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MRE's - Talk to me.

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4 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

Where is @USRifle30Cal to come back and fill in the blanks of what he's planning on doing with the MREs?

 

I think he just threw out the red meat to see what would happen and is now sitting back with a brew and popcorn, watching the show.

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1 minute ago, Scorpio64 said:

I think he just threw out the red meat to see what would happen and is now sitting back with a brew and popcorn, watching the show.

Actually, you were spot on with your assessment of Mountain House, even though Griz didn't think so. I would never put faith on cans for long or short storage, as they can easily spoil and go bad, sometimes with unnoticed dents, and the shelf life is usually around a year on cans. Hell, it's easy now just to throw a few extra cans of beans or soup in the cabinet, then come back what seems like only a few months, only to discover they expired.

True, M.H. needs water, but having to not worry for decades on storage is worth it.

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10 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

True, M.H. needs water, but having to not worry for decades on storage is worth it.

If you don't have water, you don't have survival.  Wherever one plans on spending the zombie apocalypse, there had better be a water source. 

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4 hours ago, RecessedFilter said:

If you served some of their food like the beef stroganoff to someone without telling them what it was, they would think you actually cooked it at home.

This reminds me.  I have to resupply my Mt House stock.  I ate some of my "emergency food".  Sometimes I come home from work completely exhausted and just want something hot that is quick, filling and enjoyable.  Stroganoff, Chili Mac, and Beef Stew are my usuals.

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15 minutes ago, Scorpio64 said:

If you don't have water, you don't have survival.  Wherever one plans on spending the zombie apocalypse, there had better be a water source. 

Yes but if you use MH you need more water.

4 minutes ago, Scorpio64 said:

This reminds me.  I have to resupply my Mt House stock.  I ate some of my "emergency food".  Sometimes I come home from work completely exhausted and just want something hot that is quick, filling and enjoyable.  Stroganoff, Chili Mac, and Beef Stew are my usuals.

Most canned food has 2-3 year shelf life unless you buy stuff that's already been on the shelf for some time.  MH shelf life is really like 7 or 8 years.  All those shelf life figures usually refer to quality not safety.  I'm still alive after eating c rations that were more than a couple of years old in the 60s and 70s.  That was done with ancient canning technology.

If you have no issues rotating your MH stock why do you see issues rotating canned food?  Don't know of anyone making canned stroganoff but you can easily find beef stew and chili mac in cans.

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26 minutes ago, Scorpio64 said:

If you don't have water, you don't have survival.  Wherever one plans on spending the zombie apocalypse, there had better be a water source. 

Good point, you can eat all the cans of beefaroni and chili you want, but without water, you're dead.

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7 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Most canned food has 2-3 year shelf life unless you buy stuff that's already been on the shelf for some time.  MH shelf life is really like 7 or 8 years. 

That's NOT what is stated in their guarantee:

What is the shelf life of your foods?

Our meals in pouches, kits and cans all have a freeze-dried, emergency food industry-leading guaranteed shelf life and Taste Guarantee of 30 years.

How does the shelf life of Mountain House pouches compare to other brands?

We know of no other pouch on the market with Mountain House's 30-year proven shelf life.

We have updated the shelf life on our foods several times over the years because we found the 'Best Used By' printed on our pouches was too conservative. This is why, based on real-world testing, we've moved to a 30-year shelf life on meals in our cans and pouches (excluding novelty items and MCWs).

https://www.mountainhouse.com/m/faqs.html

 

 

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38 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

That's NOT what is stated in their guarantee:

What is the shelf life of your foods?

Our meals in pouches, kits and cans all have a freeze-dried, emergency food industry-leading guaranteed shelf life and Taste Guarantee of 30 years.

How does the shelf life of Mountain House pouches compare to other brands?

We know of no other pouch on the market with Mountain House's 30-year proven shelf life.

We have updated the shelf life on our foods several times over the years because we found the 'Best Used By' printed on our pouches was too conservative. This is why, based on real-world testing, we've moved to a 30-year shelf life on meals in our cans and pouches (excluding novelty items and MCWs).

https://www.mountainhouse.com/m/faqs.html

 

 

Okay, let me know what it tastes like in 7 or 8 years.

If you're happy with MH and willing to pay their prices go for it.  I'm not convinced of all the virtues of MH for the price.

I'm still wondering why you have no issue rotating your MH stock but see cans as a big problem.

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33 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

Good point, you can eat all the cans of beefaroni and chili you want, but without water, you're dead.

To be fair, and also to demonstrate that I do not have a "confirmation bias", canned foods do contain water.  In a situation where there is no water, it may be your only source.  I, however, have taken the water issue seriously and, in addition to a stock of glass bottled water, I've made plans for filtration and purification.

I put a lot of research into this subject about a year and a half ago.  I talked with preppers, military, campers and folks who live up in the mountains and dont come back down for months.  The one thing each had in common was two thumbs up for Mt House foods.

This thread is about MREs, so I'm sticking to that, but boy, we could go on and on and on about long term food storage..

 

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4 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I'm still wondering why you have no issue rotating your MH stock but see cans as a big problem.

Griz, I didn't buy the Mt House food to eat on a regular basis, at least that was not the plan.  But the food is so good and easy to prepare it sorta worked out that way. 

Another point.  You really don't have to rotate stock on food that's good for 30 years.  Just replace what has been used.  Think of it as you tapped into your "just in case" ammo supply, and topped it off the next time a good sale popped up.

It will prolly be a while before we see each other again at a shotgun shoot.  The next shoot though, I'll hit you up with a couple pouches and you can be the judge.

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1 hour ago, GRIZ said:

Okay, let me know what it tastes like in 7 or 8 years.

Why would a package change that was vacuum sealed and unopened after 7 or 8 years? Unlike your short term canned food, there's no moisture in the pouch, so it won't go bad, as long as it's stored in the right temperature area.

1 hour ago, GRIZ said:

I'm still wondering why you have no issue rotating your MH stock but see cans as a big problem.

How about because you buy MH for longer term storage. Who wants to worry and deal with cans every few months to see if they're expired. We have enough crap to deal with in the week, why have to spend extra time to see if the Chef Boyardee has gone bad?

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2 hours ago, GRIZ said:

Most canned food has 2-3 year shelf life

 

1 hour ago, GRIZ said:

If you're happy with MH and willing to pay their prices go for it.  I'm not convinced of all the virtues of MH for the price.

OK, let's do some math: a can of Chef Boyardee meat ravioli is $1.50 at Walmart, let's say it's shelf life is safely 2 years (I'm actually going to check the next time I'm in Walmart). So in a ten year period, you would have to rotate it out 5 times, for a total cost of $7.50 over 10 years.

A double serving pouch of MH spaghetti and meat sauce is $7.00., which claims to have a 30 year shelf life. But, let's say you play it safe, and rotate out at 10 years, which still gives a very safe window.

Which one costs you more?

(and we won't touch on the the extra attention, monitoring and labor to swap out cans every two years).

 

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1 hour ago, Sniper22 said:

 

OK, let's do some math: a can of Chef Boyardee meat ravioli is $1.50 at Walmart, let's say it's shelf life is safely 2 years (I'm actually going to check the next time I'm in Walmart). So in a ten year period, you would have to rotate it out 5 times, for a total cost of $7.50 over 10 years.

A double serving pouch of MH spaghetti and meat sauce is $7.00., which claims to have a 30 year shelf life. But, let's say you play it safe, and rotate out at 10 years, which still gives a very safe window.

Which one costs you more?

(and we won't touch on the the extra attention, monitoring and labor to swap out cans every two years).

 

Your math works if you're throwing out the cans.  You're overlooking the part that you can eat that ravioli 5 times for 7.50 with cans.  One time for 7.00 with MH.  Thats using your math.  Even if 3 of the cans went bad it's still only costing you 3.75 vs 7.00 a serving.

BTW bought some BeefaronI with a 2 yr expiry date for $1 a can recently.

I still can't see what constitutes all the "extra attention,  monitoring, and labor" you're talking about.  This is using stuff before expiration date not making rocket fuel or splitting an atom.  If you're buying freshly canned food you're not rotating it "every few months".

I've eaten MH.  Its good but not so good to justify the price.  If weight is a factor and you're sure to have good tasting water that's fine.  If you want to spend your money that way fine.  Don't try to convince people they will die horrible deaths if they rely on canned food.

Necessity is the mother of invention.  Soldiers and marines who had to live on c rations and mres answered the call.  C ration and more cookbooks,

http://david.brubakers.us/cookbook/rationcookbooks.html

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46 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Your math works if you're throwing out the cans.  You're overlooking the part that you can eat that ravioli 5 times for 7.50 with cans. 

That's only if you catch it by the expiration date and it doesn't go bad. If not, you're throwing it out. I also did the math based on 10 year shelf life, not the 30 that MH guarantees. Any additional years past 10, is a bigger savings. What if you go 20?

48 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I still can't see what constitutes all the "extra attention,  monitoring, and labor" you're talking about. This is using stuff before expiration date not making rocket fuel or splitting an atom.

Because we're talking about emergency food, which is something a normal person doesn't pay attention to weekly or probably monthly.

50 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If you're buying freshly canned food you're not rotating it "every few months".

Maybe that's what you do, but some of us here can afford to eat fresh food all the time, so we wouldn't be buying beefaroni regularly as our normal meal, and rotating our normal weekly dinner. Once again, this thread is about emergency rations that are put away, not our weekly diet. However, your weekly diet might be different than mine.

53 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I've eaten MH.  Its good but not so good to justify the price.  If weight is a factor and you're sure to have good tasting water that's fine. 

That's already been established above, doesn't matter if you're eating MH or Beefaroni, if you don't have access to clean water, you're dead. This doesn't factor in this conversation.

54 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Don't try to convince people they will die horrible deaths if they rely on canned food.

Exaggerate much????  Who said anything about dying from canned food?

I'm pointing out that your belief that canned food is such a better value is not accurate, and takes a lot of more planning and attention than buying prepared MH pouches that last 10 - 15 times longer in storage.

58 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Necessity is the mother of invention.  Soldiers and marines who had to live on c rations and mres answered the call.  C ration and more cookbooks,

Really??

Now we're going to compare how soldiers survived out on the battlefield to people living in their homes to prove a point?

Talk about an apples to hammers comparison.

 

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2 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

That's only if you catch it by the expiration date and it doesn't go bad. If not, you're throwing it out. I also did the math based on 10 year shelf life, not the 30 that MH guarantees. Any additional years past 10, is a bigger savings. What if you go 20?

Because we're talking about emergency food, which is something a normal person doesn't pay attention to weekly or probably monthly.

Maybe that's what you do, but some of us here can afford to eat fresh food all the time, so we wouldn't be buying beefaroni regularly as our normal meal, and rotating our normal weekly dinner. Once again, this thread is about emergency rations that are put away, not our weekly diet. However, your weekly diet might be different than mine.

That's already been established above, doesn't matter if you're eating MH or Beefaroni, if you don't have access to clean water, you're dead. This doesn't factor in this conversation.

Exaggerate much????  Who said anything about dying from canned food?

I'm pointing out that your belief that canned food is such a better value is not accurate, and takes a lot of more planning and attention than buying prepared MH pouches that last 10 - 15 times longer in storage.

Really??

Now we're going to compare how soldiers survived out on the battlefield to people living in their homes to prove a point?

Talk about an apples to hammers comparison.

 

You're still using fuzzy math to justify the extra expense of MH.  You can throw away 60% of the cans in your example and still get more out the cans than MH.

If you have something that expires in 2 years why would you be checking it monthly?

Some people eat some of their MH stash.  I'll have an occasional can of Beefaroni.  I guess you think I just can't afford fresh food.  Which is cheaper than MH anyway.  Yeah, think whatever you want.

I don't think you've ever had to live off water treated in a field environment.  Such water is safe to drink but doesn't always taste the best.  If that's the water you have to reconstitute your MH peaches I guarantee my can of peaches will taste better.  Maybe you have some sophisticated water purification system.  Most people dont.

@Scorpio64 said, "wondering if that 5 year old can of mushroom soup will kill you".  That's where the dying from canned food will kill you came from.  Never gave that much though as I've never had a 5 year old can of anything outside of  c rations.

I still fail to see how looking at your canned food every 6 months and moving items to consumption takes that much planning and attention.

I linked to the C ration and MRE cookbooks to show that inventiveness and a few extra resources can take the boring out of canned food and MREs if you're in a situation where that's all you have.  You will get that way eating MH for a long period too.  Nothing to do with surviving on a battlefield. Not anapples to hammers comparison. If you're in your home and you need emergency food that seems like an exigent circumstance.  If one can't afford a stock of MH what should you do? Starve?

You also failed to read my second post in this thread.  I said, "If you're looking for long term no maintenance food supplies I'd go for the freeze dried nitrogen packed stuff".  That also is the most expensive option.

Well, I have to go now and figure which soup kitchen is open for me to bum a meal tomorrow.   So I can save my Beefaroni.

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

You're still using fuzzy math to justify the extra expense of MH. 

Actually, you're right:

6 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

A double serving pouch of MH spaghetti and meat sauce is $7.00.

See, the $7.00 was for TWO servings, which makes it $3.50 ea. serving. I was wondering if you noticed that.

Makes it even more cost effective, right?

11 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

Such water is safe to drink but doesn't always taste the best.  If that's the water you have to reconstitute your MH peaches I guarantee my can of peaches will taste better. 

Really??? You're going to that again, and comparing using a few ounces of water to reconstitute MH versus the quarts you need to drink to stay alive each day? The taste of peaches (or oatmeal) is the critical factor with water?

Come on, you're smarter than that.

14 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If you have something that expires in 2 years why would you be checking it monthly?

Thank you for proving my point. People forget after a few months, and when they remember, the can is expired.

Which is easier, worrying about your emergency food storage every 6 months or worrying about it every 10 - 15 years (or longer)?

16 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If one can't afford a stock of MH what should you do? Starve?

That's called "Being Prepared". Do you wait until AFTER the hurricane hits to go out and get supplies, batteries, fuel, etc?

18 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

I still fail to see how looking at your canned food every 6 months and moving items to consumption takes that much planning and attention.

That works if you regularly eat canned food, like I said, if beefaroni and mushroom soup is your normal, weekly staple, then fine, keep rotating.

Once again, we were talking about EMERGENCY FOOD, not your normal weekly food regarding the MH. Buying a long term emergency supply and stocking it away. Most people don't buy MH for their normal lunch or dinner.

What part of that don't you understand?

 

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1 minute ago, GRIZ said:

I still fail to see how looking at your canned food every 6 months and moving items to consumption takes that much planning and attention.

Honestly Griz, I don't eat much canned food.  Soup every once in a while, tuna fish every couple of weeks, some corned beef hash, beans every once in a while.  The one canned good I use often is tomatoes, stewed, diced, puree, crushed, sauce, paste, etc.

If I want beef stew, I buy fresh ingredients and make beef stew, if I want fettuccine alfredo with grilled chicken, I make it from scratch.

If one eats a lot of canned food, then they can stock a lot of it and have the ability to continually rotate it.  I can't stock 180 meals worth of canned goods and not end up throwing away most of it after two or three years (or five years if I keep it in a constant 50-60 degree environment.  It just does not make sense.

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30 minutes ago, GRIZ said:

If one can't afford a stock of MH what should you do? Starve?

"If you're looking for long term no maintenance food supplies I'd go for the freeze dried nitrogen packed stuff".  That also is the most expensive option.

One does not have to spend $2,000.00 all at once to stock up on emergency food and supplies.  I built up my stock over time, and only buying when on sale,  The average cost per Mt House meal, if the S ever does HTF, will be under $3.00 per serving.  That's pretty damned inexpensive considering the price of a big mac meal is $8.00.

What it all comes down to is insurance.  My coverage is pretty good.

 

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Regarding needing water for the freeze dried stuff, everyone should have a purifier. I have a Katadyn myself thats sitting in the safe. Also have a lifestraw.

Katadyn filters out almost anything thatd make water taste funky. 

If youre talking about Shtf food stashes, you should already have had water covered.... youll dehydrate long before youll starve.

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@Sniper22 enough has been said by both of us to support our positions.  People can make their own judgements. I am not going to convince you to my way of thinking and you most certainly not going to convert me to yours.

Trust me, many will survive whatever catastrophe you envision without one item of MH.

@Scorpio64 I don't eat a lot of canned food either.  Although some here can't seem to believe I'm capable of doing so I'm like you and make most things fresh. It's cheaper than anything else for one thing.  I do have a stock of staples like rice and beans which, protected from humidity, pretty much last forever.  Also good sources of protein but you'll be hard pressed to beat tuna when it comes to protein. This stock also gets rotated too.   I don't think that having two months of food is needed in 99.9999% of the scenarios emergency food is needed.  A few days maybe, a few weeks possible.  My insurance is pretty well covered too.  I'm comfortable with it and that's the important thing.

@Lambo2936 have you tried your filters out? On what kind of water? Perhaps you should do this before you need them and see what they really deliver.

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8 hours ago, GRIZ said:

 

@Lambo2936 have you tried your filters out? On what kind of water? Perhaps you should do this before you need them and see what they really deliver.

Cant say i have,.to be honest. Read plenty of reviews and such and it seems to be one of the best out there. Lots of backpackers and such use it. Thing isnt cheap either.

Can apparently drink anything with it... ceramic filter thats silver impregnated IIRC.

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Let’s see if I can make this more complicated.  “Sell By”, “Best By”, “Use By” , and “Expiration” dates are different things.  When dealing with canned or freeze dried foods, you’ll most likely see an expiration date, I think, but the others may turn up instead. 

But...there may or may not be data to support the date printed!   Testing food or pharmaceuticals for shelf life is expensive, and such testing may be stopped either because the product is going bad, or because the company thinks they’ve tested long enough and they decide to stop.  You won’t know why testing stopped, and if it was stopped only because the manufacturer got tired of paying for testing, you won’t know how much longer the product can safely be kept on the shelf. 

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8 hours ago, GRIZ said:

Trust me, many will survive whatever catastrophe you envision without one item of MH.

That's NOT what I said, that you ONLY need MH and nothing else. I was pointing out that cans aren't the only solution either, and pointing out that your cost argument didn't hold up either on MH. Buying a tub or two of MH and sticking it in the closet for a decade is an easy task.

8 hours ago, GRIZ said:

have you tried your filters out? On what kind of water? Perhaps you should do this before you need them and see what they really deliver.

I have, that same similar one. I use to teach Wilderness Survival when involved with my sons Boy Scout troop. We went a full weekend pumping water from a stream for our water supply.

They work, and filter out what needs to be filtered. Nobody died or ended up with montezuma's revenge. You make it sound like the only water source someone will find is drinking water from a septic tank. That's simply not going to be the case.

10 hours ago, Scorpio64 said:

Honestly Griz, I don't eat much canned food.  Soup every once in a while, tuna fish every couple of weeks, some corned beef hash, beans every once in a while.

I think that is the case with most people. I do a similar thing with soup, beans, sauerkraut, which is seasonal. That's why I believe cans aren't a good solution, due to their short shelf life. I doubt many people stay on top of what's in the back of their cabinet. Heck, I've even found cans of soup and stuff that was expired in my cabinet from the previous season. It's easy for that to happen.

 

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OP specifically asked about MREs.  Without knowing his reasoning it seems best to stay on that topic rather than MREs versus canned food.

Do you people have kids? What's this problem with rotating? I'll buy 20 cans of soup on sale (I like canned soup) and It's gone in a few weeks.  Ramon noodles? My kids inhale those things.  Lol.  No problem rotating stock with kids.  Largest problem is keeping shelves stocked!

 

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21 hours ago, 10X said:

Let’s see if I can make this more complicated.  “Sell By”, “Best By”, “Use By” , and “Expiration” dates are different things.  When dealing with canned or freeze dried foods, you’ll most likely see an expiration date, I think, but the others may turn up instead. 

But...there may or may not be data to support the date printed!   Testing food or pharmaceuticals for shelf life is expensive, and such testing may be stopped either because the product is going bad, or because the company thinks they’ve tested long enough and they decide to stop.  You won’t know why testing stopped, and if it was stopped only because the manufacturer got tired of paying for testing, you won’t know how much longer the product can safely be kept on the shelf. 

I have this argument with my wife all of the time.  She won't touch anything that's past its date and in most cases that date is essentially meaningless.

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6 hours ago, gleninjersey said:

OP specifically asked about MREs.  Without knowing his reasoning it seems best to stay on that topic rather than MREs versus canned food.

Agreed, I wish @USRifle30Cal would pop back in a clarify why he was asking the original questions.

Talking about weekly diets with cans versus MREs are two different situations.

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I just thought I would sit back and watch the show for a bit - man we argue about everything

The question centers around - what to put in a 3 day assault pack type bag if you had to - 

 

We here up in the great white north know all about laying in food stuff for the longer term - 30-90 days...

What I don't get or bothered looking into is the 3 day supply.

I was stuck in the shit show of manhattan the night of the snow storm - now in a wild post apocalyptic sort of way - I think what would I do if I had to walk out of midtown to sussex county - what kind of food could i add to the kit.

I also travel quite a bit to VT in all kinds of WX - say going over a gap road i get stuck in a storm and have to shelter in place for say 24hrs - beyond the blanket and other mergency stuff - would MRE's be a good choice.

I have to admit once I started seeing the arguments I kinda stopped reading this thread at all - 

 

 

 

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