DirtyDigz 1,793 Posted December 4, 2019 I came across David Cline's story through a NJ gun-related facebook group. I've had an online conversation with David but haven't independently validated any of it before I decided to pass this information on. He claims he's been in touch with NJ2AS and that they've verified his story. My understanding - His ex-wife filed a TRO against him in Mercer County in May of 2019 and he had his firearms and archery equipment seized due to that TRO. In June of 2019 a judge dismissed the TRO; David was not convicted of anything in regards to his dispute with his ex-wife and other than the seizure for the TRO there is nothing else in his record that prohibits him from owning firearms in NJ. He has requested the return of his firearms and archery equipment, but the Mercer county prosecutor has neither returned his property nor raised an objection to the return of the same (which should happen within 45 days). David retained a lawyer to file a motion to force Mercer county to appear before a judge on the return of his property but is running out of funds to continue the court proceedings (he is a grad student). Below is the link to his gofundme for legal fees which has the following description written by him: https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-david-get-back-his-property-wrongfully-taken Quote In May of 2019, my propery of firearms, bows, and crossbows was taken from me due to a false TRO filed by my ex-wife. After a contentious court battle in June 2019, I was found Not Guilty and the Restraining Order was dismissed by a ruling of the judge. By law, the prosecutor is to take possession of any items seized and then has 45 days to decide whether or not to object to their return. If objected to a hearing is held to determine if the items should be returned. It has been over half a year and dispite knowing that the case exists, the prosecutor has refused to issue a decision. I have hired a lawyer to regain possession of my property and he has filed a Motion to Retun Property to force the County to appear before a judge to explain why they refuse to issue a determination and follow the law in NJ with regards to the return of personal property. However the time has come to replenish my retainer and I am out of money. Between the false court battles instigated by my ex wife and Grad School, my funds are low. Help me fight back against New Jersey and their uncommitted attitude towards the 2nd Amendment. I enjoy hunting and competitive NRA target shooting with my local club. But it is not just firearms. My archery bows and crossbows were also taken from me and have not been returned. I am an active archer and have competed in local and USA Archery tournaments, winning 2nd place in the 2018 NJ State Championships and 1st place in the 2018 Easter Seaboard Regional Championships. Because of my ex-wife's false TRO I was unable to complete in the 2019 season and remain over half a year out of practice. Therefore, I am humbly asking you for help. In order to proced with my motion against the County of New Jersey, I need $1,000 to replenish my retainer. Help me get back my property that is being unjustly kept from me in defiance of the laws of the State of New Jersey. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted December 4, 2019 I would think one of the NJ pro-2A groups would want to pick this up on his behalf ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DirtyDigz 1,793 Posted December 4, 2019 47 minutes ago, tomk62 said: I would think one of the NJ pro-2A groups would want to pick this up on his behalf ... He's already talking with NJ2AS. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RUTGERS95 889 Posted December 4, 2019 liberalism is a disease Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pizza Bob 1,488 Posted December 5, 2019 I'm confused. If his property was seized by the Monmouth County sheriff's department (as per the lawyer's letter), why is he seeking redress from the Mercer county prosecutor. Not too impressed with the lawyer's letter either. Adios, Pizza Bob 1 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DirtyDigz 1,793 Posted December 5, 2019 Bob, my *guess* is that he was in Monmouth and his ex-wife was in Mercer, or vice versa, at the time the TRO went into effect. I assume the agency in the county of residence executed the seizure and then transferred to the county where the TRO was executed? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
W2MC 1,699 Posted December 5, 2019 THAT is a demand letter? Did anyone at least proofread the letter before it was sent? I hope you didn't pay in advance.......because I wouldn't give his office a nickel for that letter. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted December 5, 2019 I cringe when I see "guns" and "weapons", "firearms" is a much better term. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted December 5, 2019 I see no mention of a mandatory Weapons Forfeiture Hearing. Did the defendant appear? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drcline 8 Posted December 5, 2019 There has not been a Weapons Forfeiture Hearing. The State has been holding on to my weapons since May and has refused to release them or even say if they object to their return. The TRO was filed in Mercer and I live in Monmouth. Therefore I would have to go through Mercer to get them back. -Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scorpio64 5,119 Posted December 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Drcline said: and has refused to release them 1) is the "state" holding your personal property. Just a tip. Stop calling your firearms weapons. Also, is it the state holding your property or is it a county prosecutor's office? 2) do you have any correspondence (letters, emails, record of phone call etc.) where someone officially denied you the return of your "personal property"? 3) did you also surrender your FPID? 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drcline 8 Posted December 5, 2019 7 minutes ago, Scorpio64 said: 1) is the "state" holding your personal property. Just a tip. Stop calling your firearms weapons. Also, is it the state holding your property or is it a county prosecutor's office? 2) do you have any correspondence (letters, emails, record of phone call etc.) where someone officially denied you the return of your "personal property"? 3) did you also surrender your FPID? It is my understanding that the County Prosecutor of the county in which the TRO was filled has to request the property from the offices which siezed them (in this case Monmouth County). Once in Prosecutor's possession, this starts the 45 day clock they have to object to their return. In this instance, dispite me reaching out to them in August and my attorney in September, they have not taken possession of them as of September. They were seized back in May. After September, I let my attorney handle it so I do not know the current status. Even if they took possession of them in September, it has now been over 60 days since my lawyer contacted them and we have recieved no word of a Hearing being scheduled. A Motion to Return Property has been drafted and will be submitted to the court along with a brief today. No official denial has been issued. They just stopped returning my attorney's phone calls and did not reply to his letters. Yes, your FID is seized along with any property. In this instance I has my FID for all of 6 months. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scorpio64 5,119 Posted December 5, 2019 51 minutes ago, Drcline said: County Prosecutor of the county in which the TRO was filled has to request the property from the offices which siezed them (in this case Monmouth County). Are your firearms and FPID still in Mon Co. possession (at your local PD) and waiting on Mercer to authorize return? I'm still having a little trouble understanding the chain of physical custody vs administrative custody. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tony357 386 Posted December 6, 2019 Should have used firearms in place of weapons. He hired the wrong lawyers. personnel property would even be better. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Drcline 8 Posted December 6, 2019 20 hours ago, Scorpio64 said: Are your firearms and FPID still in Mon Co. possession (at your local PD) and waiting on Mercer to authorize return? I'm still having a little trouble understanding the chain of physical custody vs administrative custody. As of September (when I personally contacted Mon Co. and Colts Neck PD), the property was still in their possession. They confirmed this and said that they would not forward the property to the prosecutor until they received that request from the prosecutor's office. CNPD is holding all my non-firearms (competition archery bows and crossbows). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted December 6, 2019 Although revised in 2004, I never saw this, as I retired in 2010. It makes a good read. dv-tro-trng-guide.pdf Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scorpio64 5,119 Posted December 6, 2019 8 hours ago, Drcline said: As of September (when I personally contacted Mon Co. and Colts Neck PD), the property was still in their possession. Everything will remain in their possession until it's determined administratively (ie Red tape) whether you will get it back or not. Them being in your possession would be ideal, of course, but it's a good sign that they are still at local PD. I would go to local PD and talk to Chief and ask for help. Not saying or asking anything unnecessary. Right to the point. My shit was taken, I cooperated, I went to court and the reason you took my shit no longer exists. Here is the proof, exactly how do I go about getting my shit back. Please don't tell me you are not involved and I have to talk to someone else. You have my shit, what do I need to do to get it back. I'm asking you to please help me understand this process. Not that I've had a lot of involvement with police, but in all my years I only came across one that was a dick. If working from the top down isn't working, try a different approach, starting from the bottom where your personal property is physically located, up to the pen that needs to sign a paper authorizing the return. It's all part of the process. If you meet with the chief, one of two things is going to happen. The chief will either be helpful or unhelpful. If the latter happens, at least you know what you are dealing with. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted December 7, 2019 I would sue them for unlawful seizure of property. Im sure once they get the notice they will start moving.. Im sure red flag laws will make it to SCOTUS under similar conditions. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
W2MC 1,699 Posted December 7, 2019 Throw-in a complaint of official misconduct, too. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indianajonze 379 Posted December 7, 2019 how is archery equipment seized? "weapons"? if that's the case, where do you draw the line? did they also take all of his kitchen knives, baseball bats and hammers? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ray Ray 3,566 Posted December 7, 2019 8 minutes ago, Indianajonze said: how is archery equipment seized? "weapons"? if that's the case, where do you draw the line? did they also take all of his kitchen knives, baseball bats and hammers? They watch The Walking Dead too much. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Golf battery 1,222 Posted December 7, 2019 This law firm wrote a very shoddy letter. Misspelling and bad grammar. Jail house lawyer stuff. Im not surprised the courts didnt take it seeiusly. No case identifiers or citing any laws. Im not surprised this is going nowhere. Ask for a full refund of dues. Get a competent legal firm. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Indianajonze 379 Posted December 7, 2019 1 hour ago, Ray Ray said: They watch The Walking Dead too much. yes, maybe. but it's absurd. there's no background check for archery equipment and no record keeping. he could have just bought a new bow that same day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
W2MC 1,699 Posted December 7, 2019 Not a good sign when I can't find this lawyer "Jonathan Poling" via a quick internet search.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted December 9, 2019 I'm not sure he's actually a lawyer. Note that he wrote "this law firm" and he's not listed in the top left of the letter. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fslater 62 Posted December 9, 2019 I can predict the outcome of this as long as its at the state level: This court finds that the precedent set by the NJ 30 day time frame to issue a FID or Pistol Purchase Permit being completely meaningless, that same standard may be applied to TRO regulation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
YankeeSC 1,204 Posted December 9, 2019 3 hours ago, tomk62 said: I'm not sure he's actually a lawyer. Note that he wrote "this law firm" and he's not listed in the top left of the letter. Yup. https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonathan-poling-3ab7a911b/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted December 9, 2019 Oh boy. Dude get a real lawyer! Might speed things up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deerpark 83 Posted December 18, 2019 What a goddam nightmare. Do they steal your ammo as well? How does it work if youve sold or moved your property our of state? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites