Grapeshot 301 Posted September 6, 2020 So, I used to play a lot of paintball, but haven't played in years. Was thinking of setting up my Tippman 98 with "pepperballs" for a "less than lethal" home defense alternative. Anybody done this? Recommendations? Stupid idea? Pepperball recommendations? And this would be a deterrent, and not fired indoors. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted September 6, 2020 Stupid idea 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grapeshot 301 Posted September 6, 2020 Well that was fast! It looks like the police actually use these. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted September 6, 2020 In my opinion if you need to defend yourself or loved ones at your home then the only option is lethal force. If you dont feel you need lethal force then why do you need to defend yourself at all? A deterrent not to be used in the home? I dont see how that would even be legal anywhere let alone NJ. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnnyB 4,289 Posted September 6, 2020 18 minutes ago, Grapeshot said: "less than lethal" home defense alternative. Less than lethal will get you or a loved one hurt or killed. Do you think the perp that invades your home will be armed with a paintball gun? If someone breaks into your house and is threatening you or your family.....Lethal force is the only choice! Nuff said! 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted September 6, 2020 4 hours ago, Grapeshot said: Well that was fast! It looks like the police actually use these. I think the fundamental difference is in the goal when police use less than leathal force vs when you would be using it. An officer is upholding the law and therefore must engage with persons who are not themselves offering a leathal threat to his person. His goals are along the lines of upholding the law, making a safe arrest and maintaining the peace. In a home defense situation you are defending you and your families lives and you do not have anything aside from defense of yourself or others from grievous bodily harm or death to worry about. Guy breaks your window and steals your lamp and runs off you dont need to make an arrest, you dont need to stop him with any force. So the question is when you are only really applying force in those narrow circumstances where self defense is justifiable do you want a tool that can only induce pain as a means of compliance? Pepperballs will not shut down someone's motor functions, they only cause pain and discomfort. So if someone is used to that kind of pain or has been altered chemically so they dont feel that pain as acutely as they should then your tool cannot help you further save for its ability to be used as a cudgel. A firearm on the other hand can cause considerable pain as well as stop motor functions. The police have to deal with people that dont justify self defense, you on the otherhand do not. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Grapeshot 301 Posted September 6, 2020 All good points. No pepperballs for me. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 6, 2020 “Deadly force is the force that a person uses, which he/she knows, or SHOULD know, has the reasonable chance of causing death or serious bodily harm. It’s use is justified only under extreme circumstance, as a last resort, when all other lesser means have failed, or cannot reasonably be employed...” When someone has unlawfully entered your home, it’s time to employ deadly force to protect your life, and the lives of your family members. Leas than lethal force will get you/family members killed. Your ‘less than lethal’ means stop at the front door. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AlDente67 563 Posted September 7, 2020 Everyone who played painball knows that the guy hit must stand down and leave the field. What's the issue? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yukongt2000 3 Posted September 7, 2020 If you look at some of the youtube videos that test various pepperball brands out there, it seems fairly ineffective unless you get them near their face. Accuracy is also an issue at any distance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 7, 2020 Unless you are LEO using pepper balls for crowd/riot control, using paintballs is a stupid idea. A stupid idea that will likely get you killed in a HD scenario. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bt Doctur 188 Posted September 7, 2020 stupid against an armed intruder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 7, 2020 15 minutes ago, Bt Doctur said: stupid against an armed intruder Even against an unarmed intruder. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeke 5,504 Posted September 7, 2020 Tofu home defense always ends up like tofo. Don’t do tofo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
voyager9 3,417 Posted September 7, 2020 Pepper is for steak, not home defense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winmag45 14 Posted September 8, 2020 I was thinking of one of the pepperball launchers,to carry but most are clunky.Carrying one with you might be good if you encounter one of these peaceful protests.The launcher shoots 5 rounds so you may be able to use it to get you out of bad situation.The problem as I see it is there is a powdery cloud that is created so in the house the distance may be too close.I think the best place for them is probably crowd control.Stay safe!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted September 8, 2020 16 minutes ago, winmag45 said: I was thinking of one of the pepperball launchers,to carry but most are clunky.Carrying one with you might be good if you encounter one of these peaceful protests.The launcher shoots 5 rounds so you may be able to use it to get you out of bad situation.The problem as I see it is there is a powdery cloud that is created so in the house the distance may be too close.I think the best place for them is probably crowd control.Stay safe!! I would be very wary of carrying a pepperball gun into that kind of situation. First off with 5 shots you probably arent controling a second wave of "protesters" after you "gassed" their friends. Second thing would be anything that looks like a gun is probably going to be treated like a gun, do you really want to be beaten to death by a skateboard only to get kicked out of the place upstairs because you went on a rampage aafter the guy got off because he claims self defense because he thought "you had a gun". Finally, I'd say the same thing regarding home defense as concealed carrying a pepperball gun, do you really want something that cannot actually stop someone in a life or death situation? Crowd control is for the police, you dont need to do that. If they cross the line and are attacking your home or business then its go time and better a firearm than spices imo. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
winmag45 14 Posted September 8, 2020 Well,yes the situation will dictate the response.I think it might be useful to create enough diversion to escape.The more choices the better.The unit I was looking at doesn't look like a gun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 8, 2020 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Handyman 5,682 Posted September 8, 2020 20 minutes ago, winmag45 said: The unit I was looking at doesn't look like a gun. It's a lightsaber! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted September 8, 2020 19 minutes ago, winmag45 said: Well,yes the situation will dictate the response.I think it might be useful to create enough diversion to escape.The more choices the better.The unit I was looking at doesn't look like a gun. Tactial fleshlight? 2 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted September 8, 2020 30 minutes ago, winmag45 said: Well,yes the situation will dictate the response.I think it might be useful to create enough diversion to escape.The more choices the better.The unit I was looking at doesn't look like a gun. That doesn't look like something one could easily conceal on their person without a bag of some sort. Also without a pistol grip(or otherwise contour to your hand) that looks really hard to retain if someone tries to yank it from you. I'd be wary of someone using it against me. It's up to you but to me it seems like a low reward high risk option. A knife fits your hand better, a maglite would make for a better blunt object plus when you hold it in an over the shoulder position it is harder to take away from you, and ultimately situational awareness and staying within sprinting distance of your vehicle is probably a better bet imo. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 8, 2020 4 minutes ago, CF1782 said: That doesn't look like something one could easily conceal on their person without a bag of some sort. Also without a pistol grip(or otherwise contour to your hand) that looks really hard to retain if someone tries to yank it from you. I'd be wary of someone using it against me. It's up to you but to me it seems like a low reward high risk option. A knife fits your hand better, a maglite would make for a better blunt object plus when you hold it in an over the shoulder position it is harder to take away from you, and ultimately situational awareness and staying within sprinting distance of your vehicle is probably a better bet imo. I think being the ‘grey man’, and evading the situation is your best defense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Posted September 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Displaced Texan said: I think being the ‘grey man’, and evading the situation is your best defense. That's kinda what I was trying to get at with situational awareness, avoid the situation and if you see it coming get in your car and leave. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Displaced Texan 11,653 Posted September 8, 2020 I have a recent story about being the ‘grey man’ while I was in a business trip to Richmond. While I am a bit hesitant to share it here, remaining low profile, and slipping away is a VERY viable line of defense. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
1LtCAP 4,259 Posted September 8, 2020 On 9/5/2020 at 8:04 PM, Grapeshot said: So, I used to play a lot of paintball, but haven't played in years. Was thinking of setting up my Tippman 98 with "pepperballs" for a "less than lethal" home defense alternative. Anybody done this? Recommendations? Stupid idea? Pepperball recommendations? And this would be a deterrent, and not fired indoors. On 9/5/2020 at 8:09 PM, Grapeshot said: Well that was fast! It looks like the police actually use these. i've seen many videos of police using these against the burn/loot/murder rioter/terrorists. i've also seen many instances of these not even making those nutters flinch. i don't think i'd want to defend me and mine in the home using those. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Malsua 1,422 Posted September 8, 2020 The only way this works for home defense is if someone is on your roof like over the weekend They are just there. They aren't trying to break in but the cops aren't coming. Pop a few of these at them to encourage them to leave. Maybe one falls off and breaks his neck. Kinda like a bonus. If they start coming at you? Let them meet their spirit guide in person. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fishnut 2,358 Posted September 8, 2020 6 minutes ago, Malsua said: The only way this works for home defense is if someone is on your roof like over the weekend They are just there. They aren't trying to break in but the cops aren't coming. Pop a few of these at them to encourage them to leave. Maybe one falls off and breaks his neck. Kinda like a bonus. If they start coming at you? Let them meet their spirit guide in person. Just take the latter away. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites