I have come across this and if I'm reading right it means that anyone that has moved to New Jersey from another state and that owns a firearm legally when purchased in there prior state is in violation of N.J.S.A. 2C:39-5c(1) if they have not applied and received there NJFPID card.

 

My recommendation for any member from this site when asked if it is "legal or not" from a new resident from out of state is to tell them to seek legal advice from a qualified NJ firearms lawyer.

 

http://www.judiciary.state.nj.us/crimin ... pons13.pdf

 

UNLAWFUL POSSESSION OF A RIFLE OR SHOTGUN

N.J.S.A. 2C:39-5c(1)

 

Defendant(s), , is charged in count _____ with unlawful possession of a (rifle)(shotgun). The pertinent language of the statute the defendant is charged with having violated reads as follows:

Any person who knowingly has in his possession any (rifle)(shotgun) . . . without first having obtained a firearms purchaser identification card ... is guilty of a crime.

In order for the State to convict the defendant of this crime, the State must prove beyond a reasonable doubt these three essential elements:

1. S is a (rifle)(shotgun); (Or there was a (rifle)(shotgun);

2. The defendant knowingly possessed the (rifle)(shotgun); and

3. The defendant did not have a valid firearms purchaser identification card.

The first element the State must prove beyond a reasonable doubt is that S____ is a (rifle)(shotgun) (or there was a (rifle)(shotgun)).

A rifle means " any firearm1 designed to be fired from the shoulder and using the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic cartridge to fire a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger."2

[OR]

A shotgun means

I'm sure this would be argued to death, but I'm pretty sure if you retained your receipts as proof you legally owned said guns before you moved to NJ (older the receipts the better) they can't charge you with illegal possession. The most they can legally do is make you apply for a NJFPID which if you were stupid enough to move here in the first place it should already be on your agenda to get so you can at least purchase ammo.

I have always encouraged those who move here, with firearms, to apply for a NJ FID for good measure. This way they will minimize any problems with police who don't know the law.

 

As far as ownership goes, as long as the firearms are not prohibited by statute (meaning they don't fall under NJ assault weapons ban), you may legally continue to own them, and you do not need to register them or anything. Be aware of NJ's restriction on magazines over 15 rounds, though!

 

There is a voluntary form of registration, though I don't know why anyone would want to do that.

I would advise them to get the FID, why risk trouble down the line. Not worth it.

2C:39 includes language to the effect of "if you are in one of these legal safe zones, the requirements to have a FID/License to carry no longer apply." Which is good, because otherwise you cannot posess a handgun without the License to carry.

 

Too much work to pull the references right now from the state legislature site

Working from memory, so excuse me if the language isn't 100% (too lazy to look up the statute):

 

2C:39-5c does in fact say that it is unlawful to possess a rifle or shotgun without first obtaining an NJ FID card. However, right below it, 2C:39-6e says that, "nothing in 2C:39-5b, c, or d shall be construed to prevent any person from keeping or carrying about their residence, premesis, or other land owned by them, ANY firearm - or from carrying said firearm between their home and place of business, or from one residence to another while moving" - or language to such effect.

2C:39-6 e, f, and g exist to allow possession of a firearm without the proper paperwork (LTC for handgun, FID for unloaded longarm).

 

So, legally a FID is not necessary for possession of a longarm as long as you conform to the exceptions in 2C:39-6 e, f, or g.

 

Practically, you're at the mercy of the justice system (maybe I should make that my .sig?)

Where is Malsua with his sig line when you need him?

 

One version of my post mentioned his .sig.

 

A FID card is, legally and among other things, a permit to possess an unloaded longarm without having to hassle with 2C:39-6 e, f, or g; irrespective of the description as a firearms purchaser ID card. Just as a License to carry permits you to possess a handgun outside of 2C:39-6 e, f, or g. Which is good since I don't happen to have a LTC - so all that's keeping me out of the pokey is 2C:39-6 e, f, or g.

 

Within 2C:39-6 e, f, or g, you can possess a longarm without a FID. So you don't *need* a FID to possess a longarm in all circumstances, just as you don't need a LTC to possess a handgun under all circumstances.

 

A FID is required to buy a longarm, but NOT required to buy a handgun. Practically, you ought to get a FID when you buy your first firearm, regardless of longarm or handgun.

 

In short, a FID is sufficient but not necessary to possess a longarm.

 

Would you or Malsua prefer that unloaded longarms NOT be generally possessable with a FID? Because right now our choices are possession with a FID, or possession with a LTC, or 2C:39-6 e, f, or g.

 

Maybe that will change with incorporation of the 2A. But it won't change soon

Can you post a link and copy and paste the statute of 2C:39-6 e, f, or g because I'm having a hell of a time trying to find it. thanks

You don't need a NJ Carry Permit to purchase or possess handguns. A carry permit is only required to carry a handgun out in public for protection purposes. It is not required for possession at home or transporting to or from a range or other legitimate activity (provided it is unloaded and secured in the trunk or locked case).

 

Additionally, you only need a permit to purchase when buying a handgun in NJ; if you move here from another state and you bring firearms (which you legally owned in your former state), you are allowed to continue owning them without documentation or registration.

You don't need a NJ Carry Permit to purchase or possess handguns. A carry permit is only required to carry a handgun out in public for protection purposes. It is not required for possession at home or transporting to or from a range or other legitimate activity (provided it is unloaded and secured in the trunk or locked case).

 

Additionally, you only need a permit to purchase when buying a handgun in NJ; if you move here from another state and you bring firearms (which you legally owned in your former state), you are allowed to continue owning them without documentation or registration.

 

Exactly. And you don't need the FID to possess under those circumstances, either. (You do need one to purchase a longarm, but not a handgun. You'd be mad not to get one when you apply for your pistol purchase permit, though). Having the FID allows (unloaded) possession of a longarm in the same circumstances as the LTC allows possession of a handgun - outside of 2C:39-6 e, f, or g. I walked through this reasoning in the Guns in Motels thread

 

Can you post a link and copy and paste the statute of 2C:39-6 e, f, or g because I'm having a hell of a time trying to find it. thanks

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/about/fire_ag2.html is where I go through to look up the gun laws in the state - they have a link to the relevant parts of the NJ Code.

Must be a very gray area because I just came across this article, it's basically a 25 year old guy that who moved to Jersey from Colorado January 2, 2009 that purchased his guns in CO legally when coming to live back in NJ was arrested because he was found with his guns, unloaded, separate from ammunition and locked in the trunk of his car and since he did not posses a NJFPID card and wasn't just passing through the state he was arrested for UNLAWFUL POSSESSION N.J.S.A. 2C:39-5c(1).

 

So this comes down to: is it legal to move to NJ without having a NJFID card? well if you have $30.000 laying around that's just burning a hole in your pocket you can always try it and I'm sure a jersey lawyer would love to take that money from you.

 

http://www.peacefreedomprosperity.com/?p=1953

There is a lot of missing info on that case as presented.

There is a lot of missing info on that case as presented.

 

Yeah I guess it was a one sided story. If you Google his name it comes up on a few sites.

OK, I read a few more articles on Brian Aitken and maybe he was arrested for not going from point A to point B. It looks like he stopped at his parents house after entering the state and before going straight to his new residence.

 

Note to members on this board. Take your piss before you leave the range...

Yeah - the restrictions in 2C:39-6 e, f, or g are pretty tight.

 

As I've said before, it's pretty stupid NOT to get a FID if you have the chance.

 

I also believe there's info missing from that story.

I just read that link about Aitkin. Anyone know any further details? This is the first I'm hearing about it.

 

I have a few problems with the article, though. The author must have been misinformed or something, because the article states, "He was also informed that he could apply for a Concealed Carry Permit." Since when does the state police inform citizens that they can apply for a carry permit, considering NJ's strict regulations preventing citizens from being approved?

 

Another problem I have is how did the police get consent to search his vehicle? NJ's Supreme Court ruled in 2002 (State v. Carty 170 N.J. 632) that police cannot even ask for consent to search a vehicle incident to a traffic stop; consent through intimidation is not consent at all.

 

Anyone know who's representing this man?

Where is Malsua with his sig line when you need him?

 

 

I was in upstate NY.

 

Back now...must read this thread....

I have a few problems with the article, though. The author must have been misinformed or something, because the article states, "He was also informed that he could apply for a Concealed Carry Permit." Since when does the state police inform citizens that they can apply for a carry permit, considering NJ's strict regulations preventing citizens from being approved?

 

 

Oh, you can always *apply*. It's obtaining the permit that's the trick, no?

I sent emails to my district's representatives about this incident. I have also emailed it to the ANJRPC. I have received responses that they will look into this incident.

 

Does anyone else have suggestions as to where else I can send this story where someone might listen?

Not sure who to send it to in NJ that would care, but keep us posted on what you find out about this case.

A youtube interview that fleshes it out a little more, but still missing lots of details.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KdJRDSTnaWw