JonF

Why not? feet can't touch the ground?

Dirt or asphalt? I can do either and know the pines fairly well for lerading a dirt ride.

Looks great there Ted! i've had my eye on those for a bit myself but without someone who could help with legalizing the mags for me, i couldn't commit. Perhaps one day we can get together to shoot and i'll bring my new tokarev AR. centerfire plinking has never been cheaper!

Dan, my interpretation is that that wouldn't be the case. You still need PP's to buy a handgun and the form states that you need to actually have them in your possession prior to the exemption application. As such, there is no "permit denial", but rather an "exemption denial" which is not one of the questions asked on the permit application form.

that was meant tounge in cheek, ray-o-vac :mrgreen:

or.... you could get another g19 and a mech-tech upper!

Hmmm, sux indeed. *puts Caine on list with Radek

Its an inexpensive Mako grip. it folds rearwards and in that position Its contoured such that you can hold it like a typical foreend.

Dude, who shit in your curry? Your posts are just outright inflammatory.

Hey pipes, the basic upper was 800. Since you're right down the street, let me know if you want to get together and hit the range and try it out.

I was just trying to do a review and spark some discussion. isn't that what we do here? lame? no sense? how so? if the uber cheap ammo, 1800fps projectiles and flat shooting don't lend to the fun factor, then i don't know what to say. After all, they're all just toys so don't take it so seriously.

I think you're mistaking a Tokarev for a Makarov. Tokarevs are most commonly found in Romanian, Russian, Polish and Yugoslavian manufacture. that said, i think the one in the pic is romanian due to the cocking serrations. Tokarev's were manufactured in many eastern block countries, including East Germany ... Sure they did. :doh: i suppose they made them on the production lines right next to the lugers and p38's, right?

oh yeah, def shooting the corrosive ammo. That's where the true savings is! If i had to spend the money for new production ammo, might as well just get a 9mm upper since that would be cheaper. As it is, i can shoot surplus tok ammo for ~10c per round which is less than half that of brass cased 9mm. Besides, the corrosive factor is not really a big concern. I've shot corrosive ammo for years and know what it takes to keep them rust free. prompt cleaning and thorough with the right stuff and its fine, rifles and pistols alike. Besides that, the barrel is stainless and many parts are aluminum. That really just leaves the bolt and carrier to be cleaned and maybe the mag and mag block occasionally. If you were very anal, you could get the bolt chromed or some such coating for long term resistance but this is a range toy and not subject to neglect.

In case you haven't deduced from the oh-so-clever title, what you're looking at is an AR upper chambered in potent little 7.62x25 round. I've always liked this stout little pistol round when shooting my Tokarev and CZ52 pistols and thought a modern carbine would be a fun addition for plinking and indoor range use where a true rifle caliber is just wasted. There's a few very small outfits making these in equally small numbers and this one i got from cncgunsparts.com. Its a full DI gas system rather than blowback and it feeds from the mag well using a mag block. Some kits have used blowback but it just beats the upper to hell. Other kits have some weird suomy-esque, side-feed system that didn't seem too appealing. This kit is the truest to the ar platform and other than a tuned gas system for the x25 power level and a bolt whose face is reamed for the x25 case OD, its all standard parts from there and so far, seems to work very well out of the box. The barrel is stainless, but coated. The mags are sten mags cut down for compatibility in our great state. Tobey, the owner of the company, was very flexible and catering to NJ in offering a "Ban-compliant" package by skipping of threading the barrel for a flash hider and just machining a crown instead for no extra cost. He generally offers the mags in thier original 32rd capacity but will cut them down to 10, 15 or whatever you need also for no additional cost. I then had him put on a railed gas block in lieu of the typical A-frame front sight with the bayo lug (although he offered to chop off the lug if needed). He tests every unit before it ships and overall is a real good guy who will talk your ear off once you get him started! Since i had a spare lower and parts kit collecting dust and my only other AR is a bull barrel target gun, what better way to explore the other side of the spectrum than with a pistol carbine variant, especially one that shoots dirt cheap ammo. Yes the ammo is corrosive but that's nothing new to me and a good cleaning of the barrel and bolt with MPro7 after i get home from shooting takes care any corrosion concerns. Since the barrel is stainless though, its not really going to sustain any rust damage if its not sterile clean but the bolt will need to be cleaned well to reduce any risk. This is my first AR carbine suitable to standing use so i outfitted it with a RRA operator A2 stock, foreend rail with a forward grip, ergo pistol grip, badger latch, magpul BAD lever and a cheap NcStar 6x compact scope so i can do some short range target shooting and yet still have sufficient long range magnification to shoot my 6" gong at 200 yds. Speaking of shooting it, I took it to Dix for its first outing and was pleased at the function and accuracy of it. I tried a total of 250 rounds comprised of 3 different types of surplus (polish, romanian and yugoslavian) and they all shot fine without a single malfunction. Starting out at 25 to get it sighted on paper, i then moved to 50 yrds and 100 consecutively. at 100, the little ~85gr pill was a little susceptible to wind but was keeping it in 2-3 moa shooting from a front rest only. Under 100 yds, the groups were tight though! I then moved out to 200 yards where my little 6" gong was sitting and other than having to give it about 8-10" of holdover and compensate for the variable winds, ringing that plate was actually rather easy. I thought the fixed 6x scope would be low enough magnification to not make it boring but it looks like I might have to switch to some BUIS's to make it more of a challenge. All in all, a fun little toy! EDIT (8/25) - Took it to the indoor range today and shot it at 25 yards with the magazine resting on the table to help steady it as i'm pretty shaky and new to shooting rifles standing. the groups were decent and shows the potential, i just need to work on myself.

my ergo grip came today and its every bit as good as it looks! Why didn't you tell me about this sooner, chris?

Try looking into a grip with palm swell as well as strap thickness. The CAA i had has various replaceable straps but it was never enough to be comfortable since the width is still kinda thin. The panther and ergo have a much thicker profile side to side which adds to the overall bulk of the grip. For me, this ultimately allows the positioning of my trigger finger in a more neutral position rather than feeling too close and cramped up. Here's a good pic illustrating the difference.

Does that constitute shooting from a moving vee-hickle?

"You can shake it; You can squeeze it; You can bang it on the wall. But you have to pull up your pants; Before the last drop will fall." "Here I sit in a misty vapor Some damn fool stole the toilet paper My bus is late and I cannot linger Lookout butt here comes my finger" "All turds longer than 6 inches must be lowered by hand" "A man took a poop in a gas station and then realized there was no toilet paper. There was a hole in the wall and a sign above it that read: "When you go to the bathroom, wipe yourself with your index finger, stick it through this hole and it will be thoroughly cleaned." The man did exactly what the sign said, but when he stuck his finger through the hole, someone at the other side slapped two bricks together against his finger and because of the pain he stuck his finger in his mouth and started to suck on it. " "They once made a Chuck Norris toilet paper, but it wouldn't take shit from anybody."

I think you're mistaking a Tokarev for a Makarov. Tokarevs are most commonly found in Romanian, Russian, Polish and Yugoslavian manufacture. that said, i think the one in the pic is romanian due to the cocking serrations.

And why? I realize this is subjective to the same argument that pits glock vs 1911 vs whatever, but there's usually some truth or merit to peoples' preferences. Whatever your preference is, good ergonomics is always a plus for extended shooting sessions and overall enjoyment. My first AR build started with the std grip but that pretty much sucked right away so i picked up a CAA grip with interchangeable front and back straps. My hands are large so i figured i would slap on the large straps and have at it but that ultimately wasn't the case (nor any other combo for this grip). It really just lacked palm swell which i find help make for a comfortable grip for me. Along with that, I also noticed that the web support was too thin which made my hand ride too high and so the angle wasn't comfortable. A Year or so later, after handling a few guns down the road, i found the DPMS panther grip with the palm rest was damn near perfect. Now i'm doing another build and after looking around at nearly everything out there, i decided to try the Ergo Tactical with the palm swell. it looks practically the same as the panther grip without the platform so i'm hoping its gonna feel the same. good DPMS Panther grip with palm shelf ERGO Tactical Deluxe (hopefully) not so good CAA with interchangable straps

Sorry to disappoint, Hank.

I'm not really keen on the "accidental prostate exam" so i'm going to vote for the strong stuff.

Well its likely that you'll only make it to underwear marksman. *bah-dum-bum-tssss*

complete with a simultaneous 1001-gun salute... and there's only 25 of us present.

holy sh*t ed, no wonder you've been selling off guns like a lunker. congrats! Where was the pic/proposal?