Fear Mongering?

[capt14k 2,052]

Take a stand? How?
Gun control is a license to print money for gun businesses.  
CEOs of major gun companies were HOPING Hillary wins as it would mean millions more in profits. (first hand info)

I know thus why I disagree with putting FFLs in leadership positions. However Barrett and other companies have refused to sell to NY, NJ, and other Communist States. NJ FFLs can do the same and refuse to sell anything over 10 rounds to anyone.

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[Maksim 1,504]

Just now, EngineerJet said:

And therein lies the conundrum. How many gun companies are genuinely pro-gun? The dollar is a mighty big incentive. But are our values of liberty strong enough to resist the temptation of selling our souls for a buck? Character goes a long way. Anyone hoping for Hillary to win just for sales is also willing to sell us down the river, in my opinion is short sighted and doesnt deserve our business. I know this is easy to say and harder to live up to. Would I give up my M&P if it turns out S&W was one of those companies (hypothetically)?

If you want to know the answer to that S&W question, let me know via PM. lol.  I happen to know the answer as to what they hoped for.  

The broader answer is... Out of the major companies I know of 1 brick producing handgun manufacturers who really is Pro 2A... (for the most part), and some were rather apathetic.    A few were Pro-Dem.

From the smaller manufacturers... many are truly Pro 2A and would have rather seen their profits decline than 2A encroached.

The other thing to think of... many of the larger companies are not run by gun people, but retail sales folks from other industries.  To them.. it is just a widget...

Read my gun series on Seeking Alpha on this topic. 

[remixer 1,645]

3 minutes ago, Maksim said:

If you want to know the answer to that S&W question, let me know via PM. lol.  I happen to know the answer as to what they hoped for.  

The broader answer is... Out of the major companies I know of 1 brick producing handgun manufacturers who really is Pro 2A... (for the most part), and some were rather apathetic.    A few were Pro-Dem.

From the smaller manufacturers... many are truly Pro 2A and would have rather seen their profits decline than 2A encroached.

The other thing to think of... many of the larger companies are not run by gun people, but retail sales folks from other industries.  To them.. it is just a widget...

Read my gun series on Seeking Alpha on this topic. 

I'm sure some CEO's were hoping for a HRC win. They have to answer to stock holders. Just because you are a CEO of a gun maker does not make you a Gun guy or Pro 2a. it makes you a business man and thats it..  Just as a Man can be the CEO of a women's fashion line without actually using his product.

[Maksim 1,504]

1 minute ago, capt14k said:

I know thus why I disagree with putting FFLs in leadership positions. However Barrett and other companies have refused to sell to NY, NJ, and other Communist States. NJ FFLs can do the same and refuse to sell anything over 10 rounds to anyone.

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And what practical impact has that had?

I would argue none.

At the end it was a business decision and guess what, the Liberals would LOVE to claim it as "We stopped and forced Barrett from selling 50 caliber assault guns that shoot down airliners."

The PR then in turn had a positive impact on the free states.

I don't understand "NJ FFLs can do the same and refuse to sell anything over 10 rounds to anyone."

You mean even LE?

You are not going to get 100% of FFLs to participate and even still, nothing forces the state or some enterprising liberal for opening up an FFL to sell those guns just to LE.

Washing DC did just that. 

 

[remixer 1,645]

2 minutes ago, Maksim said:

And what practical impact has that had?

I would argue none.

At the end it was a business decision and guess what, the Liberals would LOVE to claim it as "We stopped and forced Barrett from selling 50 caliber assault guns that shoot down airliners."

The PR then in turn had a positive impact on the free states.

I don't understand "NJ FFLs can do the same and refuse to sell anything over 10 rounds to anyone."

You mean even LE?

You are not going to get 100% of FFLs to participate and even still, nothing forces the state or some enterprising liberal for opening up an FFL to sell those guns just to LE.

Washing DC did just that. 

 

100%?... you would be lucky to get 10% of dealers to agree on anything.

BTW there are Liberal leaning gun stores in NJ

[capt14k 2,052]

And what practical impact has that had?

I would argue none.

At the end it was a business decision and guess what, the Liberals would LOVE to claim it as "We stopped and forced Barrett from selling 50 caliber assault guns that shoot down airliners."

The PR then in turn had a positive impact on the free states.

I don't understand "NJ FFLs can do the same and refuse to sell anything over 10 rounds to anyone."

You mean even LE?

You are not going to get 100% of FFLs to participate and even still, nothing forces the state or some enterprising liberal for opening up an FFL to sell those guns just to LE.

Washing DC did just that. 

 

 

Yes I mean LE. Even if it doesn't do anything it is symbolic that they are with us and not just concerned with the almighty dollar. Also would be nice to see more 2A literature posted in stores. Every movement begins with a small step.

 

 

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[remixer 1,645]

1 minute ago, capt14k said:

 

Yes I mean LE. Even if it doesn't do anything it is symbolic that they are with us and not just concerned with the almighty dollar. Also would be nice to see more 2A literature posted in stores. Every movement begins with a small step.

 

 

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It would be nice if we had a Pro2a groups in this state that did not fight with each other. Then it would be easy to have literature for one combined group

[Combat Auto 174]

14 minutes ago, Sniper22 said:

The bottom line, did we win or not. Play all the semantic, word games you want. The proof is in the results.

Nappen loves to beat his chest and make everyone believe he's the best thing since sliced bread in the legal gun law business. Guess what, without PROOF, it's nothing but hyperbole and words.

When I "play", I play to win. PERIOD.

BTW, got that list of Nappen "Wins" yet. I really want to read them.

 

LOL, I think you are pounding your chest as much as the person you are complaining about...And if you can't identify what was wrong with the suite, it just amount's to random bitching and complaining (which of course is your right, they haven't outlawed that yet in NJ ;-)).

[capt14k 2,052]

It would be nice if we had a Pro2a groups in this state that did not fight with each other. Then it would be easy to have literature for one combined group

Agreed there too. Replace ANJRPC leadership and combine with CNJFO.


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[remixer 1,645]

1 minute ago, capt14k said:

 

Agreed there too. Replace ANJRPC leadership and combine with CNJFO.


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I dont care who replaces who with what... just get together and combine resources.... whom ever they choose to keep alive in the end would be fine by me.

 

[capt14k 2,052]

I dont care who replaces who with what... just get together and combine resources.... whom ever they choose to keep alive in the end would be fine by me.
 

No offense to yourself but you have to agree certain FFLs do not have the best interest of 2A community at the top of the priority list. Those with even less interest in total victory would be the out of state lawyers on the payroll.


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[Maksim 1,504]

2 minutes ago, capt14k said:

 

Agreed there too. Replace ANJRPC leadership and combine with CNJFO.


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So the problem is... the most radical folks will turn the group into a bunch of extremists... happened before, would happen again.

When some of those groups outright scold and make gun owners who do not agree with them feel like scumbags... it is very easy to just say F it!

IF I was a Liberal democrat in NJ... I would LOVE the posts Nappen and others make.  To a "regular" person, they make gun owners seems like tinfoil wearing lunatics.

[Maksim 1,504]

3 minutes ago, remixer said:

I dont care who replaces who with what... just get together and combine resources.... whom ever they choose to keep alive in the end would be fine by me.

 

The key is... communication between the groups... there is not much of that.

When I was on board of NJ2AS, half the people did not like the focus, others did not think they were doing enough, etc.  

The groups do need to come together for the big cases... but ultimately I still think it will fail.

The longer term solution is to get more people in NJ involved with guns and then change legislation.

[Krdshrk 3,877]

33 minutes ago, remixer said:

How exactly is this a Lic to print money... 

 

24 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

How many mags did you modify to 10 rounds in the past 6 months?  

 

22 minutes ago, remixer said:

lots of mags...  and lots of labor spent.

Owners of those mags were perfectly able to modify them without us... they choose to bring them to dealers... they did not have to.

 

So you made money from it... And if users did it themselves at home, they would be buying equipment to do it - so magblock companies made money...

[capt14k 2,052]

So the problem is... the most radical folks will turn the group into a bunch of extremists... happened before, would happen again.
When some of those groups outright scold and make gun owners who do not agree with them feel like scumbags... it is very easy to just say F it!
IF I was a Liberal democrat in NJ... I would LOVE the posts Nappen and others make.  To a "regular" person, they make gun owners seems like tinfoil wearing lunatics.

Yes over the top is just as bad as not enough. Personally I like CNJFO, what they do, and Rosie's positions which I think speak for the group. The one lawsuit here and there strategy is not working and will not work. ANJRPC as the NJ arm of the NRA should have mutliple lawsuits filed. Force the state to defend their positions and hope one sticks. From the last balance sheet I read the funds are there.


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[remixer 1,645]

5 minutes ago, capt14k said:

 

No offense to yourself but you have to agree certain FFLs do not have the best interest of 2A community at the top of the priority list. Those with even less interest in total victory would be the out of state lawyers on the payroll.


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cant disagree. FFLS all have difference politics...

[PK90 3,570]

We have one Pro-Gun organization in AZ (there may be smaller ones but i never heard of them). The Arizona Citizens Defense League. They actually push pro-gun legislature through all the time. 

[remixer 1,645]

3 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

 

 

So you made money from it... And if users did it themselves at home, they would be buying equipment to do it - so magblock companies made money...

and how exactly is this a Lic to print money.   Should dealers provide services for free? You think dealers are making bank on pinning magazines?

[PK90 3,570]

1 minute ago, remixer said:

and how exactly is this a Lic to print money.   Should dealers provide services for free? You think dealers are making bank on pinning magazines?

[Sniper 6,372]

19 minutes ago, Combat Auto said:

LOL, I think you are pounding your chest as much as the person you are complaining about...And if you can't identify what was wrong with the suite, it just amount's to random bitching and complaining (which of course is your right, they haven't outlawed that yet in NJ ;-)).

What's wrong with the suit??

Easy question to answer. WE DIDN'T WIN!

I'm not an attorney making $100 of thousands of dollars a year claiming I know it all. He is, but from everything I've seen, he gets crap results. Doesn't get any clearer than that.

Do you normally hire tradesmen to come in and do work in your house, pay them the full amount up front, and accept that fact that they didn't provide or complete what they claimed they could? Same situation? Do you continue to send money to those same tradesmen, even though you got nothing in return all the previous times? If so, you're an .......

[CAL. .30 M1 2,101]

2 hours ago, JasonSeidman said:

i believe he was referring to retired leo purchasing large capacity mags, and that needing to be documented.  

Never mind doesnt matter

 

[1LtCAP 4,262]

1 hour ago, capt14k said:

I agree you and all FFL should take a stand like Barrett did. No 15 round mags for all citizens no 15 round mags for anyone.

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I WOULD LOVE to see all ffl's do this. we all know none of them will, but it would be good if they did.

[Shawnmoore81 623]

It would of mattered what was said at the hearing

 

You had 3 judges

And 2 of em were libs. Game over

 

 

Guys trashing Nappen.. how many of you have done anything? Let me see pics of you in Trenton last spring.

 

Yes he’s helped a lot of people in this state and I’m one of them

 

 

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[Maksim 1,504]

6 minutes ago, Shawnmoore81 said:

It would of mattered what was said at the hearing

 

You had 3 judges

And 2 of em were libs. Game over

 

 

Guys trashing Nappen.. how many of you have done anything? Let me see pics of you in Trenton last spring.

 

Yes he’s helped a lot of people in this state and I’m one of them

 

 

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Shawn, THAT is the problem.... The NUMBERS are not on NJ's side.

Doesn't matter what you are, there has been ZERO wins for gun owners in NJ... and none of it will change until either Supreme Court rules OR we vote out legislators.  That will happen when we get more gun owners.

Nappen, in his latest posts, has done nothing for NJ Gun Owners, besides selling more memberships and panicking people with false information. 

[Kawi7 52]

8 minutes ago, Shawnmoore81 said:

It would of mattered what was said at the hearing

You had 3 judges

And 2 of em were libs. Game over

They would have upheld a ban on 5 rounds if it came before them.. 

 

[remixer 1,645]

2 minutes ago, Kawi7 said:

They would have upheld a ban on 5 rounds if it came before them.. 

 

they would uphold laws with a max capacity of 1 round and no semi auto at all.... Activist judges.

BUt that would spark a supreme court challenge which they would not be able to avoid.

[Shawnmoore81 623]

They aren’t gonna do raids on every gun owner. But what they are gonna do is pick us off one by one. If it takes a little fear to get people moving then so be it


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[Maksim 1,504]

2 minutes ago, Shawnmoore81 said:

They aren’t gonna do raids on every gun owner. But what they are gonna do is pick us off one by one. If it takes a little fear to get people moving then so be it


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Just like McCarthy did with red scares? 

For every 1 person it scares, it pisses off more gun owners who do not want to identify with what they believe are the tinfoil society. 

And it is not FEAR... it is lies... especially when you should know it would not be possible. 

[Kawi7 52]

Look for it to only get worse.. Murphy & Booker plan on moving into the White House (maybe together, who knows) and they will want to stand out amongst the other Dems as having NJ having the strictest laws on guns... 

[1LtCAP 4,262]

1 hour ago, Maksim said:

The key is... communication between the groups... there is not much of that.

When I was on board of NJ2AS, half the people did not like the focus, others did not think they were doing enough, etc.  

The groups do need to come together for the big cases... but ultimately I still think it will fail.

The longer term solution is to get more people in NJ involved with guns and then change legislation.

this is the big issue. the only group i see not trashing the others is the one rosey heads.....