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Frank Thomas

Is it worth trying for a gun carry permit to attend synagogue?

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10 hours ago, Smokin .50 said:

If we run another matching funds campaign, we'll need dues money & donations to match the public funds WITH.  Is everybody here a member of CNJFO or are we carrying all your water???

 

11 minutes ago, Regular Guy said:

Do we get any credit for being members of any other 2A organization like  ANJRC, NRA, NJ2AS?  Do they all work together or is it a competition to see who can "carry all the water?"

@Regular Guy of course you get credit for belonging to ANJRPC, NRA, NJ2AS and any other group or organization that has donated thousands of dollars to the Cheeseman-Jillard lawsuit AND ANJRPC's Rogers case.  To my knowledge only CNJFO can claim they have donated to BOTH!  They did so via their matching funds campaign.  "Matching Funds" requires donations made directly TO and annual dues PAID DIRECTLY TO the corporation putting its' neck out for the MATCH of what the public at-large donates.

The NRA is the chief funding source for ANJRPC's Rogers case.  We (CNJFO) donated $5,500 last September to ANJRPC to use for the lawsuit.  I believe we're the ONLY group to do so.

There is no competition to see who can "carry all the water".  When it comes to the Rogers case, CNJFO was the only independent 2A group in the country to sign-on as a participant in an Amicus Brief....at the direction & insistence of Cheeseman-Jillard.

CNJFO works with any & EVERY group or individual that communicates with us.  ALWAYS DID & ALWAYS WILL.  There is no competition that we're aware of.  We have a fantastic relationship with all who choose to help us in any way. 

In closing, please consider donating directly to the Cheeseman-Jillard lawsuit fund.  There's no competition there either, just Cheeseman, Jillard and Factor.  Here's the link:  https://www.gofundme.com/restore-carry-nj?fbclid=IwAR1ckN4qv20zYnetY_jJc7X4PDKIiUHiPFBYwv-clbq-208J2EcFki1LUJs

Image may contain: 5 people, including David Rosenthal, indoor

Image may contain: 5 people, including William Korman, Anthony Colandro and David Rosenthal, people smiling

Rosey

 

 

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47 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Some DO work together; I know that CNJFO has worked very cooperatively with several other groups. I think you may have misunderstood his encouragement to get more people to join as a "slight" to other 2A groups. I feel certain he didn't mean it that way!

Personally? Looking at the big picture, I think the dues for all of these groups is cheap enough that EVERYONE who is pro-2A should belong to a few!! I happen to belong to the NRA, ANJRPC, CNJFO, and TWAW. Pick the ones YOU like - and join them. 

@Mrs. Peel you got it right!  Nothing I type is meant as a "slight".  It's merely factual info.  Either folks donated to Cheeseman-Jillard or they didn't!  If they did, and did it THROUGH CNJFO's MATCHING FUNDS CAMPAIGN, then the Coalition matched---dollar-for-dollar---the giver's gift.  $10 became $20 and $500 became a $1,000.00!  None of that would have been remotely possible without collecting the aforementioned dues & donations made to the Coalition BY FOLKS JUST LIKE YOU!  We did it because YOU CARED ENOUGH TO JOIN, to make us strong enough to be able to afford to DO IT!  And for THAT we all thank you!

Belonging & donating to several groups is the best path to success!

Rosey

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This Friday... 7/22/19... going to my local police station in Middlesex County... and applying for gun carry permit... between the 1 inch square pictures... certified signatures and certified check... they really don't make this application process easy.  Anyway, here's my "Letter of Need" ... I'm not naiive.  I realize will probably get rejected and then take through the legal system if I can find an affordable lawyer.  If anyone has any changes to the letter, please advise.  Otherwise, I'll go with this:

Dear Sir:

This letter of need to carry a handgun is based on the following:

 - I attend and worship at Jewish synagogues.  Due to the recent shootings at synagogues in the United States, I'm unable to pursue my constitutional right to practice my religion without a handgun permit.  In 2018, 11 worshippers were killed at a synagogue in Pittsburgh, PA.  In 2019, one worshipper was killed at a synagogue in Poway, CA.

 - Prior to these synagogue attacks, Jews were attacked in synagogues in University City, MO (1977); Rome, Italy (1982); Turkey (1986); Jerusalem (2014) and Copenhagen (2015).

 - I am a 30-year Army combat veteran.  I served in Bosnia & Iraq.  My sidearm in combat was a handgun, i.e., 9mm Beretta.  I've had considerable training in the safe operation of weapons in general and handguns in particular.  I would be happy to attend an additional safety course as a condition to being granted a permit to carry.

 - Constitutionally, the first amendment guarantees me the right to practice my religion freely.  Without a handgun carry permit, I am afraid for my safety and cannot practice my religion freely.  I'm too worried about being shot while worshipping and having no means to protect myself.

- Constitutionally, the Second Amendment guarantees me the right to ". . . keep and bear arms."  While some weapon restrictions are understandable, an outright ban prohibiting me from bearing my weapon where I'll need it, i.e., at synagogue, would clearly run counter to the Second Amendment.

I would be happy to answer any questions and/or elaborate on any issues.

Sincerely,

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Good letter, but it sets you up for them to issue a conditional permit, i.e. you will only be able to exercise your right to carry while actually worshipping at a synagogue and direct transport to and from.

I know that they issue conditional carry permits as I have a friend that is on the call list should the alarm at his place of employment be triggered. He is authorized to carry to and from his place of business when responding to an alarm. This is not anecdotal, I actually saw the permit and the stated conditions (it was probably 10 years ago, but nothing has changed in NJ in that regard).

I wish you luck in your endeavor.

Adios,

Pizza Bob

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12 minutes ago, Frank Thomas said:

Pizza Bob, your friend's conditional carry of gun is ridiculous and unconstitutional.  If your friend can be trusted to carry a weapon that should be it.  Shouldn't matter where he's carrying.  NJ politicians are so ridiculous.

It is what it is. This is NJ after all.

  • Agree 1

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For what it’s worth, this Wednesday I’m going to interview a candidate for a position where I work. His resume says he’s from Columbia and has been here since 2006. It also says he has a permit to carry. Needless to say I plan on pursuing this in the interview. I’ll report back. 

  • Crazy 1

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2 hours ago, BobA said:

For what it’s worth, this Wednesday I’m going to interview a candidate for a position where I work. His resume says he’s from Columbia and has been here since 2006. It also says he has a permit to carry. Needless to say I plan on pursuing this in the interview. I’ll report back. 

Former LEO.

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2 hours ago, BobA said:

For what it’s worth, this Wednesday I’m going to interview a candidate for a position where I work. His resume says he’s from Columbia and has been here since 2006. It also says he has a permit to carry. Needless to say I plan on pursuing this in the interview. I’ll report back.

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On 7/1/2019 at 5:22 PM, Frank Thomas said:

Is it worth trying for a gun carry permit?  And the legal fees that will follow from my appeals?  I live in Monroe Township, NJ in Middlesex County.  I attend synagogue regularly.  Given the shootings at synagogues recently, do I have a justifiable need?  Is my first amendment, to freedom of religion, being infringed by not issuing me a license to carry.  My synagogue is perfectly fine with members carrying weapons.  We had a former FBI agent who carried.  I served in the Army for 30 years; inlcluding two combat tours.  As a 30-year retired Army combat vet, I'm well-qualified to own and operate a handgun.  Should I apply for carry permit; get rejected and start a lawsuit?  Or better waiting for the US Supreme Court to hear the two cases from NYC and NJ?  Any idea when the Supreme Court will rule on either the NYC or NJ cases?  Thanks

 

This is a weird response but it would be easier for you to move to a pro carry state, get your address changed and then apply. It is almost impossible to get a carry permit in NJ even with sensible reasons on why you feel you need to carry. This is why there are so many unregistered fire arms on the streets illegally being carried. The more the state tries to take away, the more people take bigger risks to satisfy their needs. The state would rather see you dead with your head blown open then trying to protect yourself, even with a professional behind the trigger. Heck, when I drive through Camden to grab my pickles ( I get them at a wholesale place ) I really feel the need to bring a small handgun or something. I've seen people sitting at red lights get robbed right in front of me at gun point. In that case I would comply with the offender regardless if I had a gun or not. I would only fire if I was in full control and sitting in my car behind a steering wheel trying to pull a gun while one is already pointing at your head it is just better to comply and hope the offender doesn't shoot. Sticky situation, since some people would try to defend right away...but the offender has the upper hand. Sorry, got a little carried away.

 

 

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Michael, i read the brief on the lawsuit w/ the supreme court... one of the reasons NJ gave for outlawing guns outside the home was kind of what u said... by the time u got your gun... it would be too late.  So makes sense about not drawing a gun if you don't have time.  I have too much in NJ to just leave the State.  

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8 hours ago, BobA said:

I think I would have known that considering I have his resume. 

Not sure why someone would put that they have a CC on their resume or even disclose it to an employer, unless of course its a security company or that was his previous profession.

 

But I appreciate the sarcasm.:rolleyes:

 

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1 hour ago, nondisclosure said:

Not sure why someone would put that they have a CC on their resume or even disclose it to an employer, unless of course its a security company or that was his previous profession.

 

But I appreciate the sarcasm.:rolleyes:

 

Over the years I’ve read tons of resumes. I could publish a bathroom reader on the hilarity of them. 

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19 hours ago, MichaelDiggs said:

Heck, when I drive through Camden to grab my pickles ( I get them at a wholesale place ) I really feel the need to bring a small handgun or something.

Must be some dam good pickles to be put in harms way.

  • Haha 1

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I've come to the conclusion that it's impossible. A friend of mine has an uncle who is a pretty renowned chemist and had argued that someone could attempt to kidnap him to force him into making either drugs or chemical weapons and was denied. Although outlandish that does seem semi legitimate. I also know someone who was formerly a correctional officer who had multiple death threats by former inmates and he was given one but only for 1 year i believe and he was unsuccessful in getting it renewed after that. 

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