ive always said there is no law stating you need to separate the ammo from firearm while transported, and many others have agreed, citing the statute, etc. i just found this on the NJSP's website, while looking for something else:

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/faq.html

A6. Firearms shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.

 

Ammunition must be transported in a separate container and locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.If the vehicle does not have a compartment separate from the passenger compartment, the firearm must be in a locked container other than the vehicle's glove compartment or console.

 

is this an actual law, or are they just BSing and trying to enforce something that doesnt exist. i notice it says 'must' and not 'shall', if that has any bearing. granted this is just the FAQ page and not the actual law....but if so, why are they blatantly wrong and giving out false information.

 

second question, someone asked me what the "SBI #" is on a P2P pistol purchase permit. the only thing ive found is it in reference to some kind of background check. state background investigation perhaps?

SBI # is the State Bureau of Investigation file number. That number is assigned to you when you get fingerprinted. Your data is now on record and follows you throughout your lifetime, kinda like a SSN. When I applied for my SORA (Security Officer Registration Act) certification, they used that SBI number as my ID#.

"must", "will" and "shall" all are synonyms. I wouldn't get hung up on that. "Should" is a wishy-washy weasel word that have very little meaning, but I digress.

 

The law says the firearm must be unloaded during transport. If is the definition of unloaded that is the issue. A loaded magazine in the same pouch as the gun is not necessary loaded or unloaded. It's open to interpretation. What you pasted above is correct as to the law but it is not clear what it means. I interpret that if you transport a gun in the passenger compartment in a securely tied package you must keep ammo in a separate container from the gun.

 

The second section of what you posted is very confusing. The first sentence talks about ammo must be locked in the trunk but the second sentence states "firearm" and gives no instruction on how to transport ammo if your car has no trunk.

 

Clearly, if you follow the instructions, you "should" stay out of trouble.

ive always said there is no law stating you need to separate the ammo from firearm while transported, and many others have agreed, citing the statute, etc. i just found this on the NJSP's website, while looking for something else:

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/faq.html

A6. Firearms shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.

 

Ammunition must be transported in a separate container and locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.If the vehicle does not have a compartment separate from the passenger compartment, the firearm must be in a locked container other than the vehicle's glove compartment or console.

 

is this an actual law, or are they just BSing and trying to enforce something that doesnt exist. i notice it says 'must' and not 'shall', if that has any bearing. granted this is just the FAQ page and not the actual law....but if so, why are they blatantly wrong and giving out false information.

 

second question, someone asked me what the "SBI #" is on a P2P pistol purchase permit. the only thing ive found is it in reference to some kind of background check. state background investigation perhaps?

 

 

they are literally making that up... they are advising you in a way that you are certain to not make errors.. but they are advertising the law incorrectly..

ive always said there is no law stating you need to separate the ammo from firearm while transported, and many others have agreed, citing the statute, etc. i just found this on the NJSP's website, while looking for something else:

http://www.state.nj.us/njsp/faq.html

A6. Firearms shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.

 

Ammunition must be transported in a separate container and locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported.If the vehicle does not have a compartment separate from the passenger compartment, the firearm must be in a locked container other than the vehicle's glove compartment or console.

 

is this an actual law, or are they just BSing and trying to enforce something that doesnt exist. i notice it says 'must' and not 'shall', if that has any bearing. granted this is just the FAQ page and not the actual law....but if so, why are they blatantly wrong and giving out false information.

 

second question, someone asked me what the "SBI #" is on a P2P pistol purchase permit. the only thing ive found is it in reference to some kind of background check. state background investigation perhaps?

 

 

they are literally making that up... they are advising you in a way that you are certain to not make errors.. but they are advertising the law incorrectly..

 

as a general rule of thumb.... unless it is actually part of a law.. I am not interested..

 

in case you forgot, I'VE ALWAYS AGREED IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE SEPARATE. I'VE SAID THIS IN A DOZEN OTHER POSTS. I'M NOT STATING IT SHOULD BE.

 

as i said, i found this on the njsp site while looking for something else

In your original post, I assumed that you were unsure of the law and were asking clarification.

 

ive always said there is no law stating you need to separate the ammo from firearm while transported

is this an actual law, or are they just BSing and trying to enforce something that doesnt exist

 

I didn't realize that you were only asking why the NJSP stated something contrary to the law.

 

BTW, they keep changing the site. It was on there before, took it down, then put it back up.

Since NJ does not define what it considers a "loaded firearm", they keep open multiple creative avenues that they can use against us if they so choose to pursue prosecution. Just like the AWB "constructive posession" , they could argue a similar definition of a "loaded firearm" under the circumstances in court if they so choose to. It would then become a legal battle over convincing the jury as to what a "loaded firearm" is. The state could argue that a loaded magazine, in the same vehicle, is constructively considered a loaded firearm as the magazine is a part of the said firearm, needed to operate by feeding the aforementioned ammunition. The defendant would have to argue that the magazine alone is not considered a firearm, give examples of various loaded firearms, and have to educate the jury on gun tech 101.

 

An expensive proposition, and yet another example of owning firearms "at your own peril" in NJ. Guilty until proven innocent.

. The state could argue that a loaded magazine, in the same vehicle, is constructively considered a loaded firearm as the magazine is a part of the said firearm,

 

I used to do this all the time, but when joined the OBRPC during the orientation this was brought up, they did ask that all members to not travel to and from the indoor or outdoor ranges with loaded Mags. They would like to err on the side of caution and I can live with that, but I did pick up a second Uplula loader just in case my main one craps out on me. Plus every time I have been in at the indoor range I have been to only person there so taking your time, relaxing and having the place to your self it isn't a big deal.

 

Now when I go to Shore Shot, I have them loaded just so I don't waste time loading and I can get my practice in and hopefully the reduced time at the range will allow others who may be waiting for a lane to open up get one a little quicker.

 

Harry

Not that I would actually try this, but wouldn't it be legal to drive a hatchback (which has no trunk) with two gunvaults bolted under the dashboard, one containing a gun and another containing loaded magazines? It's asking for trouble, but by the letter of the law it seems legal. For those who would argue that a loaded magazine is against the law, then substitute a revolver with speed loaders.

 

Any thoughts?

Not that I would actually try this, but wouldn't it be legal to drive a hatchback (which has no trunk) with two gunvaults bolted under the dashboard, one containing a gun and another containing loaded magazines? It's asking for trouble, but by the letter of the law it seems legal. For those who would argue that a loaded magazine is against the law, then substitute a revolver with speed loaders.

 

Any thoughts?

 

Well as written from my understanding, technically they would not be in the 2 locations named, Glove Box and Center Console, so by letter of law probably not illegal.

 

To add: There may be based on the interpretation of the law by a LEO who may have pulled you over that he may question the proximity of them to the driver and if called on it it would be you who would have to fight it being the so called Innocent until Proven doesn't always go hand and hand when it comes to firearms in NJ.

 

Harry

What's on the NJSP web site are *GUIDELINES*, aka suggestions. The NJSP's *GUIDELINES* are NOT *NEW JERSEY LAW*.

 

Here's *NEW JERSEY LAW* (2C:39-1):

 

http://lis.njleg.state.nj.us/cgi-bin/om_isapi.dll?clientID=220725&Depth=2&depth=2&expandheadings=on&headingswithhits=on&hitsperheading=on&infobase=statutes.nfo&record={1A38}&softpage=Doc_Frame_PG42

 

Regarding legal transport of firearms, *NEW JERSEY LAW* says:

 

...All weapons being transported under paragraph (2) of subsection b., subsection e., or paragraph (1) or (3) of subsection f. of this section shall be carried unloaded and contained in a closed and fastened case, gunbox, securely tied package, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and in the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances...

 

I haven't been able to find anything in *NEW JERSEY LAW* on the transportation of ammunition. Has anyone else?

 

If ammunition transportation is not specifically defined in the statutes then my interpretation is that there is NO restriction on how you transport ammo that is not "loaded" into a firearm.

What's on the NJSP web site are *GUIDELINES*, aka suggestions. The NJSP's *GUIDELINES* are NOT *NEW JERSEY LAW*.

 

Here's *NEW JERSEY LAW* (2C:39-1):

 

http://lis.njleg.sta...=Doc_Frame_PG42

 

Regarding legal transport of firearms, *NEW JERSEY LAW* says:

 

 

 

I haven't been able to find anything in *NEW JERSEY LAW* on the transportation of ammunition. Has anyone else?

 

If ammunition transportation is not specifically defined in the statutes then my interpretation is that there is NO restriction on how you transport ammo that is not "loaded" into a firearm.

 

Armor piercing have to be transported under the same rules as a gun (securely fastened package, etc).

 

Correction : only armor piercing, hollow points not included, my mistake:

 

f. (1) Any person who manufactures, causes to be manufactured, transports, ships, sells, or disposes of any bullet, which is primarily designed for use in a handgun, and which is comprised of a bullet whose core or jacket, if the jacket is thicker than .025 of an inch, is made of tungsten carbide, or hard bronze, or other material which is harder than a rating of 72 or greater on the Rockwell B. Hardness Scale, and is therefore capable of breaching or penetrating body armor and which is intended to be used for any purpose other than for authorized military or law enforcement purposes by duly authorized military or law enforcement personnel, is guilty of a crime of the fourth degree.

 

(2)Nothing in this subsection shall be construed to prevent a licensed collector of ammunition as defined in paragraph (2) of subsection f. of N.J.S.2C:39-3 from transporting the bullets defined in paragraph (1) of this subsection from (a) any licensed retail or wholesale firearms dealer's place of business to the collector's dwelling, premises, or other land owned or possessed by him, or (b) to or from the collector's dwelling, premises or other land owned or possessed by him to any gun show for the purposes of display, sale, trade, or transfer between collectors, or © to or from the collector's dwelling, premises or other land owned or possessed by him to any rifle or pistol club organized in accordance with the rules prescribed by the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice; provided that the club has filed a copy of its charter with the superintendent of the State Police and annually submits a list of its members to the superintendent, and provided further that the ammunition being transported shall be carried not loaded in any firearm and contained in a closed and fastened case, gun box, or locked in the trunk of the automobile in which it is being transported, and the course of travel shall include only such deviations as are reasonably necessary under the circumstances.

Edited March 21, 201115 yr by Dan