"Responsible" Training?

[Maksim 1,504]

Was browsing and I saw Rob Pincus share this video of Rockwell Tactical Group...

Um.... Okay....

Rockwell did respond afterwards saying it was one particular instructor...

[High Exposure 5,661]

Vet your instructors folks.

Make sure they are teaching you skills that are relevant to your needs and desires.

Verify they are qualified to teach you at the level of instruction you are seeking.

Finally, be confident enough to not participate in a drill, or better yet - walk away from the training entirely if you feel the instructors ego is being put ahead of your safety.

[Vicious 138]

There was a trauma care class immediately following this one.

[Sniper 6,372]

Wow, that was some scary stuff!!!

 

[myhatinthering 462]

holy shit!  not sure who is dumber, the class instructor or the people participating.  WTF is wrong with people!!!!!

every single one of those persons involved should have their guns removed

[Scorpio64 5,146]

7 minutes ago, myhatinthering said:

holy shit!  not sure who is dumber, the class instructor or the people participating.  WTF is wrong with people!!!!!

I'd have walked off and demanded a refund.

[myhatinthering 462]

1 minute ago, Scorpio64 said:

I'd have walked off and demanded a refund.

no doubt but the people participating are actually worse.  With the instructor, if we can call him that, you've got one dumbass that needs to be fired and removed from firearms.  With the participants, there are mulitiple and no warning bells go off?  This is exactly why I hate the mall ninja crowd.  Training, legitimate training is one thing but way too much is simply about making coin and taking advantage of wannabes  

[1563621 388]

WTF! Shocked.

[myhatinthering 462]

I mean look at the end with the one yoyo pivoting on his tops of his feet much less doing a mag change and needing to take his eyes off the target (with people in front) to execute the change and reconnect with the targets!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bad....very very bad

[Brisco 130]

WOW!!

And Why?

What possible good could have come from that "training"?

[Bklynracer 1,263]

Could not believe what I was watching. Showed it to my 16 year old who's just staring to get into the hobby more and more, and asked him to watch and tell me what was wrong, he looked at me and said a lot is wrong. Also asked me if people are really that stupid. I answered I guess so.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

Rob Pincus sucks, plain and simple.  He is a salesman, at best.

 

[Maksim 1,504]

39 minutes ago, Ray Ray said:

Rob Pincus sucks, plain and simple.  He is a salesman, at best.

 

This was not Robs class... 

the guy teaching runs classes out of PA. 

[Zeke 5,504]

Simunitions?

[vladtepes 1,060]

I had actually considered going there.. 

the thing that irks me is this.. there was another response that fell in-between the initial video... and the public walking back of it being acceptable.. 

This video was shortly after the initial pushback over the practice.. where everything is dismissed as somehow being OK.. it wasn't until people got more and more fired up about it that they came out with the statement posted above.. 

If the class runs under your group.. what happens there is your responsibility.. IMO.. 
 

 

[fishnut 2,358]

Oh boy what's Yeager going to do to top this? 

[JackDaWack 2,895]

I know Rob posted the video, but who was the instructor?

[High Exposure 5,661]

1 hour ago, Ray Ray said:

Rob Pincus sucks, plain and simple.  He is a salesman, at best.

 

I concur Ray Ray.

However, that doesn’t necessarily make him wrong in this instance.

Pincus was in NJ at Cobra One, with SimonSaysTrain and the guy from Savage Cerakote in Spottswood when this video was making the rounds.

The whole thing was cringy to follow.

[Maksim 1,504]

3 hours ago, JackDaWack said:

I know Rob posted the video, but who was the instructor?

Rob reposted the video...  That video was shot by one of the students in the class and shared on instagram.  Rob picked it up and shared it himself.  

The instructor was the guy posted in @vladtepes video... Garry Marr. 

[louu 399]

I can't wait till this whole "I'm a civilian but I'm training to be an operator" bull shit blows over. Especially in NJ, your never gona be able to carry a gun in this state. It's not the politicians that prevent us from carrying, it's all the gun owners crying on the internet instead of making a real difference. 

Stop wasting your money with these assholes and just shoot a fucking match. Guns in NJ are only for games, not self defense. 

When you move to America and there's that one in ten millionth chance that you have to get in a gun fight happens, your not going to have to fight the entire taliban army or the swat team. It's gona be one coward dope head and all you have to do is show your gun, the end. 

[124gr9mm 859]

8 hours ago, vladtepes said:

I had actually considered going there.. 

the thing that irks me is this.. there was another response that fell in-between the initial video... and the public walking back of it being acceptable.. 

This video was shortly after the initial pushback over the practice.. where everything is dismissed as somehow being OK.. it wasn't until people got more and more fired up about it that they came out with the statement posted above.. 

If the class runs under your group.. what happens there is your responsibility.. IMO.. 
 

 

That guy is a fucking moron.

Glad nobody got killed...

[myhatinthering 462]

8 hours ago, vladtepes said:

I had actually considered going there.. 

the thing that irks me is this.. there was another response that fell in-between the initial video... and the public walking back of it being acceptable.. 

This video was shortly after the initial pushback over the practice.. where everything is dismissed as somehow being OK.. it wasn't until people got more and more fired up about it that they came out with the statement posted above.. 

If the class runs under your group.. what happens there is your responsibility.. IMO.. 
 

 

What a load of bs!!!!!  wow

[JohnnyB 4,320]

Holy Shit!   A training class with students shooting at targets with other students moving ahead of the firing line! An accident just waiting to happen! I can't believe what I just saw!

It's really scary that anyone in that class agreed to participate. I could understand such drills in a SEAL team with experienced operators but never with beginners! This just pisses me off!

[vladtepes 1,060]

3 hours ago, JohnnyB said:

Holy Shit!   A training class with students shooting at targets with other students moving ahead of the firing line! An accident just waiting to happen! I can't believe what I just saw!

It's really scary that anyone in that class agreed to participate. I could understand such drills in a SEAL team with experienced operators but never with beginners! This just pisses me off!

you can get the same immersive experience while simulating actually being shot at with simunitions.. there is no value at all for ANY level of shooter to engage in that.. guns misfire.. rounds go off course.. people trip.. even if you do your part.. 100% you could still shoot and kill someone.. 

I used to dismiss activities like that as being not that big of a deal.. typically the round goes where you put it.. but in retrospect I was wrong.. because the key word to that is typically.. even if just one person is hurt or injured.. its an unnecessary loss.. 

[vladtepes 1,060]

6 hours ago, louu said:

I can't wait till this whole "I'm a civilian but I'm training to be an operator" bull shit blows over. Especially in NJ, your never gona be able to carry a gun in this state. It's not the politicians that prevent us from carrying, it's all the gun owners crying on the internet instead of making a real difference. 

Stop wasting your money with these assholes and just shoot a fucking match. Guns in NJ are only for games, not self defense. 

When you move to America and there's that one in ten millionth chance that you have to get in a gun fight happens, your not going to have to fight the entire taliban army or the swat team. It's gona be one coward dope head and all you have to do is show your gun, the end. 

I think there are partial truths here.. 
I have seen incidents where the attacker did not just run.. and the "good guy" was in a "shoot out"...

couple that with some type of active shooter situation.. where the perpetrator has a carbine or something... and things could be really difficult quickly.. 

lots of running screaming innocent people.. 
lots of shots in your direction.. 
lots of confusion.. 

and yes you are right. completely right.. the likelihood of that happening in your lifetime.. almost 0.. but eh.. you never know.. and some training from a qualified school would not hurt your chances of survival.. 

[Maksim 1,504]

I think there are two issues here...

1. Point of this drill?  If you want to get people to be okay around gunfire... just have them take off the muffs. lol. OR stand on the line and shoot blanks or something.  Same sound, and effect with no "oh shit."  Trainer just too cheap/stupid for not using simunitions?

2.  As it was pointed out elsewhere... even the elite operators of the world out there... would not be doing this stupid shit WITHOUT full armor and helmets.   

You can go bang a hooker on the street if you really want to.... but don't be a moron and not wear a rubber.

THIS is banging a hooker without a rubber. 

[Maksim 1,504]

7 hours ago, louu said:

I can't wait till this whole "I'm a civilian but I'm training to be an operator" bull shit blows over. Especially in NJ, your never gona be able to carry a gun in this state. It's not the politicians that prevent us from carrying, it's all the gun owners crying on the internet instead of making a real difference. 

Stop wasting your money with these assholes and just shoot a fucking match. Guns in NJ are only for games, not self defense. 

When you move to America and there's that one in ten millionth chance that you have to get in a gun fight happens, your not going to have to fight the entire taliban army or the swat team. It's gona be one coward dope head and all you have to do is show your gun, the end. 

I don't understand... are you saying we are crying on the internet because the community (not just us, gun owners and trainers in general) are calling out a so called expert trainer out on his unsafe BS?

You have MIL/LEO guys out there all saying this is a stupid stupid stupid thing to do, even with trained professionals.

By NOT calling out such BS... such training would keep on happening.  To a greater degree, the community needs to police itself from the more creative morons out there putting lives in unnecessary risk... and this is precisely what it is. 

As far as this biting gun owners?  It will in any case...

 

1. IF the gun community did not come out against this BS... "Gun owners had proof of unsafe training and did nothing to police their own, they put lives at risk and did not condemn this."

2. This video will likely be star testimony at the next lawsuit dealing with training anyway.

[Ray Ray 3,566]

1 hour ago, Maksim said:

THIS is banging a hooker without a rubber. 

Don't knock it till ya try it.  You gotta remember many of us here are prior military, so hookers are a part of our DNA.  Right @vjf915???

[Maksim 1,504]

1 hour ago, Ray Ray said:

Don't knock it till ya try it.  You gotta remember many of us here are prior military, so hookers are a part of our DNA.  Right @vjf915???

we talking about hookers or being downrange when others are shooting? =)

Would you go bang a Newark hooker with no rubber? =) 

[Ray Ray 3,566]

36 minutes ago, Maksim said:

we talking about hookers or being downrange when others are shooting? =)

Would you go bang a Newark hooker with no rubber? =) 

No and no