Ok so its glass time for my SPR build..need some help choosing from listed field

Gun has 18" Rainier Barrel 1/8 Twist .223 Wylde Chamber..gonna be throwing 69gr and up

 

Some parameters

 

1. Shooting from 50-300 yds

2. Looking for a nice balance of precision and versatility

3. If I go higher magnification model then the plan is to offset mount some sort of RMR..if going with     one of the 1.5 models then just sticking with that

4. All listed fall in my price range (Burris 1.5 is top end..Vortex would be cheapest)

5. All will be mounted in ADM Recon QD mount

6. Illumination is nice but not required

7. Don't necessarily need FFP

8. All have lifetime warranty policy

 

Any and all help is greatly appreciated as I am completely overwhelmed with the choices and am trying to follow the "buy once, cry once" mantra..

What are you going to use the rifle for ?

Vlad its going to be a fun gun more than anything..mostly paper shooting..some occasional steel...really been getting into hunting lately so hunting in areas that allow it might be a future use...not into the 3gun thing yet but hence another future possibility

If you are going it to use it as a range toy, get something with higher end amplification if you want to shoot tiny groups. If you want to shoot it close and far and maybe 3gun then get a 1-6 or 1-4, the 1 is very important vs 1.5x.

 

Go to Cabelas's or something and try to look through as many scopes from your list because to some extent it is a personal preference as well. I know what I'd choose for myself.

Personally, I'd wait for SWFA's tax day sale and snag a 1-6 on the cheap.

Personally, I'd wait for SWFA's tax day sale and snag a 1-6 on the cheap.

 

That is a good option, but my vote would be to buy a used Vortex Gen 2 1-6.  You can find some good deals on them on the various boards.  Lifetime transferrable warranty means you don't have to worry about it being used.  Glass is best in class for its price point IMO.  I have 3 of them I like em so much.  The glass is true 1x so you can shoot both eyes open and it has a red dot in the middle if you want to use it that way.  

I will note I also had a Vortex PST 2.5-10x and the glass quality was very good but I felt that the magnification range was kind of useless for the shooting that I do.  I rarely if ever go past 340yds and bc of that I prefer a true 1x scope for anything except a long range precision rifle.

I was gonna suggest something with a true 1x as well

 

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I didn't vote but wanted to make a point-

 

You list MOA reticles & Mil reticle scopes.  The best advice I can give is to make sure the turrets match you reticle i.e. Mil dot & Mil/Mil turrets.  HAving mismatched turrets, like a Mil dot reticle and MOA turrets is old school and not necessary.

 

Personally, I'm a mil dot/dash kind of guy.

 

*Edit-I'm also a fan of Vortex.  You get a lot of value, comparable to more expensive scopes.

 

 

Eric

I didn't vote but wanted to make a point-

 

You list MOA reticles & Mil reticle scopes. The best advice I can give is to make sure the turrets match you reticle i.e. Mil dot & Mil/Mil turrets. HAving mismatched turrets, like a Mil dot reticle and MOA turrets is old school and not necessary.

 

Personally, I'm a mil dot/dash kind of guy.

 

*Edit-I'm also a fan of Vortex. You get a lot of value, comparable to more expensive scopes.

 

 

Eric

Excellent point. Need mil/mil or moa/moa to make easy math.

Understood on the mil/moa issue...I guess my biggest question for me is whether to go with a higher magnification scope and use a offset mounted RMR for close range..or just go with the 1-6 option...Im leaning with the first option but still cant pull the trigger either way..

 

 

Understood on the mil/moa issue...I guess my biggest question for me is whether to go with a higher magnification scope and use a offset mounted RMR for close range..or just go with the 1-6 option...Im leaning with the first option but still cant pull the trigger either way..

It sounds like you want your SPR to be able to do CQB duty too, which isn't always practical.  The guys that shoot ppl for a living say that your rifle setup should be mission driven.  If you set it up as an SPR, then its set up for longer range accuracy.  It won't be the lightest or shortest gun.  Also, your optics should favor longer shots.

 

That said, if you want a compromise, use a 45 degree mount reflex sight.  Also, thimk about somethjng like the Leupold 4-14 scope.  It should be flexible enough for between 10 to 400ish yards.  Remember, ACOGs are usually 4x and are good for close stuff short of going form room to room.

 

 

Eric

It sounds like you want your SPR to be able to do CQB duty too, which isn't always practical. The guy that shoot ppl for a living say that your rifle setup should be mission driven. If you set it up as an SPR, then its set up for longer range accuracy. It won't be the lightest or shortest gun. Also, your optics should favor longer shots.

 

That said, if you want a compromise, use a 45 degree mount reflex sight. Also, thimk about somethjng like the Leupold 4-14 scope. It should be flexible enough for between 10 to 400ish yards. Remember, ACOGs are usually 4x and are good for close stuff short of going form room to room.

 

 

Eric

Got ya Eric...for me I spec'd and built the gun to be more precision driven...but wanted to have to have a close in option as well....but the gun would be more suites for longer range applications..I know Im asking for something that might be unobtainable...I appreciate all the input fellas

It sounds like you want your SPR to be able to do CQB duty too, which isn't always practical. The guys that shoot ppl for a living say that your rifle setup should be mission driven. If you set it up as an SPR, then its set up for longer range accuracy. It won't be the lightest or shortest gun. Also, your optics should favor longer shots.

 

That said, if you want a compromise, use a 45 degree mount reflex sight. Also, thimk about somethjng like the Leupold 4-14 scope. It should be flexible enough for between 10 to 400ish yards. Remember, ACOGs are usually 4x and are good for close stuff short of going form room to room.

 

 

Eric

There's a difference between having a cqb gun and having an spr that is adequate in short to medium range (which to me is 0-300yds). A 1-6 imo is more than enough to do so if op is looking at a hunting or 3 gun set up.

 

What is your definition of "short stuff"? An acog would certainly not be my optic of choice.

 

 

 

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There's a difference between having a cqb gun and having an spr that is adequate in short to medium range (which to me is 0-300yds). A 1-6 imo is more than enough to do so if op is looking at a hunting or 3 gun set up.

 

What is your definition of "short stuff"? An acog would certainly not be my optic of choice.

 

 

 

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My idea of "short" is within 200 yds. The point was that an SPR, by definition, is a longer barreled rifle with longer range accuracy potential. Why would you have a 6x optic on an SPR? For that matter, the guys at Crane went with a fixed 10x, originally...

 

My last point is having your gun setup to handle close work and long work will just result in a gun that isn't ideal for neither.  Also, using an SPR set up for 3 gun is just plain silly.

 

I know, that was 2 last points.

 

 

Eric

My idea of "short" is within 200 yds. The point was that an SPR, by definition, is a longer barreled rifle with longer range accuracy potential. Why would you have a 6x optic on an SPR? For that matter, the guys at Crane went with a fixed 10x, originally...

 

My last point is having your gun setup to handle close work and long work will just result in a gun that isn't ideal for neither. Also, using an SPR set up for 3 gun is just plain silly.

 

I know, that was 2 last points.

 

 

Eric

you said before, mission drives the gear. Why put a 12x on something he's gonna try to shoot at 75 yards? By your logic he should scrap his build cause its silly to use under 300.

 

I'm not a 3 gun guy but why is it silly to use an spr? There are plenty of reduced weight barrels and hand guards out there to minimize weight. What would you suggest?

 

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Got ya Eric...for me I spec'd and built the gun to be more precision driven...but wanted to have to have a close in option as well....but the gun would be more suites for longer range applications..I know Im asking for something that might be unobtainable...I appreciate all the input fellas

You might be building more of a DMR than a SPR.  SPRs are typically dual role rifles which are as capable at 50 yards as they are at 500 yards.  A DMR is more oriented toward longer range shooting and are typically heavier and feature more powerful optics.  You could make a DMR a little more CQB friendly by adding an offset RDS.

Thinking this type of setup..

 

you said before, mission drives the gear. Why put a 12x on something he's gonna try to shoot at 75 yards? By your logic he should scrap his build cause its silly to use under 300.

 

I'm not a 3 gun guy but why is it silly to use an spr? There are plenty of reduced weight barrels and hand guards out there to minimize weight. What would you suggest?

 

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I think the original post is getting buried. The OP stated that he already has an 18" spr barrel and his intended use range is 50 to 300 yards. That said, imo, a 4-14x variable optic would work well. Especially since it was stated that some precision target shooting was in the plan. For that matter, having a tiny bit extra magnification doesnt hurt and at the 4x end, you have a nice wide field of vision.

 

The 4x ACOG was an exaple of what the military feels is a good magnification for 0 to 250 yards. i wasnt suggesting he put an acog on.

 

All that said, the OPs current setup is probably not optimum for 3 gun. a heavier 18" spr profile barrel is a bit long and a bit heavy. 3g favors light, shorter barrels and quick target acquisition. 3g setups are not good for longer range precision work or 300 yard hunting shots.

 

Its too much to ask to have a 1 size fits all. Best bet is to make another AR or at very least, build a second upper that you can swap out easily.

 

 

Eric

Thinking this type of setup..

 

This pic is a typical SPR. It looks like a longer, SPR barrel. Rifle length gas. Guessing, it looks lile a 5-20x Schmidt Bender PM II scope. Mucho dinero. Kinda similar to a MK 12 mod 1.

 

It also has a 45 degree holo sight. The set up has the holo sight as a cqb back up, but make no mistake, the guns primary role is to extend the reach of the squad.

 

 

Eric

You might be building more of a DMR than a SPR.  SPRs are typically dual role rifles which are as capable at 50 yards as they are at 500 yards.  A DMR is more oriented toward longer range shooting and are typically heavier and feature more powerful optics.  You could make a DMR a little more CQB friendly by adding an offset RDS.

Agreed on the 50yd to 500yd range being most ideal for an SPR.

 

I know I'm splitting hairs buy a dmr rifle and an spr are very similar in roles and performance. The Navy is using a MK 12, the Marines and Army are using a SAMR. The first uses an 18" barrel, the other a 20"er.

 

 

Eric

 

All that said, the OPs current setup is probably not optimum for 3 gun. a heavier 18" spr profile barrel is a bit long and a bit heavy. 3g favors light, shorter barrels and quick target acquisition. 3g setups are not good for longer range precision work or 300 yard hunting shots.

 

 

That's like almost 100% incorrect. The medium profile 18" barrel is the most common in 3gun rifles, and most major matches are won or lost somewhere between 200 and 400 yards, in my experience. Don't TV's 3gun nation pro series shape your image of 3gun. Actual matches are very different.

That's like almost 100% incorrect. The medium profile 18" barrel is the most common in 3gun rifles, and most major matches are won or lost somewhere between 200 and 400 yards, in my experience. Don't TV's 3gun nation pro series shape your image of 3gun. Actual matches are very different.

If you think what I mentioned is "almost 100% incorrect", then I really don't know if there is anything more for me to say.

 

I am no 3gun expert, so lets get that out of the way.  I'm not clueless either.

 

without getting into a senseless, hair splitting pissing match, let me make my point simple, then you can posture all you want.

 

3gun favors speed/mobility and lightweight.  Typically, those guys use lite weight, fixed stocks, thinner profile barrels, lite freefloat guards and 1-4x optics.  If this isn't the opposite of a true SPR, then I don't jnow what is.

 

 

Eric

Yup, sorry you are wrong. I recommend you go shoot some 3gun. Its fun.

 

You will indeed see almost everything, because we like to experiment, but the average rifle is probably 9-10lb, medium profile 18" stainless steel barrel, handguard of users choice not always chosen for lightness. Stocks may be of any kind the user finds fit him best. Optics vary depending on division from irons, to red dots, to low power variables, to high high power variables with side mounted red dots. The closest to a "favorite" optic is the 1-6 Vortex, but it is probably 10% of what you see.

Yup, sorry you are wrong. I recommend you go shoot some 3gun. Its fun.

 

You will indeed see almost everything, because we like to experiment, but the average rifle is probably 9-10lb, medium profile 18" stainless steel barrel, handguard of users choice not always chosen for lightness. Stocks may be of any kind the user finds fit him best. Optics vary depending on division from irons, to red dots, to low power variables, to high high power variables with side mounted red dots. The closest to a "favorite" optic is the 1-6 Vortex, but it is probably 10% of what you see.

You still didnt get the point.

 

You win.

 

 

Eric