Oakridgefirearms 224 Posted February 19, 2020 On 2/12/2020 at 10:38 PM, ChrisJM981 said: If you read through it an "in house" poster comments about becoming a target for the NJSP and ATF. It is my understanding that owning a tax stamped NFA firearm allows them to search your residence without a warrant for an inspection. That may not be everyone's cup of tea. Edit: I've been searching for the warrantless search that I found mentioned and it might not be accurate. I'm still looking for supporting evidence. Having an NFA item subjects you to inspection of that item. If the ATF showed up to do an inspection of that item you could bring it to your front door to allow them to inspect it without them coming inside. It does not give them authority to turn your house inside out without a warrant. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 19, 2020 On 2/16/2020 at 9:21 PM, mikey_golds said: Go on.... All I want to know is how to apply for some! Anything to flip it to this state is worth a few hundred bucks. 3 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shooter28 153 Posted February 20, 2020 This is awesome. Ever since the non-NFA firearms started rolling out, I wanted to build a 300blk. Problem was, I didnt want a 11.5" barrel on it. Here we go. 8.5" 300blk coming my way. @mikey_golds Care to explain the process? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 20, 2020 1 hour ago, shooter28 said: This is awesome. Ever since the non-NFA firearms started rolling out, I wanted to build a 300blk. Problem was, I didnt want a 11.5" barrel on it. Here we go. 8.5" 300blk coming my way. @mikey_golds Care to explain the process? I think you just file an ATF form 4. I've been waiting for a response as to the procedure. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: I think you just file an ATF form 4. I've been waiting for a response as to the procedure. So the notification emails go to my spam folder now, even though I have clicked not spam a bunch of times. the procedure is straight forward: 1) buy stripped lower receiver 2) retain copy of receipts, 4473 (scan this on genius scan when at your FFL) 3) fill out ATF form 1 on e-forms 4) in the electronic file section attach the 4473 --> this is to prove its never been a rifle, pistol or shotgun --> basically if its been a rifle or shotgun you are creating a sawed off shotgun per NJ Law --> if its been a pistol you are creating an assault weapon per NJ Law 5) send in your fingerprints --> do not send certified, they don't have someone always signing 6) send notification to CLEO 7) wait 30 days 8) approve = get engraving down first name, last name municipality , NJ 9) Enjoy 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 20, 2020 11 minutes ago, mikey_golds said: So the notification emails go to my spam folder now, even though I have clicked not spam a bunch of times. the procedure is straight forward: 1) buy stripped lower receiver 2) retain copy of receipts, 4473 (scan this on genius scan when at your FFL) 3) fill out ATF form 1 on e-forms 4) in the electronic file section attach the 4473 --> this is to prove its never been a rifle, pistol or shotgun --> basically if its been a rifle or shotgun you are creating a sawed off shotgun per NJ Law --> if its been a pistol you are creating an assault weapon per NJ Law 5) send in your fingerprints --> do not send certified, they don't have someone always signing 6) send notification to CLEO 7) wait 30 days 8) approve = get engraving down first name, last name municipality , NJ 9) Enjoy Awesome! I was just looking at form 1 (permission to manufacture) vs form4(permission to transfer) Thanks! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted February 20, 2020 Steps 2 and 4 really aren't necessary. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisJM981 924 Posted February 20, 2020 1 minute ago, PK90 said: Steps 2 and 4 really aren't necessary. Why not? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 20, 2020 1 minute ago, ChrisJM981 said: Why not? 3 minutes ago, PK90 said: Steps 2 and 4 really aren't necessary. correct they are not necessary however the ATF examiner requested it from me because of NJ law of building something that was once a pistol, rifle or shotgun. Many replies are why does the ATF care about state - the ATF examiners will not approve you for something illegal in your state, try to apply to form 1 a suppressor in NJ for example. its legal federally, your form 1 will be denied. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 20, 2020 37 minutes ago, mikey_golds said: correct they are not necessary however the ATF examiner requested it from me because of NJ law of building something that was once a pistol, rifle or shotgun. Many replies are why does the ATF care about state - the ATF examiners will not approve you for something illegal in your state, try to apply to form 1 a suppressor in NJ for example. its legal federally, your form 1 will be denied. I thought federal law didnt want you building them from any pistol rifle shotgun either? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 20, 2020 27 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: I thought federal law didnt want you building them from any pistol rifle shotgun either? no sir, federally if you have an AR Pistol for example and want to add a vertical foregrip you apply for an AOW and once approved you have it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 20, 2020 9 minutes ago, mikey_golds said: no sir, federally if you have an AR Pistol for example and want to add a vertical foregrip you apply for an AOW and once approved you have it. Ah, but you cant even have an AR pistol in NJ to convert. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 20, 2020 56 minutes ago, JackDaWack said: Ah, but you cant even have an AR pistol in NJ to convert. correct. converting a pistol of any sort in NJ creates an assault weapon by law, so the ATF would deny that application but firearms are legal in NJ, a lower receiver per the GCA is a firearm, and there is no issue in converting a firearm nor are AOWs banned by name 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 20, 2020 5 hours ago, mikey_golds said: correct. converting a pistol of any sort in NJ creates an assault weapon by law, so the ATF would deny that application but firearms are legal in NJ, a lower receiver per the GCA is a firearm, and there is no issue in converting a firearm nor are AOWs banned by name I'm not following, if a NJ legal pistol has a fvg, it becomes an AOW and with a stamp would be legal...and no longer considered a pistol by law. So how can the assualt weapons ban even apply? You're asking the ATF permission to convert a legal NJ pistol, INTO an AOW.. I dont see anything in NJ law that says you cant take a legal pistol and convert it to a AOW or other firearm.. I can understand if they want to prevent people from taking already illegal pistols and reclassifying them... I dont see how you are creating the following: A semi-automatic pistol that has an ability to accept a detachable magazine and has at least two of the following: (1) An ammunition magazine that attaches to the pistol outside of the pistol grip; (2) A threaded barrel capable of accepting a barrel extender, flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer; (3) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles the barrel and that permits the shooter to hold the firearm with the non-trigger hand without being burned; (4) Manufactured weight of 50 ounces or more when the pistol is unloaded; and/or (5) A semi-automatic version of an automatic firearm; and And the ATF says once its AOW stamped, it's no longer a pistol. https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/what-does-“any-other-weapon-mean What does “any other weapon" mean? The term "any other weapon" means any weapon or device capable of being concealed on the person from which a shot can be discharged through the energy of an explosive, a pistol or revolver having a barrel with a smooth bore designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell, weapons with combination shotgun and rifle barrels 12 inches or more, less than 18 inches in length, from which only a single discharge can be made from either barrel without manual reloading, and shall include any such weapon which may be readily restored to fire. Such term shall not include a pistol or a revolver having a rifled bore, or rifled bores, or weapons designed, made, or intended to be fired from the shoulder and not capable of firing fixed ammunition. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 21, 2020 22 hours ago, JackDaWack said: omes an AOW and with a stamp would be legal...and no longer considered a pistol by law. So how can the assualt weapons ban even apply? From my understandting and what the ATF examiner and CC'd legal group said. just because you become an AOW you don't lose your states classification. So AOW - Pistol would mean in the eyes of NJ its still a pistol. In my case since it starts as receiver a firearm so its AOW - Firearm ... Honestly its 200 bucks and if you get denied you get that money back in 24 hours. Give it a shot... 22 hours ago, JackDaWack said: ont see anything in NJ law that says you cant take a legal pistol and convert it to a AOW or other firearm.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 21, 2020 1 hour ago, mikey_golds said: From my understandting and what the ATF examiner and CC'd legal group said. just because you become an AOW you don't lose your states classification. So AOW - Pistol would mean in the eyes of NJ its still a pistol. In my case since it starts as receiver a firearm so its AOW - Firearm ... Honestly its 200 bucks and if you get denied you get that money back in 24 hours. Give it a shot... I'm not really concerned because anything I would turn from a pistol to AOW wouldnt be legal to begin with. More just curious as to why they would make those claims.. I really just want to make a PDW in 9MM and .45acp. Looking for receivers as we speak. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mikey_golds 14 Posted February 21, 2020 1 hour ago, JackDaWack said: I'm not really concerned because anything I would turn from a pistol to AOW wouldnt be legal to begin with. More just curious as to why they would make those claims.. I really just want to make a PDW in 9MM and .45acp. Looking for receivers as we speak. I kinda just rolled with the claims. FM Products makes high quality lowers and uppers for dope prices. thats mine from reddit. FM Product lower, complete 7.5 inch upper, with a blast diffuser to bring it to 8.25. they make 5 inch models as well with a tri lug so if you ever move out of the state you can grab a suppressor. Glock mags, last round hold open. my upper is side charging the 5 inch models are reg charging handle. Their bolt is great, I used a law tac folder (wouldn't do it again) CMC 3.5 pound single stage trigger and blitzkrieg standard buffer with orange sprinco spring 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 22, 2020 Ive had my eye on a foxtrot Mike lower, and PSA is running a sale right now!! "Take14" coupon code! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisJM981 924 Posted February 24, 2020 On 2/22/2020 at 1:23 PM, JackDaWack said: Ive had my eye on a foxtrot Mike lower, and PSA is running a sale right now!! "Take14" coupon code! Do you have a link? I can't seem to find any Foxtrot Mike products on their website. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 24, 2020 4 hours ago, ChrisJM981 said: Do you have a link? I can't seem to find any Foxtrot Mike products on their website. Sorry, it was Primary Arms. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
capt14k 2,051 Posted February 24, 2020 On 2/21/2020 at 10:51 AM, mikey_golds said: From my understandting and what the ATF examiner and CC'd legal group said. just because you become an AOW you don't lose your states classification. So AOW - Pistol would mean in the eyes of NJ its still a pistol. In my case since it starts as receiver a firearm so its AOW - Firearm ... Honestly its 200 bucks and if you get denied you get that money back in 24 hours. Give it a shot... Good for you. About time someone went against the grain. Wonder what my chances of getting a tax stamp for a MG-34 would be. Machine Guns are allowed in NJ if approved by a judge. I'm sure someone rich and connected legally has MG in NJ. Best part is you aren't restricted on magazine size or belt links. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CMJeepster 2,766 Posted February 25, 2020 18 hours ago, capt14k said: Good for you. About time someone went against the grain. Wonder what my chances of getting a tax stamp for a MG-34 would be. Machine Guns are allowed in NJ if approved by a judge. I'm sure someone rich and connected legally has MG in NJ. Best part is you aren't restricted on magazine size or belt links. Just take a ride through Camden with a briefcase full of cash and I'm sure you'll find one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 28, 2020 I plan on filing for one when i pick up my lower next week.. I'm all giddiddygoooo, cant wait Any advice on fingerprints? I can order the cards for a few bucks and have my pd do it... I know I can also call the ATF for them but I wonder if it's even worth my time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shooter28 153 Posted February 28, 2020 How long do FFLs keep copies of the 4473? I have a unassembled lower from the other year and wondering if I can call and get a copy of that form to attach to he ATF form 1. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted February 28, 2020 Take a selfie, and copy and paste it onto the form. Roll your own prints onto free forms from ATF. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 28, 2020 50 minutes ago, PK90 said: Take a selfie, and copy and paste it onto the form. Roll your own prints onto free forms from ATF. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Oakridgefirearms 224 Posted February 28, 2020 1 hour ago, shooter28 said: How long do FFLs keep copies of the 4473? I have a unassembled lower from the other year and wondering if I can call and get a copy of that form to attach to he ATF form 1. It would be cheaper to buy a new one. The paperwork gets archived and would probably take a long time find. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PK90 3,569 Posted February 28, 2020 "Other" was added several years ago. Before that, the lower probably was sold as a long gun. All my forms went to ATF in 2013 so I can't check when it changed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JackDaWack 2,894 Posted February 28, 2020 I actually found the request page for the free fingerprint card right on the ATF website. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tallday 10 Posted March 21, 2020 On 2/20/2020 at 9:18 AM, mikey_golds said: So the notification emails go to my spam folder now, even though I have clicked not spam a bunch of times. the procedure is straight forward: 1) buy stripped lower receiver 2) retain copy of receipts, 4473 (scan this on genius scan when at your FFL) 3) fill out ATF form 1 on e-forms 4) in the electronic file section attach the 4473 --> this is to prove its never been a rifle, pistol or shotgun --> basically if its been a rifle or shotgun you are creating a sawed off shotgun per NJ Law --> if its been a pistol you are creating an assault weapon per NJ Law 5) send in your fingerprints --> do not send certified, they don't have someone always signing 6) send notification to CLEO 7) wait 30 days 8) approve = get engraving down first name, last name municipality , NJ 9) Enjoy can you get the engraving done prior? should not make a difference right? just thinking of having it done before finish applied Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites