I should NOT by a Bushmaster xm15e2s ? Got my handguns so now its time to stretch out the barrels. Been looking around for a while and think its the one for me. Seems to have a good history/rep and kinda middle of the road pricing which is always a concern but not the deciding factor. Ruger mini 14 is a runner-up.

Don't buy it... especially if you found a good one for cheap....

 

 

 

....... Because I want to buy it

now why would you wanna bring a nice gun like that to an indoor range? (oops, did I say that out loud?)

now why would you wanna bring a nice gun like that to an indoor range? (oops, did I say that out loud?)

Because I can. Lol

Because I can. Lol

 

 

My slug gun adds some BASS to the bullet hole...It adds a crack to the atmosphere when I am outside...

So you should NOT buy one, because you hate well made rifles...

I'm surprised that you have found overly positive reviews for Bushmaster. The general notion for the past few years is that they have shoddy QC, and charge way too much considering the product they're selling.

I honestly don't care what a person decides to do at the end of the day with their money. Personally though, if its a stock XM15 (no frills), I wouldn't even consider it unless it was sub-800 (as the market is right now-- that can change tomorrow or next week)... and even then it'd probably be a range plinker/parts gun.

After reading up a lot on AR variants, i scratched bushmaster off the list when i found rock river arms, i'm ordering one this week.

After reading up a lot on AR variants, i scratched bushmaster off the list when i found rock river arms, i'm ordering one this week.

Dunno where you've been doing your reading, but RRA and Bushmaster are generally considered to be in same overall class of AR... they're kind of middle of the road when in comes to ARs.

Okay, so what is top of the line in regards to AR's?

And then what is middle of the road?

And then what is bottem of the barrel?

Top, middle and bottom is VERY subjective. Just off the top of my head, the "Top" manufacturers are generally considered to be:

Noveske

Colt

LMT

BCM

DD

 

Middle:

Bushmaster

Stag

S&W

RRA

CMMG

 

Low:

Olympic

DPMS

May be others, but that's all that comes to mind.

 

Then there's some newer companies like LWRC, POF, PWS, that do almost exclusively piston guns. Not sure how where those would fall. Spike's is probably in the middle range, altho on the higher side bordering on the top range.

 

Again, this is all very subjective tho.

 

This is a good starting point for research:

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA#gid=2

So would Del-Ton be in the lower end? And how about Double-Star? Ruger 556?

Don't know enough about Del-Ton or DoubleStar. My first guess would be in the middle range tho. Ruger is a piston gun and I haven't spent too much time looking into them.

 

Don't take any of what I say as gospel. These are just my opinions based on the research I did when I was originally on the market for an AR. When it was time for me to buy I went with Daniel Defense and BCM, and I've been happy with my purchases. In 5k+ rounds thru both guns I've had exactly 1 malfunction. I attribute that to the quality of the guns (healthy doses of Slip2000 don't hurt either). And yes, I shoot lots of Wolf. YMMV

In 5k+ rounds thru both guns I've had exactly 1 malfunction.

 

I remember that, it was at the last Fort Dix meet-up right?

 

I think my next AR is going to be a build and I'll be picking your brain periodically. Those Spikes Tactical striped lowers have been calling my name!

Dunno where you've been doing your reading, but RRA and Bushmaster are generally considered to be in same overall class of AR... they're kind of middle of the road when in comes to ARs.

 

From what i have gathered so far, RRA has better tolerances, and bushmasters QC is hit or miss. I wasn't comparing RRA to any other manufacture but bushy, i am well aware that both are "middle shelf" and that both are good, but RRA's recent contract with the DEA shut out bushmaster, and a couple others. I actually debating picking up a colt since there not that much more $$.

For everyone that's new to the AR system, and those who are planning to invest in more down the road, please oh please check out that spreadsheet by TYV that Caine linked: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA#gid=2

 

The different tabs break down what he's talking about; what's important/to look for; and then side-by-side comparisons of the major brands.

From what i have gathered so far, RRA has better tolerances, and bushmasters QC is hit or miss. I wasn't comparing RRA to any other manufacture but bushy, i am well aware that both are "middle shelf" and that both are good, but RRA's recent contract with the DEA shut out bushmaster, and a couple others. I actually debating picking up a colt since there not that much more $$.

Yes, RRA did have a contract with the DEA to provide carbines. As did Colt and SigSauer. Interestingly enough, RRA had the smallest portion of that contract. If you do a little more research, you may also find that the DEA agents that were issued the RRA guns were not particularly happy with. Mind you, I have no first hand knowledge of any of this. 2 minutes of googling will turn up quite a bit of info if you look in the right places.

 

My personal opinion is that you'll be much better served by the Colt.

 

All that being said, your intended purpose for owning an AR will go a long way in determining what is acceptable in regards to QC and reliability. Someone who shoots 2-500 rounds a year from a bench probably won't notice any difference between a higher end AR from a lower end AR. Where as someone who may shoot 600+ rounds over the course of 6-7 hours without cleaning the gun at a carbine class, might.

For everyone that's new to the AR system, and those who are planning to invest in more down the road, please oh please check out that spreadsheet by TYV that Caine linked: https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA#gid=2

 

The different tabs break down what he's talking about; what's important/to look for; and then side-by-side comparisons of the major brands.

the spreadsheet is also VERY out dated and skewed by haters imho..I recently got a bushmaster carbine. it has m4 ramps, mpi tested bolt and barrel (p stamped barrel too) properly staked and aligned gas key. It does not have the "h" buffer because on post ban models, they actually use the a2 buffer assembly (which is fine). Mine is 1/9, also fine for me. It shoots way better than I could ever do I am sure

AR's tend to have VERY rabid brand following. Worse than anything I EVER saw in the automotive business. The people will trash any brand that isn't their favorite....it's really a drag.

I have had a few different Ar's(pre ban) and if the Bushmaster is now crap, the others must be simply outstanding.(which having shot a few, i just did not see) OR just overly hip.

If it matters, my brother has a Bushmaster m4 in afghanistan.

Buy what you feel comfortable with in your price range, inspect a few (i did)before buying. Ar's are pretty much standardized so you can change out anything to anything if you want. colt is nice, but my bushmaster was nearly $600 cheaper new(i paid less than 800)

Oh, if you want to plink...buy a .22 conversion, the ammo is alot cheaper. If you want a target shooter, buy a garand from cmp

The spreadsheet is not the be all end all answer. It's a starting point to give new users and idea of what to look for in a quality product.

The spreadsheet is not the be all end all answer. It's a starting point to give new users and idea of what to look for in a quality product.

yes it is, but it is NOT correct anymore.

I would suggest that anyone who wants to get an ar, build one. they are simple to build and then you can choose what parts you want....

plus it avoids the "my ar is better than your ar" stuff

The chart is correct, but the manufacturer's part hasn't been updated in months. That doesn't make the info on the first 2 pages incorrect. Again, it's a starting point. It's up to the buyer to figure out what features are worth having and whether the gun their interested has those features.

 

Oh, and my AR IS better than yours

 

The great thing about the AR platform is that you can easily customize it. That's the main reason why I wouldn't buy an AR off the rack at a shop. Instead I'd suggest buying a stripped lower and assembling the rifle with quality parts that you select. That way you won't be paying for parts that you'll be replacing or upgrading. There are step by step videos to walk you through the assembly process on the Brownell's website. It's not difficult and you'll learn a lot about your AR.

Here's a crazy idea, go buy the gun YOU want. Everyone on these boards knows everything about everything. If you want a Bushmaster get one. There is a reason they sold about a million of them. I'm guessing your not using it for any Special Ops missions or defending the universe from alien vampire zombies. Buy it, shoot it and enjoy it.

Here's a crazy idea, go buy the gun YOU want. Everyone on these boards knows everything about everything. If you want a Bushmaster get one. There is a reason they sold about a million of them. I'm guessing your not using it for any Special Ops missions or defending the universe from alien vampire zombies. Buy it, shoot it and enjoy it.

 

http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php?/topic/13778-ray-rays-zombie-apocolypse-thread/

 

Here's a crazy idea, go buy the gun YOU want. Everyone on these boards knows everything about everything. If you want a Bushmaster get one. There is a reason they sold about a million of them. I'm guessing your not using it for any Special Ops missions or defending the universe from alien vampire zombies. Buy it, shoot it and enjoy it.

 

And remember the first rifle you buy, will not be the last...

Hey, you forgot KAC at the top!

 

Top, middle and bottom is VERY subjective. Just off the top of my head, the "Top" manufacturers are generally considered to be:

Noveske

Colt

LMT

BCM

DD

 

Middle:

Bushmaster

Stag

S&W

RRA

CMMG

 

Low:

Olympic

DPMS

May be others, but that's all that comes to mind.

 

Then there's some newer companies like LWRC, POF, PWS, that do almost exclusively piston guns. Not sure how where those would fall. Spike's is probably in the middle range, altho on the higher side bordering on the top range.

 

Again, this is all very subjective tho.

 

This is a good starting point for research:

https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=pwswheghNQsEuEhjFwPrgTA#gid=2