field in that the environment is no longer dark/low light. While this is comfortable for most people, I have a warrior mindset. I don't want an even playing field, I want an advantage. I want mobility and I want to control the light and darkness. Knowing where the light switch is will give you control of the light but it limits mobility because the switch is stationary on the wall. The weapon light has the best advantage because it leaves your other hand free to open doors, manipulate other objects, or put both hands on the gun. It does have disadvantages since any light can give away your position and show what direction you are approaching from because the light points both ways. A light is a tool and just like any tool, you have to understand its capabilities and how to use it. I only saw it mentioned here once or twice but most people severely under-estimate how advantageous it is when someone is disoriented when a bright light is flashed in their eyes for a split second. It disrupts their OODA loop and gives you a huge advantage in the tactical situation. For those who don't know, I'll give a definition of the OODA loop below. OODA stands for Observe, Orient, Decide, Act. Every human does this for every action from picking your nose to shooting a gun. You work through the process and reach the Act stage faster or slower depending on the stimuli to be processed and your familiarity/previous experiences with it. Example: You have to Observe the discomfort of a booger in your nose. You have to Orient yourself to which nostril it's in and which finger you will use to attack it. You Decide to execute the attack and you Act. You've done this your whole life so the process is carried out on nearly a subconscious level. Shooting a gun is the same. You Observe the target, Orient yourself and your gun sights to the target, you Decide to shoot and you Act by pulling the trigger. Takes a few ticks longer than picking a nose. If you get to somewhere between Decide and Act and get a new stimulus to process, especially from your target, it could cause you to need to restart the process. Maybe the target suddenly moved, disappeared behind cover, blinded you with a light, etc. So if they blind you with a light, you have to start over at Observing them again, but now that they've seen you, they may be ahead of you in the process by already Orienting and Deciding to Act on you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SW9racer 262 Posted September 9, 2018 2 hours ago, SW9racer said: Anyone with experience on the Streamlight TLR 7? The model 1 sticks way out past the muzzle. 2 hours ago, Screwball said: Post 85 is a shot of it on my Glock 30S. For reference, it would look similar to a Glock 19. What would you like to know about it? After research, I like the size and specs of the 7 over the 1, for not much more $. Yes the runtime is an hour shorter but it’s not an everyday flashlight. I will be putting it on a railed Beretta 92. Any negatives you encountered, would you pick the 7 again? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Screwball 483 Posted September 9, 2018 After research, I like the size and specs of the 7 over the 1, for not much more $. Yes the runtime is an hour shorter but it’s not an everyday flashlight. I will be putting it on a railed Beretta 92. Any negatives you encountered, would you pick the 7 again?Here is the original thread I posted about the light... current lights should be squared away in regards to the issue I mentioned/recorded on that video.https://www.njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/90329-streamlight-tlr-7-awesome-then-crappy-and-back-to-awesome/Personally, I like the TLR-7. It is a good compact light, and leaps/bounds better than the TLR-3 I used prior. If you do get it, go over to Pistol Forum... as there have been two other keys 3D printed for them (if you have a specific request, you can contact the guy with measurements, and he will develop it if possible).For a full-size pistol, I prefer a larger light. I also prefer the paddle controls. I accept the different controls on the TLR-7 because the light is 500 Lumens, and fits the 30S well (there was talk about different controls being offered, as they are basically a boot held on with screws). Larger lights on full size guns are also easier for holster availability. Makers are starting to support the newer Streamlights, but the TLR-1 is still a standard.I know that the lens being behind the muzzle is what most people look for with shorter lights on full size guns, but I personally don’t worry too much about it. Lights still get dirty. Cleaning isn’t that hard, and people have multiple tips for it.Compact weapon lights usually have a drawback. My TLR-3... it wasn’t that bright, and was a little bulky. The TLR-7 uses different controls... and that is pretty much it. If Streamlight does offer different controls for it... specifically paddles... I’d recommend it across the board. Until then, I still run TLR-1s... with the TLR-7 on my Glock 30S (the TLR-1 does fit on it... but it is a carry gun; size is very IMPORTANT).My TAC-14... TLR-1. My CZ SP-01... TLR-1 (also have holsters made for that combo). My Beretta CX4/PX4, KelTec SUB-2000, Ruger SR1911 (with Recover Tactical grip), S&W M&P Pro (with pressure switch), and .45 D/I AR... all get a TLR-1 if a light is required. Only one that the TLR-7 doesn’t fit is the M&P Compact (it attaches, but trigger guard cants the light). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 10, 2018 1 hour ago, blksheep said: Everyone needs to take a class. I teach this shit everyday and still make a point to take a class as a student a couple times a year. No they don't. If they want to, they should. Everyone took drivers ed, half the people driving today suck at it. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vjf915 456 Posted September 10, 2018 Everyone here is just talking about home defense, but there are many other scenarios that could warrant the use of a firearm where a WML would be advantageous. I live on several acres, where there have been bear and coyote sightings, and my dog has to piss at night. I'm sure as hell going to use one of my guns if my dog gets attacked by a bear or coyote. I have a 1000 lumen light on my AR, and I wish it was brighter for the property that I live on. My wife works at a college. Antifa starts violently protesting there and she has to barricade herself in a room, I'm sure as hell grabbing my rifle and pistol and hauling ass there to get her out. These are a couple hypothetical scenarios where I'd want a bright as hell white light on my gun, and there are countless others that I'm not going to type out, or can't think of at the moment. And for those who say "the military and police have used handheld lights for years, so it must work": "The most dangerous phrase in the language is 'We've always done it this way'." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
blksheep 466 Posted September 10, 2018 27 minutes ago, Ray Ray said: No they don't. If they want to, they should. Everyone took drivers ed, half the people driving today suck at it. Yeah they do. Imagine how many more people would suck at it if they didn't have drivers ed. Or make the argument that ones who went to a professional driving school to learn might be better drivers... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 10, 2018 8 minutes ago, blksheep said: Yeah they do. Imagine how many more people would suck at it if they didn't have drivers ed. Or make the argument that ones who went to a professional driving school to learn might be better drivers... Forced education, nobody wants to learn. If you want to learn, then you would go to class. I wanted to learn to weld, I took a class. I didn't want to be a scientist, they forced me to take it in high school. I am not a scientist, but I do weld. You feel me? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
M4BGRINGO 139 Posted September 10, 2018 4 hours ago, capt14k said: I'm guessing Jersey City or somewhere like that. Millstone Twp NJ in Monmouth County I don't see the State Police entering someone's home because their front door is open without some sort of call going out. Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk There are next to no State Troopers driving through Millstone, unless one of the rappers there is having a major party. Back in my day we did anything we liked, no fear of the po-po showing-up, but if my father got wind of something, then my ass got beat! My parents have three dogs and a Mossberg, they aren't worried about someone entering their house unannounced at any time of the day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted September 10, 2018 Next thing you guys say is that you'll want everybody to take a class in order to carry a firearm. Sent from an undisclosed location via Tapatalk 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 10, 2018 2 hours ago, vjf915 said: I live on several acres, where there have been bear and coyote sightings, and my dog has to piss at night. Lies Several acres in Guam? Bears and Coyotes in Guam? Lies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vjf915 456 Posted September 11, 2018 21 hours ago, Ray Ray said: Lies Several acres in Guam? Bears and Coyotes in Guam? Lies I live in NH now homie. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, vjf915 said: I live in NH now homie. Oh snap! I know where, I had a port call at that Naval Station. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vjf915 456 Posted September 11, 2018 36 minutes ago, Ray Ray said: Oh snap! I know where, I had a port call at that Naval Station. Not there. I've been on terminal leave almost 2 months. My EAOS is actually tomorrow. Living the civilian life now I'm in New London, which is near the VT border. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,634 Posted September 11, 2018 I was at the Sub Base there once to check out the museum. Very cool. I am going to bring my son there this fall I think. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vjf915 456 Posted September 11, 2018 19 hours ago, High Exposure said: I was at the Sub Base there once to check out the museum. Very cool. I am going to bring my son there this fall I think. Are you thinking of New London, CT? I'm in New London, NH. Often confused, but not at all the same place. I spent a couple winter months in New London, CT. Screw that place lol. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
High Exposure 5,634 Posted September 11, 2018 Ah, yes I am. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted September 19, 2018 I just picked up a Streamlight TLR-7 for my home defense pistol. 4 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SW9racer 262 Posted September 21, 2018 This topic also convinced me. Just put a Streamlight TLR-7 on my 92a1. I like the controls on this one. After practicing, it’s much better than a separate hand held flashlight (tried a bit in idpa), or limiting my movements to the wall switches. Still not sold on the strobe feature, I would be nervous enough searching the house with the dog pack barking, without needing to press the buttons in a certain sequence. Yes it’s easy but too many other things would be on my mind, will stick to on/off. 3 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted September 22, 2018 7 hours ago, SW9racer said: Still not sold on the strobe feature, I would be nervous enough searching the house with the dog pack barking, without needing to press the buttons in a certain sequence. Yes it’s easy but too many other things would be on my mind, will stick to on/off. Strobe modes are useless. Either light on or light off. KISS method applies to lights as well. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted September 22, 2018 @tomk62 and @SW9racer I’m curious why the 7? I agree with @Ray Ray I cannot see a benefit to strobe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SW9racer 262 Posted September 22, 2018 Here are my reasons for the 7: New technology, brighter led than the 1 even with a single battery, with 90 minutes run time. Bright white light, does really well eliminating the shadows in the woods behind my yard. Size, it can fit on everything I have without sticking past the muzzle. The width is the same as the slide and doesn’t stick out. The weight is very light, not really noticeable. Controls, I do like how the buttons function, very intuitive. I never had a 1 so can’t compare, but no complaints on this design. The strobe feature can be completely disabled. Simple push for on then push for off, or push and hold for temp on. Push twice for strobe if enabled. If you shop around you can find the 7 for about 100, equal in price so I concentrated on the design and features. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Screwball 483 Posted September 23, 2018 Yea, the TLR-7 really gave Streamlight a foot up in the compact weaponlight market. They previous option was the TLR-3, and while I ran it... the output wasn’t worth the size hanging off the gun. If they did different backplates with different controls, they would knock it out of the park.I actually just got another holster today for my Glock 30S/TLR-7 (White Hat Holsters). It is an OWB holster, but it shares commonality with the IWB holster for my 642-1/LaserMax light... meaning I can take the Kydex off either and swap to the other. I rarely will use OWB, but having both options with those two guns, which was picked up during a Labor Day sale... it wasn’t even a question.In regards to strobes, I’m still playing with them. It isn’t a setup that is a pain to engaged, and Streamlight makes it easily disabled. Personally, I really need to sit down with someone and see how they affect me/them in a setting where it likely would be used. They do give me a headache if I focus on them, so wouldn’t consider that a bad thing if the receiving end gets it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
67gtonut 847 Posted September 23, 2018 This has been a great topic.... made me rethink my choices.... now in market for a Trl-7 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites