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NJ FID Carry for Long Guns

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1 hour ago, StarGazer said:

I remember reading somewhere that with a NJ FID a person can have an unloaded rifle or shotgun in a vehicle at all times.

Can someone elaborate on this?  Can you have ammo?  How to store?  Etc.

Thanks for any and all information.

There are some restrictions. Off hand, school grounds are one location that the card doesn't matter. There are likely more. 

While you aren't required to case a rifle or shotgun, I wouldn't leave it in plain sight, even cased. There is what is legal, and what is potentially going to cause you a headache and/or lots of money to sort out. 

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I will add that it must be in trunk, unloaded and separate from the ammo. The ammo must also be in the trunk but NOT in the gun!

False.

I know the answer to all of this, but for those that may ask....I own a pickup. There is no trunk. 

If there is no trunk, it must be out of the drivers reach, but that is for handguns. Long guns do not have these restrictions. 

 

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14 minutes ago, InFamous said:

False.

I know the answer to all of this, but for those that may ask....I own a pickup. There is no trunk. 

If there is no trunk, it must be out of the drivers reach, but that is for handguns. Long guns do not have these restrictions. 

 

Of course a pickup is different!  If a vehicle with a trunk, it must be there! 

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34 minutes ago, InFamous said:

Even dreaded NAPPEN said long gun can be hanging out your front window, although not advised, unloaded with FID and legally you're safe. 

 

Handgun is different though. 

 

I saw that clip of Nappen on YouTube.  He also said that a loaded magazine equals a loaded gun as NJSP can say it is part of the firearm.  This is contrary to the NJSP website that tells you how to transport firearms; which allows for loaded mags.

NJ firearms law is a disaster, on purpose, to jam up the law abiding population or just discourage them from exercising their rights.

Out of curiosity, why is Nappen dreaded?

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11 hours ago, JohnnyB said:

Of course a pickup is different!  If a vehicle with a trunk, it must be there! 

That's for transport under the Firearm Owners Protection Act (FOPA). That would apply if you did not have a NJ Firearms Purchaser Identification Card. 

Again, what is legal and what a LEO puts you in the back of his car for do not always match up. There are incidents referenced & linked throughout NJGF. The one that sticks in my mind is the young adult in Cherry Hill arrested for having a collapsible stock on a pump shotgun, which is totally legal. 

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4 hours ago, ChrisJM981 said:

That's for transport under the Firearm Owners Protection Act (FOPA). That would apply if you did not have a NJ Firearms Purchaser Identification Card. 

Again, what is legal and what a LEO puts you in the back of his car for do not always match up. There are incidents referenced & linked throughout NJGF. The one that sticks in my mind is the young adult in Cherry Hill arrested for having a collapsible stock on a pump shotgun, which is totally legal. 

The laws are so confusing, they trip up cops as well.  There is significant liability for a false arrest and it can easily cost a town a lot of money if they do this to the wrong person (i.e. someone with the knowledge and deep pockets to fight back).

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8 hours ago, StarGazer said:

While transporting a rifle to the range, I can stop with the family for food/bathroom breaks along the way and leave the gun in the vehicle?

 

On 9/27/2020 at 9:11 PM, StarGazer said:

with a NJ FID a person can have an unloaded rifle or shotgun in a vehicle at all times

I think you answered your own question?

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4 minutes ago, tomk62 said:

 

I think you answered your own question?

Not really.  I understand that I can " technically" carry an unloaded rifle anywhere in the state with my FID (in vehicle or out) but what if I leave it in the vehicle and it gets stolen?  In this situation you aren't carrying the firearm and can you be charged with a failure to secure the weapon properly?

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Just now, StarGazer said:

Not really.  I understand that I can " technically" carry an unloaded rifle anywhere in the state with my FID (in vehicle or out) but what if I leave it in the vehicle and it gets stolen?  In this situation you aren't carrying the firearm and can you be charged with a failure to secure the weapon properly?

There is no such charge/law.

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1 minute ago, StarGazer said:

Not really.  I understand that I can " technically" carry an unloaded rifle anywhere in the state with my FID (in vehicle or out) but what if I leave it in the vehicle and it gets stolen?  In this situation you aren't carrying the firearm and can you be charged with a failure to secure the weapon properly?

Respectfully, you're going through a lot of mental gymnastics to try to get people on the internet to tell you (very specifically) what NJ gun laws will allow you to do, and going through "what if" scenarios regarding what may or may not lead to charges.

NJ gun laws aren't written that way.

If you DON'T want to risk being a test case in court somewhere:
Only have a firearm in your vehicle if you're going to/from an approved location (range, gun shop, residence, etc.).  Gun(s) cased and unloaded, ammo in separate container(s), in trunk or out of arms reach.  Reasonable deviations for food/bathroom.

If you want to be "that guy" and test the letter of the law:
Follow the advice of the people online who tell you to do other than above.  Interpret the ass-backwards laws ANY WAY YOU WANT and roll the dice.  Cops don't litigate on the side of the road, so the more extreme your view of the law (like the previous example of waving the long gun out a window) the more likely it is that you'll get a chance to discuss it in court.

 

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1 minute ago, 124gr9mm said:

Respectfully, you're going through a lot of mental gymnastics to try to get people on the internet to tell you (very specifically) what NJ gun laws will allow you to do, and going through "what if" scenarios regarding what may or may not lead to charges.

NJ gun laws aren't written that way.

If you DON'T want to risk being a test case in court somewhere:
Only have a firearm in your vehicle if you're going to/from an approved location (range, gun shop, residence, etc.).  Gun(s) cased and unloaded, ammo in separate container(s), in trunk or out of arms reach.  Reasonable deviations for food/bathroom.

If you want to be "that guy" and test the letter of the law:
Follow the advice of the people online who tell you to do other than above.  Interpret the ass-backwards laws ANY WAY YOU WANT and roll the dice.  Cops don't litigate on the side of the road, so the more extreme your view of the law (like the previous example of waving the long gun out a window) the more likely it is that you'll get a chance to discuss it in court.

 

Respectfully, I don't think it's mental gymnastics to try to understand if I can stop to take a bathroom break on my way to/from the range with a rifle without becoming a felon in this state.

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22 minutes ago, StarGazer said:

Respectfully, I don't think it's mental gymnastics to try to understand if I can stop to take a bathroom break on my way to/from the range with a rifle without becoming a felon in this state.

The gymnastics comment was regarding your other posts.

If you're using an internet forum to determine whether or not you're committing a felony you're setting yourself up for failure.

Got to NJ State published information instead:

https://www.state.nj.us/oag/dcj/agguide/transporting-firearms_guide.pdf

"While not an exclusive list, some examples of stops or detours in the course of travel to or between locations that would qualify as reasonably necessary include: collecting and discharging passengers; purchasing fuel, food and beverages, medication, or other needed supplies; using a restroom; contending with an emergency situation; or driving around a traffic jam."

 

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10 minutes ago, 124gr9mm said:

The gymnastics comment was regarding your other posts.

If you're using an internet forum to determine whether or not you're committing a felony you're setting yourself up for failure.

Got to NJ State published information instead:

https://www.state.nj.us/oag/dcj/agguide/transporting-firearms_guide.pdf

"While not an exclusive list, some examples of stops or detours in the course of travel to or between locations that would qualify as reasonably necessary include: collecting and discharging passengers; purchasing fuel, food and beverages, medication, or other needed supplies; using a restroom; contending with an emergency situation; or driving around a traffic jam."

 

Thank you for the link to the AG letter.  I still disagree that trying to understand what is or isn't allowed under the law is mental gymnastics.  This specific forum section is a place for such discussion and posts with references to the law are very helpful in gaining such an understanding.

The one thing I have learned is that NJ has set up everyone for failure through its purposely unclear and confusing firearms laws. The letter you linked even shows that point as the prior AG had to issue guidance on the interpretation of the law itself.  Grewal is not Lougy and this interpretation may or may not be followed today.  As the NJ courts have said, and I paraphrase,  "anyone who deals with firearms in NJ, deals in peril."  It's a shame.  The law abiding, tax-paying citizens deserve better.  Voting at the booth will never fix this problem, but at least we have the option to vote with our feet.

 

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13 minutes ago, StarGazer said:

Thank you for the link to the AG letter.  I still disagree that trying to understand what is or isn't allowed under the law is mental gymnastics.  This specific forum section is a place for such discussion and posts with references to the law are very helpful in gaining such an understanding.

The one thing I have learned is that NJ has set up everyone for failure through its purposely unclear and confusing firearms laws. The letter you linked even shows that point as the prior AG had to issue guidance on the interpretation of the law itself.  Grewal is not Lougy and this interpretation may or may not be followed today.  As the NJ courts have said, and I paraphrase,  "anyone who deals with firearms in NJ, deals in peril."  It's a shame.  The law abiding, tax-paying citizens deserve better.  Voting at the booth will never fix this problem, but at least we have the option to vote with our feet.

 

I've been behind the trigger for over 48 years.  I studied the EXCEPTIONS & EXEMPTIONS and stopped worrying about looking for permission to breathe air.  The laws themselves are somewhat confusing, and don't include the NJF&W game laws that allow hunters that aren't old enough to buy firearms to USE & TRANSPORT firearms to the hunting site.  On their bicycles.  

Study the exceptions & exemptions.  Then look at the game laws :)  Read carefully, as punctuation has MEANING:  "COMMA, OR LOCKED IN THE TRUNK OF AN AUTOMOBILE" is the first of many that HS grads that barely passed English class always get wrong :) 

Taking your wife's hand gun to the range w/o her is an illegal transfer & a felony (indictable offense) UNLESS she has assumed room temperature.  Cause then her property is YOURS & it's now YOUR hand gun :)   And ya don't have to prop-up her dead body in the front seat of your vehicle to be "legal".

In Jersey, there's the letter of the law, there's what will get you in trouble (waving a scattergun out yer car window), there's what candy-asses do (use FOPA for INTRASTATE transportation) to "feel-good", and there's what those "in-the-know" do.

Continued success in your exploration to determine how much of a candy-ass (OR NOT!) you wanna be :) 

~R

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28 minutes ago, Smokin .50 said:

I've been behind the trigger for over 48 years.  I studied the EXCEPTIONS & EXEMPTIONS and stopped worrying about looking for permission to breathe air.  The laws themselves are somewhat confusing, and don't include the NJF&W game laws that allow hunters that aren't old enough to buy firearms to USE & TRANSPORT firearms to the hunting site.  On their bicycles.  

Study the exceptions & exemptions.  Then look at the game laws :)  Read carefully, as punctuation has MEANING:  "COMMA, OR LOCKED IN THE TRUNK OF AN AUTOMOBILE" is the first of many that HS grads that barely passed English class always get wrong :) 

Taking your wife's hand gun to the range w/o her is an illegal transfer & a felony (indictable offense) UNLESS she has assumed room temperature.  Cause then her property is YOURS & it's now YOUR hand gun :)   And ya don't have to prop-up her dead body in the front seat of your vehicle to be "legal".

In Jersey, there's the letter of the law, there's what will get you in trouble (waving a scattergun out yer car window), there's what candy-asses do (use FOPA for INTRASTATE transportation) to "feel-good", and there's what those "in-the-know" do.

Continued success in your exploration to determine how much of a candy-ass (OR NOT!) you wanna be :) 

~R

take note, this is how you gripe up the chain of command....lol

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3 hours ago, PK90 said:

There is no such charge/law.

you never know... These lawyers find a way.  I know there have been charges of “criminal negligence” before, but it could be related to another crime and not gun related. 

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I moved to New Jersey already owning a rifle. I filled out the FID form online and have scheduled an appointment to get fingerprinted. I have read it may take months to get the FID. In the meantime am I legally allowed to transport the gun (it will be in a locked case separate from ammo in the trunk) to and from a range? Would I need to show any paperwork of how I obtained the gun? I have tried to read all the literature I can find on this but I am still very confused. If the gun is legal in New Jersey and sold in stores do they care how and where I obtained it?

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On 10/24/2020 at 10:33 PM, WillieBeamen said:

I moved to New Jersey already owning a rifle. I filled out the FID form online and have scheduled an appointment to get fingerprinted. I have read it may take months to get the FID. In the meantime am I legally allowed to transport the gun (it will be in a locked case separate from ammo in the trunk) to and from a range? Would I need to show any paperwork of how I obtained the gun? I have tried to read all the literature I can find on this but I am still very confused. If the gun is legal in New Jersey and sold in stores do they care how and where I obtained it?

@ WillieBeamen   First, welcome to the Forum!  And to the Communist People's Republic of New Jerseystan!

@Golf battery summed it up in a single line.  Now my job is to teach you how to THINK about the confusing NJ gun laws.

Start by NOT reading them!  You read that right!  Instead of reading them, just read the EXCEPTIONS & EXEMPTIONS that LET you do things with firearms.  Your life will be a whole lot simpler :) 

Pretend you're an 80 year old and have been buying guns your entire adult life.  Pre-'68 Gun Control Act not every firearm had a serial number.  Now you're 80 years old & moving to NJ.  Those 100 guns of yours w/o any serial numbers are perfectly legal in NJ (IF none have too many evil features on the AR platform or aren't NAMED ASSAULT WEAPONS on the BANNED List).  Some are newer, with serial numbers, and some were bought at gun shows w/o any transfer papers since none existed at that time!  So HOW do you PROVE they belong to YOU?  Answer:  You CAN'T, since most of the wheelin' & dealin' was "Cash & Carry" back in the day....So always take yourself OUT of the equation & insert the 80 year old & then ask yourself the same question.  Are your eyes opened yet?  Yes?  WELCOME TO ENLIGHTENMENT!

Also remember out-of-state competitors bring guns into NJ every day for competitions.  None of them have a NJFPID nor do they need it.  Guns without too many evil features and/or semi-auto mags over ten rounds means they're okay to bring into the state.  FULL STOP!

For more advice & some great reading, please visit the Coalition of New Jersey Firearm Owners website at:  

https://www.cnjfo.com/News

For some mind-blowing NJ gun law incrementalism, watch the video!

Rosey

 

 

 

  

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