Lol, I went to the dentist yesterday, and I showed the one lady there the picture of me getting engaged on my phone. (She kind of yells at me like a mother since ive been going there so long) but she starts flipping through my pictures.. I'm like "uhh.. there might be stuff on there you don't want to see".. and shes like.. "its ok, this is like my son's phone, i find bad stuff in there all the time".. so she gets to the picture of the holster i sold to Maks, and shes like.. "whats this?" "A Holster" (mind you, I'm all numbed up from the nova cane). "A holster for what?" "My gun" "Why are you taking pictures of it?" "Cuz I sold it to my friend" "Your not supposed to do that!" "A holster?" "Oh, I thought you meant the gun." "Well, I've done that too.. with proper paperwork of course".. "Oh".. then she gets to the picture of my old man shooting my savage, and shes like "What are you killing?" "Paper Targets?" "Why?" "It's my hobby". "That's not a hobby!" "Why not?" *silence*

 

Lol

displays of ignorance abound. why is it automatically "what are you killing?" a good number of people that are into shooting sports have never hunted, and probably never will.

why is it not a hobby? how is golf a hobby and shooting isn't? ugh...

 

nice story...

 

"I'm a recreational shooter"

 

K

 

 

I read these forums at work. People look over my shoulder. THey ask me if I have "A gun." I tell them yes, I have three.

When they ask why I need them I always tell them " I am a recreational shooter." It always seems to put people a little at ease. In fact I don't think the phrase really took hold for me until I kept reading it here. It is a good term. I find that talking about shooting skeet, target pistols, trying to become more accurate is a better why to stear the conversation The "protect-my-family" part is not mentioned until later on when I have been able to discuss the concept of shooting for recreation. In fact, once they grasp "recreational shooting" they are ready to listen when I say I have 1000 rounds of ammmo.

"why do you have so much ammo?"

"Recreational shooting and good bulk pricing."

"Oh, I get it"

 

 

Anyway, that said I will tell you all that my mother is a child psychologist at a state hospital (not saying what state).

She has VERY real stories of what children can and will do. After nearly 50 years of doing it she has nothing but contempt for parents that are gun owners, mostly because of the stuff they tell her.

 

I had this conversation with her last weekend - she will see parents and the child that she has in treatment. SHe said;

 

"Every time I have a troubled kid come in I am required to ask if there are guns in the house. The parents will say "Oh yea but I hide them and they don't know where they are/don't know I have them. THen I will be talking to their child and the child will say, 'oh yea my parents have guns, they don't think I know but I have known for years. Then they tell me where they are. One kid even figured out how to pick the locks off a pistol and would put it next to him while he played video games then returned it before the parents got home."

 

In fact there were more than a few cases she remembers where the kid picked the trigger lock off. Nothing came of it injury wise, but still well a troubled teen is picking the lock off a handgun and the parents have no idea that any of this happens, it makes a person form an opinion.

 

So I know the craziness of the situation she describes would be preaching to the choir, but there are those that really do not get it within our own ranks.

 

The end of the story is that I told her about the many many times that people on this forum admonish those for not putting their weapons in a safe and what not and she would add her full support for it.

 

Because she knows, even more than the average parent, that kids are nuts.

Kid's arent nuts, kids are kids.

 

Proper parenting and gun ownership involves educating kids about guns, and while making them respectful of the extreme power guns have, also educating them, that in the right hands, with proper use, nothing bad will come from guns.

 

I bet those same parents hide their car keys too right? Because they don't want their kids knowing that they have cars, which can become a much deadlier weapon in the wrong hands.

 

I really only shot at boy scout camp when I was little, but whenever I wanted, as long as my dad wasn't busy, whenever I asked, he would take out his guns and show them to me and let me examine them under his supervision. They quickly became not enchanted hidden novelties, but just another tool. Just like all the tools in the shed he let me use. With me on his lap, he also let me steer his truck on a deserted road, and I quickly realized that I wasn't up to that job just yet.

 

Never shot anyone yet, never stole a car..

If the kid is troubled, more likely than not, there will be plenty of signs. It's just that the parent's either are unfit to be parents, have their head up their a**, or in some rare cases, too busy putting food on the table to notice. Of course I say that from a young man's point of view, I have no kids right now, but I'm sure most people will agree with me. Even in that last situation, you don't just forget to notice major things.

 

If it's one of those rare cases where there truely are NO signs, then no amount of effective parenting is going to cure a situation, it has nothing to do with guns. It's sad but true. They will use rope, pills, knife, car, etc etc etc. However, good parenting from the start should take care of most situations before they ever become situations.

 

Furthermore, nobody ever said that a trigger lock is an effective tool for 100% security when your kid is alone with the gun. It's just a mild deterrent. Most of them only have 3 numbers. Start at 000 and go to 999, it should only take an hour if your unlucky. Or A few minutes with a dremel, and its off.

For the most part, I believe all of us here are "recreational shooters". It's a broad enough term to encompass whatever discipline we discuss on the board, and other than hunting, it's really the only way to define what it is we actually do with our guns. We shouldn't feel any differently about talking about shooting as a satisfying hobby than we feel about talking about our favorite restaurants or movies. It's just a part of what makes us what we are.

 

We've been apologetic for too long, hiding what we do from friends, family and peers, and look at where it put us. If we're not up front and confident in discussing guns and shooting, without qualifying it or apologizing for it, then others will eventually see it as just another fun thing to do with their spare time (and money) and we'll be able to move forward towards getting back some of the obvious freedoms to pursue our hobby that we've lost.

 

If we hem and haw, and make excuses ("I shoot trap only because I'm a crappy golfer"), or present ourselves publicly in a way that makes us look like what the antis would have everyone believe we are, then we will be well and verily screwed. That's why the recent pogrom on this board was a good thing, clearing out a lot of Mall Ninjas less than well-presented personalities, and putting us in a place where we don't have to be afraid that what's written here will be used as a pull quote on some anti's website.

 

Kudos to Maks for stepping up and taking care of business.

 

K

Kid's arent nuts, kids are kids.

 

Proper parenting and gun ownership involves educating kids about guns, and while making them respectful of the extreme power guns have, also educating them, that in the right hands, with proper use, nothing bad will come from guns.

 

I bet those same parents hide their car keys too right? Because they don't want their kids knowing that they have cars, which can become a much deadlier weapon in the wrong hands.

 

I really only shot at boy scout camp when I was little, but whenever I wanted, as long as my dad wasn't busy, whenever I asked, he would take out his guns and show them to me and let me examine them under his supervision. They quickly became not enchanted hidden novelties, but just another tool. Just like all the tools in the shed he let me use. With me on his lap, he also let me steer his truck on a deserted road, and I quickly realized that I wasn't up to that job just yet.

 

Never shot anyone yet, never stole a car..

 

+1 on the demystifying part. When my kids were young I took out my guns, unloaded an let them hold them. I told them that if they ever saw a gun around, do not touch, get an adult. After so many times of asking to handle my guns they were just like my power tools when I was using them. When they got older i took them to a range and let them shoot. Take the mystery away and you will have much fewer problems, and not just with guns.

It's sad but true. They will use rope, pills, knife, car, etc etc etc.

I agree with this statement 100%. If someone is messed up enough in the head that they plan on killing someone, access to guns will likely not be the swaying decision in whether they do it or not. It may make them more EFFECTIVE at it, but guns are not what make kids, or people in general for that matter, go crazy.

When my kids were young I took out my guns, unloaded an let them hold them. I told them that if they ever saw a gun around, do not touch, get an adult. After so many times of asking to handle my guns they were just like my power tools when I was using them. When they got older i took them to a range and let them shoot. Take the mystery away and you will have much fewer problems, and not just with guns.

 

at about what age (kids) did you do that? I definitely plan on doing that with mine, but at 2 & 5, they're still a bit too young.

at about what age (kids) did you do that? I definitely plan on doing that with mine, but at 2 & 5, they're still a bit too young.

 

I started shooting my dad's single shot .22 around 5 y/o, possibly earlier. Only you can decide when your children are ready, and it could be later, but that age was fine for me.

Level Of Maturity > Actual Age

 

Some kids simply mature faster than others. You would be best to just individually evaluate each child to decide when they are "ready".. I also shot a 22 as a pretty young age..

if it was up to me, I'd start them around 7 - 9 years old. especially the younger, the boy. boys and guns, you know. I know I've always had a fascination with them. so let's say he'd be 7, my daughter would be 10 or so... if it was up to my wife, she said 13.

and mind you, this is just for "the talk" not the actual shooting. we'll probably have to revise her stance on it as the kids get older and I get more guns

at about what age (kids) did you do that? I definitely plan on doing that with mine, but at 2 & 5, they're still a bit too young.

 

They were about 5 or so. You know when they start getting curious and play off on their own, it's also at least in my case where i felt they could understand that they are not toys. I took the to the range when they were about 8 or 9. Now they love shooting when they can (youngest just started college), and I've taken a number of their friends, with parental permission shooting also.

kenw I just want to say that you are awesome and I really like the message you are bringing. Probably the most important thing we as gun owners can do is simply stop being afraid to talk about what completely lawful, harmless hobby we enjoy.

 

For the most part, I believe all of us here are "recreational shooters". It's a broad enough term to encompass whatever discipline we discuss on the board, and other than hunting, it's really the only way to define what it is we actually do with our guns. We shouldn't feel any differently about talking about shooting as a satisfying hobby than we feel about talking about our favorite restaurants or movies. It's just a part of what makes us what we are.

 

We've been apologetic for too long, hiding what we do from friends, family and peers, and look at where it put us. If we're not up front and confident in discussing guns and shooting, without qualifying it or apologizing for it, then others will eventually see it as just another fun thing to do with their spare time (and money) and we'll be able to move forward towards getting back some of the obvious freedoms to pursue our hobby that we've lost.

 

If we hem and haw, and make excuses ("I shoot trap only because I'm a crappy golfer"), or present ourselves publicly in a way that makes us look like what the antis would have everyone believe we are, then we will be well and verily screwed. That's why the recent pogrom on this board was a good thing, clearing out a lot of Mall Ninjas less than well-presented personalities, and putting us in a place where we don't have to be afraid that what's written here will be used as a pull quote on some anti's website.

kenw I just want to say that you are awesome and I really like the message you are bringing. Probably the most important thing we as gun owners can do is simply stop being afraid to talk about what completely lawful, harmless hobby we enjoy.

Thanks, man. I appreciate that.