NJSP building non-nfa opinion.

[EngineerJet 186]

In short. No. Because it'll prevent an individual from making or possessing an unlawful firearm.

I dunno how this holds up legally without a law. The same argument can be made with building all ar15s. Since we we have to pin stocks and pin brakes. Wonder what a lawyer has to say about this?

[RUTGERS95 876]

njsp do not make law.  they hold as much opinion as you or I

[Bully 749]

1 hour ago, RUTGERS95 said:

njsp do not make law.  they hold as much opinion as you or I

I'm pretty sure you're correct however when you go in front of a judge because you chose to snub their recommendation who do you think will hold more sway with the local justice?  

Honestly, "you" may win the war on this.  But, in my opinion, you will lose many costly battles.

I'm not saying you should not do something you want to do.  Not at all.  Just be well aware of the potential trouble you may get in to by doing it.   

("YOU" was put in quotes because I don't mean you specifically, more a general purpose "you".)

[Krdshrk 3,802]

This is exactly what MM and DSI said in the non-NFA thread.

[PK90 3,547]

On 6/25/2019 at 12:56 PM, PK90 said:

Step 1: Restrict [check]

Step 2: Change Law

Step 3: Confiscate

[everythingisnothing 10]

So I bring my upper to an FFL and have them put it on my lower...

Are FFLs supposed to stop selling stripped lowers too? They fall into the same category ("firearm") and they are NOT equipped with the required features in the letter.

[ChrisJM981 919]

5 minutes ago, everythingisnothing said:

So I bring my upper to an FFL and have them put it on my lower...

The letter says manufactured and sold as a complete firearm in NJ. If the seller has a FFL 07 and marks it as his product that is an option. 

[everythingisnothing 10]

6 minutes ago, ChrisJM981 said:

The letter says manufactured and sold as a complete firearm in NJ. If the seller has a FFL 07 and marks it as his product that is an option. 

Reading it again, it only says assembled, not manufactured.  And sold "as a complete product".  I don't see anything that would require it to be remanufactured.

[PK90 3,547]

Just now, everythingisnothing said:

Reading it again, it only says assembled, not manufactured.  And sold "as a complete product".  I don't see anything that would require it to be remanufactured.

It has to be remanufacturered to be manufacturered again. It can't be assembled, ie gunsmithing. Which means that the FFL07 needs to mark it as his product, such as Name, City and State.

[everythingisnothing 10]

6 minutes ago, PK90 said:

It has to be remanufacturered to be manufacturered again. It can't be assembled, ie gunsmithing. Which means that the FFL07 needs to mark it as his product, such as Name, City and State.

I understand that part, I just don't see where this letter says it needs to be remanufactured by the FFL.  It simply says cannot be "assembled" by an individual.

And whether this actually is supported by the law is another matter.

[nondisclosure 55]

It’s pretty gross that the NJSP said, we can’t let you build these because you’re too stupid to build something legal out of a receiver.

constructive intent is nonsense. Buy a complete upper, slap a vfg, no intent after about 22 seconds... Build a lower slap a brace and there is no intent after the upper is built. They’ll have a 20 minute window to come in raid the house and kill the doggo before it is a legally constructed firearm.

[EngineerJet 186]

It says "necessary to prevent an individual from manufacturing or posessing an unlawful firearm". Well it's not considered manufacturing and since the end configuration is legal...

[PK90 3,547]

An attorney would pick this letter apart. But then you'll reach step 2.

[JohnnyB 4,151]

If they want to get us for constructive intent. What about the fact that owning this and another AR15 gives us the ability to easily swap lowers and have an SBR?

The fact is, if they want to.....They can get you!

[nondisclosure 55]

8 minutes ago, JohnnyB said:

If they want to get us for constructive intent. What about the fact that owning this and another AR15 gives us the ability to easily swap lowers and have an SBR?

The fact is, if they want to.....They can get you!

Ok so if you bought an MM DSI, they can get you for even legally owning a rifle and a legally purchased non-NFA firearm.... under constructive intent. 

[JohnnyB 4,151]

8 minutes ago, nondisclosure said:

Ok so if you bought an MM DSI, they can get you for even legally owning a rifle and a legally purchased non-NFA firearm.... under constructive intent. 

If they want to get you, yes.  Welcome to the Peoples Republic of New Jersey!

They would have to alter the upper so it could not be mated with a standard lower. I doubt they did that!

[JackDaWack 2,877]

Sounds like a complete load of bullshit. 

 

So they openly admit there is no law that says one can't be assembled.*

They say you cannot assemble one because you run the risk of violating other laws?*

They openly admit this is merely a precautionary statement.* 

However, the fact is you can assemble one and still be lawful, as the letter States, it's only illegal if you end up violating the constructive possession law which WE ALRaeADY KNEW.

But hey, what did you expect? Bunch of morons just couldn't leave it alone and had to ask the NJSP what their retarded opinion would be.

Once my firearm was completed, guess what... I don't have to worry about violating either law they posted... 

 

Just an FYI, with out explicitly say it this letter applies to rifles as well, and I have to say guys, you get what you ask for. When you order a threaded barrel to your house, and a not yet pinned stock... 

[EngineerJet 186]

Excuse me sir... Point me to the law that says it can't be built. Your opinion means jack

[JackDaWack 2,877]

4 hours ago, Bully said:

I'm pretty sure you're correct however when you go in front of a judge because you chose to snub their recommendation who do you think will hold more sway with the local justice?  

Honestly, "you" may win the war on this.  But, in my opinion, you will lose many costly battles.

I'm not saying you should not do something you want to do.  Not at all.  Just be well aware of the potential trouble you may get in to by doing it.   

("YOU" was put in quotes because I don't mean you specifically, more a general purpose "you".)

I would have to question what your even being charged with at that point. 

Owning a home assembled non nfa firearm is not illegal, as this letter fails to mention. 

They would HAVE to get you prior, parts in hand, with the ability to convert a rifle into a ln assualt weapon.  

[EngineerJet 186]

What I'd like to know is how many people in this state have been tried and convicted for intent to create an unlawful firearm. Seems like it's easy to charge you but to convict the burden of proof seems pretty high.

[ChrisJM981 919]

1 hour ago, everythingisnothing said:

Reading it again, it only says assembled, not manufactured.  And sold "as a complete product".  I don't see anything that would require it to be remanufactured.

Please see 3. 

[samtechlan 23]

Since it is the assembling of the firearm-as opposed to the possession-which is prohibited it would seem perfectly legal to assemble said firearm in PA before crossing the border into Venezuela/New Jersey.

[JackDaWack 2,877]

At the end of the day, this letter clears up perfectly well for me that it's OK to build one provided you take the necessary precautions to avoid violating the laws they referenced. 

[0Jeep4 87]

They want to be able to track them for when step 3 kicks in.

3 hours ago, PK90 said:

On 6/25/2019 at 3:56 PM, PK90 said:

Step 1: Restrict [check]

Step 2: Change Law

Step 3: Confiscate

How many post on the same topic, the world may never know?

[JackDaWack 2,877]

Maybe next we should ask them if it's legal to take apart our firearm to clean it. 

 

[0Jeep4 87]

8 minutes ago, JackDaWack said:

Maybe next we should ask them if it's legal to take apart our firearm to clean it. 

 

"Free Men Do Not Ask Permission To Bear Arms." - Thomas Jefferson

They don't need to. And any government that believes in a free citizenry would never infringe on their right to do so, but here we are....

[JackDaWack 2,877]

I updated the sticky thread with the notice.

I would like to be very clear here and that this notice does in fact outline a legal means to assemble one. You just have to avoid violating the two laws mentioned in it, which was already a disclaimer in the sticky thread. 

This really is a Nanny state ruling that is more about controlling people than the actual law. At this point, you can do what ever you want with the information. 

Keep in mind, if your interested in this, you probably built a rifle at some point.. So remember you had the same issues then that are outlined here. If you figured it out then, you can figure it out now. 

 

[Smokin .50 1,907]

The real questions ARE:

1.  How snarky are you gonna get with Brett Bloom, the guy who's on our side & trying his best to see things our way?

2.  How many folks will actually TRAIN with this platform so that they can PERFORM with it when the SHTF?

3.  Do you keep the Zombie Target at 7 yards or do ya send it all the way out to 25 yards?

4.  How long will it take for "non gun guy Cops" to be able to discern the somewhat uncomfortable sameness between this new class of AR and all the stuff they see now that raises eyebrows?

5.  Who will be the first Schmuck to build one w/o a serial numbered lower & then walk it into a NJSP Barracks and ask how to register it (cue the idiot in Sussex Co. that worked at a Machine Shop across the street from the Cop Shop)?

Sometimes just because you CAN doesn't mean ya should....so tread carefully  

~R

[Bully 749]

2 hours ago, JackDaWack said:

I would have to question what your even being charged with at that point. 

Owning a home assembled non nfa firearm is not illegal, as this letter fails to mention. 

They would HAVE to get you prior, parts in hand, with the ability to convert a rifle into a ln assualt weapon.  

Regardless, it's gonna cost someone a ton of money to prove that what they're doing is legal.  Most I know aren't willing to shell out that money.  Honestly most I know just run at the mouth and when the laws change they're the first in line to comply.  

[RUTGERS95 876]

3 hours ago, EngineerJet said:

Excuse me sir... Point me to the law that says it can't be built. Your opinion means jack

Exactly.  njsp mean diddly