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The new gun law and transporting magazines

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dropped off my box of 15 round AR mags at the PO Friday morning, this morning they were delivered to my friends door step in FL. The only question I was asked is "Any live animals, hazardous materials, or liquids?", that is all they care about at the PO.

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6 hours ago, MartyZ said:

hazardous materials,

You lied.

Don't you know 15 round mags are capable of mass shootings, while 10 rounders are completely harmless? 15 rounders are hazardous to many people's health. Go ask Murphy, he'll tell you!

 

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6 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

You lied.

Don't you know 15 round mags are capable of mass shootings, while 10 rounders are completely harmless? 15 rounders are hazardous to many people's health. Go ask Murphy, he'll tell you!

 

No, no, no. They are hazardous starting today, they were still ok on Friday.

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Well, over the past month, I gathered up all of my 15 round magazines and took them down to our place in North Carolina.  I also ordered and have received a number of 10-round magazines for my different hand guns that need them and it turned out to be a rather expensive decision.

While I agree with those who say that the chances of any LEO's searching your home for these now illegal gun magazines, either intentionally or due to some other reason, is highly unlikely, I am not comfortable breaking this stupid new law.  What specifically concerns me more is that when I am traveling from my home, to and from a gun range with my guns and magazines, if by chance I am involved in some form of automobile accident, then it is conceivable that compliance with this silly new law could become an issue.  So I decided not to take any chances and bit the bullet, (sorry, I could not resist.....), and banished my 15 rounders and purchased a bunch of legally compliant 10 rounders for my various handguns.

I do think that in the coming years many if not most of NJ's ridiculous gun laws will ultimately be ruled unconstitutional and will be overturned.  But until that day arrives and as long as we are residents of NJ, I will abide by the law.  While the chances of being caught are extremely slim, if you are caught, then you are screwed.  Why take that chance...?

AVB-AMG

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9 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

Well, over the past month, I gathered up all of my 15 round magazines and took them down to our place in North Carolina.  I also ordered and have received a number of 10-round magazines for my different hand guns that need them and it turned out to be a rather expensive decision.

While I agree with those who say that the chances of any LEO's searching your home for these now illegal gun magazines, either intentionally or due to some other reason, is highly unlikely, I am not comfortable breaking this stupid new law.  What specifically concerns me more is that when I am traveling from my home, to and from a gun range with my guns and magazines, if by chance I am involved in some form of automobile accident, then it is conceivable that compliance with this silly new law could become an issue.  So I decided not to take any chances and bit the bullet, (sorry, I could not resist.....), and banished my 15 rounders and purchased a bunch of legally compliant 10 rounders for my various handguns.

I do think that in the coming years many if not most of NJ's ridiculous gun laws will ultimately be ruled unconstitutional and will be overturned.  But until that day arrives and as long as we are residents of NJ, I will abide by the law.  While the chances of being caught are extremely slim, if you are caught, then you are screwed.  Why take that chance...?

AVB-AMG

I took a page out of the very same book. Only to a bud in Pennsy,,,,,,,,,

It would be different, perhaps, if they were to expunge the convictions for such an offense after/if it's overturned, like they are proposing for the marijuana convictions, but with Murphy and his ilk, I'm not holding my breath.

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13 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

You lied.

Don't you know 15 round mags are capable of mass shootings, while 10 rounders are completely harmless? 15 rounders are hazardous to many people's health. Go ask Murphy, he'll tell you!

 

I wouldn't believe Murphy if he said oxygen was good for us.

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I was thinking about this new law, and how many thousands of law abiding people, make that tens of thousands, became felons today, and have no clue. They became felons because of a new law that will have ZERO effect in stopping a mass shooter.

I know of a few casual shooters, who go to the range every few months, who know nothing of this new mag law. What happens to these people when they take their 15 rounders to the range this week, or over Christmas vacation, or next month when things are slow, and they find out they're looking at a 4th degree felon for possessing and transporting something they've done legally for the last decade or two?

Will ignorance be the top defense used if they get caught? Will Murphy and his buddy AG be sending out undercover LEO to survey the ranges?

Will a few of these unsuspecting new felons being prosecuted finally wake up the gun owners in the state to force Trenton to stop this unconstitutional BS?

I know, that last line will never happen.... one can dream...

 

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11 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

Well, over the past month, I gathered up all of my 15 round magazines and took them down to our place in North Carolina.  I also ordered and have received a number of 10-round magazines for my different hand guns that need them and it turned out to be a rather expensive decision.

While I agree with those who say that the chances of any LEO's searching your home for these now illegal gun magazines, either intentionally or due to some other reason, is highly unlikely, I am not comfortable breaking this stupid new law.  What specifically concerns me more is that when I am traveling from my home, to and from a gun range with my guns and magazines, if by chance I am involved in some form of automobile accident, then it is conceivable that compliance with this silly new law could become an issue.  So I decided not to take any chances and bit the bullet, (sorry, I could not resist.....), and banished my 15 rounders and purchased a bunch of legally compliant 10 rounders for my various handguns.

I do think that in the coming years many if not most of NJ's ridiculous gun laws will ultimately be ruled unconstitutional and will be overturned.  But until that day arrives and as long as we are residents of NJ, I will abide by the law.  While the chances of being caught are extremely slim, if you are caught, then you are screwed.  Why take that chance...?

AVB-AMG

With all due respect, its people like you in this state why these laws even exist. and I'm sure you will be taking that voting record of yours to which ever gun friendly place you retire to, so you can ruin it for them as well.

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9 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

I was thinking about this new law, and how many thousands of law abiding people, make that tens of thousands, became felons today, and have no clue. They became felons because of a new law that will have ZERO effect in stopping a mass shooter.

I know of a few casual shooters, who go to the range every few months, who know nothing of this new mag law. What happens to these people when they take their 15 rounders to the range this week, or over Christmas vacation, or next month when things are slow, and they find out they're looking at a 4th degree felon for possessing and transporting something they've done legally for the last decade or two?

Will ignorance be the top defense used if they get caught? Will Murphy and his buddy AG be sending out undercover LEO to survey the ranges?

Will a few of these unsuspecting new felons being prosecuted finally wake up the gun owners in the state to force Trenton to stop this unconstitutional BS?

I know, that last line will never happen.... one can dream...

 

Who knows? 

I do think one or two criminals will be made examples of (i.e. committing a crime which just happened to have a 15 round mag)... but your general person going to the gun range?  There would be far more bad press for trying to railroad your typical gun owner... i.e a 60 year old retiree.

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11 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

I was thinking about this new law, and how many thousands of law abiding people, make that tens of thousands, became felons today, and have no clue. They became felons because of a new law that will have ZERO effect in stopping a mass shooter.

I know of a few casual shooters, who go to the range every few months, who know nothing of this new mag law. What happens to these people when they take their 15 rounders to the range this week, or over Christmas vacation, or next month when things are slow, and they find out they're looking at a 4th degree felon for possessing and transporting something they've done legally for the last decade or two?

Will ignorance be the top defense used if they get caught? Will Murphy and his buddy AG be sending out undercover LEO to survey the ranges?

Will a few of these unsuspecting new felons being prosecuted finally wake up the gun owners in the state to force Trenton to stop this unconstitutional BS?

I know, that last line will never happen.... one can dream...

 

They will sweep it under the rug If they sense you have the resources to fight it, and are an upstanding citizen. They love PTI. Otherwise, you will get screwed.

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3 minutes ago, Maksim said:

There would be far more bad press for trying to railroad your typical gun owner... i.e a 60 year old retiree.

Ahhh... so since I fit that profile, does that mean I can still take 15 rounders safely to the range? :)

 

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5 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

Ahhh... so since I fit that profile, does that mean I can still take 15 rounders safely to the range? :)

 

Everything is all about "acceptable levels of risk."

Just don't run over a kitten or beat up a hooker on the way to the range!

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11 minutes ago, Maksim said:

Who knows? 

I do think one or two criminals will be made examples of (i.e. committing a crime which just happened to have a 15 round mag)... but your general person going to the gun range?  There would be far more bad press for trying to railroad your typical gun owner... i.e a 60 year old retiree.

No chance.  Actual criminals will plead that away.  Same way an armed robber gets 2 years time served. Where a otherwise law abiding person gets 7 years.

They will catch a few unknowing sporting  "criminals". And then the real "fun" begins.

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Just now, PeteF said:

No chance.  Actual criminals will plead that away.  Same way an armed robber gets 2 years time served. Where a otherwise law abiding person gets 7 years.

They will catch a few unknowing sporting  "criminals". And then the real "fun" begins.

And if that happens, make sure you call a good CRIMINAL lawyer... and not a "gun lawyer."

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21 minutes ago, JackDaWack said:

With all due respect, its people like you in this state why these laws even exist. and I'm sure you will be taking that voting record of yours to which ever gun friendly place you retire to, so you can ruin it for them as well.

@JackDaWack:  and all the best to you too....... Yeah, it is all MY fault...Right...!

AVB-AMG

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19 minutes ago, Maksim said:

And if that happens, make sure you call a good CRIMINAL lawyer... and not a "gun lawyer."

This is something I've always said.  If someone gets jammed up for an >10 Rd magazine they don't need a "gun lawyer".  The law has already been established.  As far as the legal system is concerned you might as well have committed an armed robbery or burglary.  The armed robber or burglar usually has something to plea down to.

A good criminal defense lawyer will try to avoid going to trial.  Why take a chance when you minimize the impact on your client?  That minimization might be dismissal of the charges, PTI, or plea out to a case you have no chance of winning.

 

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2 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

@JackDaWack:  and all the best to you too....... Yeah, it is all MY fault...Right...!

AVB-AMG

Not all your fault, but you vote for anti-gun politicians... So I'm not sure why you're participating in this discussion. This was something you voted for... So I have no idea why youre making it a point to tell us your story, and specifically the expense of new magazines. 

It's a little insulting personally.

 

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3 hours ago, Sniper22 said:

Will ignorance be the top defense used if they get caught? Will Murphy and his buddy AG be sending out undercover LEO to survey the ranges?

Will a few of these unsuspecting new felons being prosecuted finally wake up the gun owners in the state to force Trenton to stop this unconstitutional BS?

I know, that last line will never happen.... one can dream...

 

I dream of nullification... if one can even educate one potential future juror on the subject, let alone 12...

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Lawyers...  They are the majority profession In politics.. They write the laws, they prosecute those who break the law, then defend those that broke the law & finally they sit in judgement of the law..  Seems like they have all the bases covered.. Power, Control & of coarse $$$$

Now please don’t take this that I have anything against lawyers...  

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On 12/8/2018 at 7:44 PM, Maksim said:

The odds of the police busting down your doors on Monday looking for 15 round mags is close to zero. 

For rifles and their magazines, the locals would have no idea what I own. But handguns are a different matter as the P2P copy goes to the local PD. Of course, it's not a closed system. I traded in handguns years ago that I have, if I'm lucky, a handwritten receipt for when purchasing something else. But the locals do know, technically, what handguns you've purchased over the years and what the standard mags were then that are illegal now.

Now, imagine if some PITA chief in Bumfuk, NJ decided to knock on the door of every citizen who purchased a Sig 226 or Glock 17 with standard mags years ago to make sure they had gotten rid of their over-15 or over-10 mags? 

I have a very sweet Beretta 84FS in .380 that I've owned legally for over 25 years. It came with 13-round mags. I would have been an overnight criminal if I hadn't gotten rid of those mags. And for what? Politics.

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1 hour ago, JackDaWack said:

Not all your fault, but you vote for anti-gun politicians... So I'm not sure why you're participating in this discussion. This was something you voted for... So I have no idea why youre making it a point to tell us your story, and specifically the expense of new magazines. 

It's a little insulting personally.

@JackDaWack:

I vote for politicians who have a track record and stated beliefs and values that I share, FOR THE MOST PART.  There are very few people who have run for political office with whom I agree with on everything, nor do I expect that there ever will be.  I am not a one-issue voter and you know that I support all of our 2nd Amendment rights.

BTW, there are others here who seem to appreciate the approach that I took on this thread topic and share my sentiments.  Also, I do not think that I am alone either in re-discovering just how expensive different 10-round magazines are today.

So, you fin that "It's a little insulting personally".  You are free to feel indignant if that is your prerogative.  if I wanted to insult you personally I would, but what is the point and where does that get us...?

AVB-AMG

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1 hour ago, NJBeretta said:

I dream of nullification... if one can even educate one potential future juror on the subject, let alone 12...

You can dream of nullification.  I've been involved in hundreds of trials in my time and have rarely seen it happen.

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1 hour ago, Kawi7 said:

Lawyers...  They are the majority profession In politics.. They write the laws, they prosecute those who break the law, then defend those that broke the law & finally they sit in judgement of the law..  Seems like they have all the bases covered.. Power, Control & of coarse $$$$

Most of what they do, is to help themselves.

1 hour ago, Kawi7 said:

Now please don’t take this that I have anything against lawyers...  

OK, then I'll say it, I have something against lawyers. Apparently, I'm not alone, look at the chart:

20180103_Trusted_Jobs.jpg

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16 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

Well, over the past month, I gathered up all of my 15 round magazines and took them down to our place in North Carolina.  I also ordered and have received a number of 10-round magazines for my different hand guns that need them and it turned out to be a rather expensive decision.

While I agree with those who say that the chances of any LEO's searching your home for these now illegal gun magazines, either intentionally or due to some other reason, is highly unlikely, I am not comfortable breaking this stupid new law.  What specifically concerns me more is that when I am traveling from my home, to and from a gun range with my guns and magazines, if by chance I am involved in some form of automobile accident, then it is conceivable that compliance with this silly new law could become an issue.  So I decided not to take any chances and bit the bullet, (sorry, I could not resist.....), and banished my 15 rounders and purchased a bunch of legally compliant 10 rounders for my various handguns.

I do think that in the coming years many if not most of NJ's ridiculous gun laws will ultimately be ruled unconstitutional and will be overturned.  But until that day arrives and as long as we are residents of NJ, I will abide by the law.  While the chances of being caught are extremely slim, if you are caught, then you are screwed.  Why take that chance...?

AVB-AMG

Give or take a detail or two, that is almost exactly my situation.  I also had a few rifles that needed 10 round mags.  The total cost for replacements so far was over $400, and I still have a few more that I need.

I emphatically agree that while the chances of ever getting caught are slim, the consequences are dire. 

I hope you are right in your last paragraph, but I'm doubtful that we will ever see NJ's oppressive laws overturned.

As for the masses that others have mentioned who don't even know about this new law, my prediction is that they will probably not get prison time, but that they will become felons who will lose their right to own firearms in all 50 states. 

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3 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

@JackDaWack:

I vote for politicians who have a track record and stated beliefs and values that I share, FOR THE MOST PART.  There are very few people who have run for political office with whom I agree with on everything, nor do I expect that there ever will be.  I am not a one-issue voter and you know that I support all of our 2nd Amendment rights.

BTW, there are others here who seem to appreciate the approach that I took on this thread topic and share my sentiments.  Also, I do not think that I am alone either in re-discovering just how expensive different 10-round magazines are today.

So, you fin that "It's a little insulting personally".  You are free to feel indignant if that is your prerogative.  if I wanted to insult you personally I would, but what is the point and where does that get us...?

AVB-AMG

I can appreciate that you vote for what you believe in... but you have made it clear that your votes go to people who do not in fact support the 2A... So saying you support the 2A is nice and all, but it doesn't sound like you actually do support it, specifically where it matters. Maybe in theory you support it, but not in reality. 

You seem to enjoy firearms, and believe in the second amendment, do not confuse that with supporting it. 

The judges you most likely helped get into power told all of us that this is not a burden on gun owners, so i'm puzzled as to why they are costing you so much money.

I hope you don't see this as insulting, there is a lot of irony in everything you have said per this thread when you contribute to almost all of the reasons it happened in the first place, including reasons as to why it hasn't been struck down in two courts.

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19 hours ago, AVB-AMG said:

"... this silly new law ..."

AVB-AMG

AVB, that you refer to this that way at the same time you bemoan the cost of replacing your mags is sad.  The law isn't silly, it's downright SCARY!.  You and everyone else were about to be made overnight felons unless you got rid of or modified something you legally purchased.

Can you name a single instance in the rest of your life where this happened?  Did you find it "silly"?

The dems in this state keep spouting "reasonable" gun control, but that's simply a buzzword to them.  The word "reasonable" is vague - it has a different meaning to everyone.  I can guarantee what may be reasonable to you might be unresonable to someone else.  

Murphy campaigned on making NJ gun laws a model for the nation.  He does exactly what he said he would, and you describe it as "silly"?

Wake up.

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4 hours ago, SIGMan Freud said:

For rifles and their magazines, the locals would have no idea what I own. But handguns are a different matter as the P2P copy goes to the local PD. Of course, it's not a closed system. I traded in handguns years ago that I have, if I'm lucky, a handwritten receipt for when purchasing something else. But the locals do know, technically, what handguns you've purchased over the years and what the standard mags were then that are illegal now.

Now, imagine if some PITA chief in Bumfuk, NJ decided to knock on the door of every citizen who purchased a Sig 226 or Glock 17 with standard mags years ago to make sure they had gotten rid of their over-15 or over-10 mags? 

I have a very sweet Beretta 84FS in .380 that I've owned legally for over 25 years. It came with 13-round mags. I would have been an overnight criminal if I hadn't gotten rid of those mags. And for what? Politics.

The same copies of pistol permits go to the State... so they do have them.

Yes, they can knock on the door to say hello... but they are not at all likely to get a warrant to seek out your handgun mags.

If the chief did come knock on the door... "Thank you for the information, have a nice day."

You don't have to respond to the question.

Of course, yes, most would be intimidating into asking but even still, word would get out very quickly.

Besides, if it takes 4 months to get your pistol permits, do you honestly think they have time to go door to door to "tell you the good news."

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