Jfoster99

I just got this belt and am very happy with it. I is extremely thick and sturdy without being inflexible. I'm only wearing it for two days now but it is going to perform it's job we'll. Cabelas item number is IK-95-5404 "Double Duty Belt" $39.99. Other leather belts I looked at we're double and tripple the price. Anybody looking for a belt under $50 was referred to the 5-11 Tactical, including me. It is good but as a belt it is made of nylon and not really appropriate for a more formal occasion. ( say dinner out) http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-9kQfxEKwTEk/UAsbhO9WrbI/AAAAAAAAZ7I/LS7a1qMh74k/s2048/IMAGE_BD8C2277-A39B-43A5-8422-D14267B2A7C3.JPG

Look like we will need new wallets... Funny the only state i ever heard of having a law dictating the size of the ccw permit is breaking their own law... http://www.usacarry.com/forums/south-carolina-discussion-firearm-news/16788-permit-size-mine-almost-4-5-inches.html

Cold Soldier, I do not think they can sell if there is a lien... With larger investments you get title insurance in case someone claims the property was not legally sold but in this case all/any of that gets cost prohibitive. Their is not enough risk if forfeited. We are however looking into liability insurance I case some get hurt on the property. I know my homeowners covers vacant land I own already just not sure how it worksite own with friends. Again the risk is very small. The town has a quick claim deed form that the owned signs and the town records the new owners on the deed. It CAN be that simple. The owner singes it notorized with two witnesses. Their is no place the buy even signs... I guess some could even say I do not own at lot... I never agreed to have my name on it... Very strange the way they role down south... Page 1 quick claim form http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-tV9pwaFTO38/UArNnE-oCqI/AAAAAAAAZ60/47lb5TstgIU/s2048/IMAGE_88E72BA1-2926-4E52-8B08-AFB2AB1DE34F.PNG Page 2 quick claim form. http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-JsnOqRsoxX8/UArNphFai4I/AAAAAAAAZ68/rGjudPYL8h0/s2048/IMAGE_BDE93CDD-DE13-4604-BFD4-BD8FB2603E34.PNG

The property is not on HHI. The original one I posted is not available. There are two others both in the center of the state. One I'd $500 the other is $800. One of the " partners" is an instructor so he could train the rest here in NJ. There is an S.C. Forum I looked thru. Found some good info there. They had the direct number to SLED that rings right to the people processing the applications. http://www.scfirearms.org/ We have Four now with civic tuner so if anyone else is interested you can be first alternate. Someone always changes their mind so I really would like to have an alternate or two. I'll cc you on everything so if someone drops out you are up to speed having done you own due diligence and stuff. The good thing is we just submit a form that the town clerk signs certifying we own property / pay taxes. They do not see any info about the lot. Neither form below ask for address of the property owned. Standard App http://www.sled.sc.gov/documents/CWPApplicationForm.pdf Non Resident's also have to submit this. http://www.sled.sc.gov/documents/Non-Resident%20CWP%20Permit%20Form.doc Not sure but seems like someone who owned a condo would have more trouble them us getting the permit.

I agree... I believe Colorado is "shall issue"l Not a Single person out of 70+ shot had a CCW? The national average for states that issue is like 2-3% so the odds are 2 people shot should have have had ccw permits. Even if people only Carry 50% of the time that leaves 1 guy with a gun on him shot. Plus a whole bunch more people in the theater not shot should have had a gun on them... Only thing I can think of is theaters or a prohibited place?. Perhaps that's why he choose it.

I just got off the phone and again confirmed owning property is all that is required. I specifically mentioned I have justa small lot no house and I am not a resident.. They are very nice... No attitude like others states I have spoke with.. There are now two plus me interested.. One more should do it. If the fourth was a NRA basic instructor he could get SC certified to do training for $100. Then certify the other 3.. I confirmed there is no in state requirement to take the class. Maybe he gets a free ride on the deed? Just a thought?.. I'd have to ask the other two how they felt.. Any NRA instructors out there???

Cold soldier, Good point... The new lot is undestrubed land but I will check with the town if I needs to be maintained. Another good point. Thank you. Also, the current owner got it in a tax sale. The owner before him went into foreclosure on a bunch of properties so he ended up with this piece. Vjf915, The realeststate agent recommended a " Quick Claim Deed". She said that is what most people do when it is just land? Especially at the price we are looking at. It cost $10 and is covered by the seller not the buyer?

More pics http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-o6RAEd2SS0A/UAi2XsRPfII/AAAAAAAAZ54/BgIn3VJ-GTY/s2048/IMAGE_7437A0E0-A0B0-4451-8858-9AA5365C872A.JPG http://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-APZv9eV329s/UAi2dcAHHXI/AAAAAAAAZ6Y/Czb_4SUT0bc/s2048/IMAGE_DC79EF81-CE61-44E4-935D-D1E4556C72D1.JPG http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-SPYmMwaMzi4/UAi2b-j-ejI/AAAAAAAAZ6Q/pY5Hb9GbRyU/s2048/IMAGE_4FAC79BF-E2C8-45E1-9CD2-3755BE7297C3.JPG

A friend purchased this off the Internet about 10 years ago. It came direct from France. I was opened and taped. Would this be considered a firearm? Would it be considered a weapon and not be carried in states that only allow firearms? Has anyone ever seen or read about this or something similar? I he sells it does it need to go thru an FFL? How much should he ask? Would you consider carrying it as a primary or backup? I fired it at 2 pieces of sheet rock and it went right through both of them and keeps going. http://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-zfQdUD-FKZs/UAi2V-M6J0I/AAAAAAAAZ5w/q8u7fQ4bbS8/s2048/IMAGE_F51A60CB-33C1-4BD0-B036-F4AD357EA09B.JPG

j0n, Thanks I see your point the way it reads... I will call back to their office tomorrow. They are very helpful. They spent 15 minutes helping me get around the training requirement and not having to take the 8hr class in state, there are 2 exemptions. I walked her thru my plan and she confirmed everything. I was making sure my local PD could do the prints, the app could be mailed in and the license mailed out. She confirmed everything could be done by mail. Also confirmed if you are a NRA Basic Pistol instructor you are exempt for training . General UPdate: I have one interested partner so far. We could use one or two more!!! PM me if ypu don't want to go public. The specific lot posted above was not available but I found another lot. It is similar, not usable for anything. The property tax is $26 a year. I spoke with the real estate agent today. She confirmed for small land only deals they can do a "Quick Claim Deed" thru the town clerk for $10. The owner just fills out a Notorized form listing the names of the buyers and the town records the change. She is sending me a copy of the form for my review. The same process would apply if someone wants off the deed in a few years.

HNDCNN, Welcome.... If I understand correctly ATF basically brow beat you out of applying? Did you feel pressured or was it more of a FYI save your $30 bucks tone. I would proceed regardless of if I can actually purchase mail order.. However, if ATF took a threading tone then I don't want to be a test case for anything. I would likely back down and protest their behavior.

Not from anything I read or in speaking to the sc issuing office today.. But I would love a link to why you think that...

I read on a sc forum that if you pay property tax it qualifies. Here it a link to the specific parcel listing. http://www.landandfarm.com/property/Land_-297205/ I agree I certainly need to research more and two or three researchers are better then one. As for nj2a membership I plan on joining next month.. I just got my life NRA last month and life ANJRPC the month before that.. I need to spread the expenses out a bit to stay below the cfo's radar (CFO=wife) I have a call into the broker to see what the property tax. Will post what I learn when they call back. I would just ask no one else call. I don't want to give impression there is more then one party interested. I plan on making a lowball offer if at all. .

The Price is $400... No zero's missing I do plan to pay cash but thought maybe a partner or two would be interested. I'm not sure what the closing fee's would be so it may be cost prohibitive to do it on my own. I prefer the keep the project under my wifes radar initially which means under $500 total cost... Any more then that and we are supposed to discuss any expenses... After the fact it is easier to get forgiveness the permission... It is not soooo much money that if something went wrong with the partnership I have all that much to loose. The worst thing I see happening is if someone ever got hurt on the property and sued.. I think my home owners cover vacant land as the policy stands now or maybe the partners pay a few dollars a year for insurance... For now if anyone is willing to pay a few hundred dollars to have a S.C. CCW permit let me know... We can research the details together and then decide if it still makes sense... No need to Poo-Poo the idea just because it falls outside your risk tolerance level.. But if you can point out specific pitfalls with the plan that I am over looking I am all ears and welcome them.. As for it being Legit below is the law referring to it... If you have a reason why you thing it is not legit I'd love to hear it.. Seems like S.C. Is a Must Issue State so that should help.. "The State Law Enforcement Division must issue permits to carry handguns to a person who is a resident of South Carolina, or a non-resident who owns property in South Carolina, or military personnel on permanent change of station orders; who is not prohibited from possessing a firearm; who is at least 21; who provides one current full face color photograph; proof of residence; proof of actual or corrected 20/40 vision; proof of training; and fingerprints. "Permits and renewals are valid for four years and cost $50. An appeal from a denial of a permit may be taken to the Chief of the State Law Enforcement Division. Renewal is available upon payment of a $50 renewal fee, completion of a renewal application and submission of a copy of the applicant’s valid South Carolina driver’s license or South Carolina identification card. Once a permit holder is no longer a resident of the state, the permit is void and must be surrendered."

My Florida, Az and Utah Ccw permits t not cover me in South Carolina. I frequent Hilton Head quite often and would like to be able to carry there. S.C. Does not recognize any Non Resident CCW Permits. They offer their own Non resident ccw but you need to own property. I found a beautiful 20'x283' lot for sale for $400. Looking for a few good men who could benefit from a S.C. CCW permit. Anyone with a lawyer in the family willing to assist in the closing is preferred. I have a brother in law but I hate to ask him.. I suspect 2-4 people on the deed would be about the right number.

I know I can have hallow points with me if going to the range or hunting but what about when traveling to PA while covered under FOPA? I current carry hondady critical defense just to be safe because I was not 100% percent either way... If a hallow point falls out of my range bag and I get stop cruising in NJ and the police see it in plain sight I would be screwed, correct?

Would say .40sw ( winchester white box or equivalent) target ammo be at least as effective as your favorite/best 9mm defense ammo in a ccw scenario? Would anyone who feels 9mm with the right ammo is sufficient for self defense feel .40sw with any old ammo is not sufficient?( assuming reliability is not an issue.) strictly from a ballistic perspective? I recently carried my G27 with a mixed bag of quality range ammo. Just wondering if others would have felt Under protected.

The "Book" Am I required to maintain a book if I have not made any purchases? If inspected would I be expected to produce a booK with zero entries to show I have not made any purchases. ( Reason im asking is the book runs about $30)

Would having the C&R allow me to buy say a tokarev pistol at an out of state gun store if I am there in person or buy a c&r pistol at a PA gunshow?

Wow... I just read some of the additional comments posted this morning.. It is refreshing to see som many of you agree FOPA is all the coverage you need. I felt like a leper at PAFOA. After banning me that posted a sticy forbidding anyone from discussing FOPA transport. They are afraid someone will get arrested and sue the forum for advising it was ok. I also called the NJ state police last week. I told them I live in nj and got job in PA. I wanted to take my handgun to PA every day for self defense as I had a pa ccw. His initial answer was just keep it locked in the trunk. After I explained my concern about the allowed activities and I was not doing any of them we read the law together line by line.. He was trying to show me I could take it with me as he said but in the end said. The law does not provide for every possible scenario and I should consult a lawyer. I asked him if that meant it was illegal he said " I'm not saying that". I asked if he thought that. NJ police would make an arrest under this scenario? He said he most likely would not unless there was some other issue"..,

I am not afraid transport to PA under FOPA and did so this weekend without "stopping at a range" My personal stance on the issue is in line with what Halbautomitsch posted. Below at bottom is a PAFOA post of mine almost identical to Halbautomitsch's post. This all started for me when I got a beat down for posting my intention to tranport to PA under FOPA. I got referred to As a Felon. Risking the well being of my wif and children, risking loosing my gun rights forev, ect. After being told by an entire forum I am wrong in my thinking I got to wondering what would be the Minimal amount of effort to stay technically legal under the accepted activity exemption ( hunting, target shooting) hence my question here. I doubt I am going to follow it but nice to know or be able to post the results of what I hoped to outcome of this topic here would produce for someone who was looking to meet NJ exceptions. The whole thread is here: http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-carry-145/179068-concealed-carry-kids-summer-camp.html Below is My PAFOA post that got me banned for life: Just to clarify I called NJ State Police Firearms Division. But I agree there word is not law... However it does give insight as to how they might handle this. Maybe... I realize there is risk involved here but how I mitigate is to travel with targets, spotting, scope and shooting glasses. If questioned on the way to PA I intend to go Target shooting, if questioned on the way back I intended to go target shooting but got a headache would be my defense. I think the intent is relevant in a court of law as much as the action. ( what if the range was closed, you forgot the ammo, ect) The most important is to give the right answer when asked. "where are you coming from sir with those handgun in your trunk?" " I am coming from PA where I went to do some Target shooting, see my targets/scope officer" Once in PA the directly to clause is not longer an issue until I cross back into NJ.

PK90, I agree FOPA should apply NJ to Pa for handgun transport but here is a well researched opposing view point. http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-open-carry-121/140698-fopa-transport-protection-states-origin-destination-unlikely-report.html Worth the read weather you agree or not. I alway and still do rely on FOPA traveling to PA but after reading the above it make you wonder.

Woodento, A lot of people do not think FOPA covers you NJ to PA with a handgun. So you have to be going hunting or to the range in PA.. Some people, stop at the range to fire a shot just to be legal when going to PA just to CCW. Below is the post I found helpful ar PAFOA. Re: Meeting minimum NJ transport exception As to the question of transport NJ<-->Pa see: http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-ope...ly-report.html (FOPA transport protection in states of origin/destination - UNLIKELY [A Report]) As to the 'range' exception just remember that the burden of proof that you qualify for that exception is on you - the prosecution only has to prove your possession of a handgun while in NJ without an NJCCW. Also bear in mind that the trier-of-law and the trier-of-fact, if you are prosecuted, is an NJ judge and jury of NJ peers, most likely neither being gun-friendly. As Gunlawyer001 aptly said (and it applies to some of the purported range exceptions espoused here and in other threads): Quote: Originally Posted by GunLawyer001 Here's a good rule of thumb: If the only defense standing between you and a Misdemeanor 1 conviction is a story that you'd just have to deliver with a smirk, then you're screwed. Judges don't like "cute", not unless it's blond and nobody's watching. In NJ illegal handgun possession is a 2nd class crime with 5-10 years. Some thoughts from another of my posts: Quote: Originally Posted by tl_3237 As with any exception to a prohibition, the burden of proof falls on the person claiming the exception. Whether that burden is met will depend on with the cop, who can use officer's discretion, or the trier-of-fact (jury or judge in bench trial). If I was a juror I would be looking for such things as: 1. range proximity; 2. range membership; 3. past history of range usage; 4. non-circuitous route to/from range; 5. possession of ancillary range equipment - a. hearing/eye protection; b. amount of ammo; c. any targets possessed; 6. weather; 7. hours of operation vs. when stopped; 8. etc I would take all that you offered in your defense and adjudge the veracity of your claim based on the 'reasonableness' of the circumstances. Though not foolproof, I think that most can see through a sham claim. There are no bright lines for what you want but, using a reasonable person test, if all you have is those vacuous defenses then you going to be 'fried'. --------- Quote: Originally Posted by CartBone69 1st before is locked No reason for locking. IMO, the newly imposed restrictions do not prevent the hypothesizing such as the OP's but only for those who adamantly insist that these types of scenarios are not without great uncertainty and potentially severe legal risk. __________________ IANAL

Hum... I post the exact same question almost verbatim at PAFOA and got a spot on reply. No shrugs, no rolling just an awesome helpful answer.. This is a firearms forum correct? " I'm specifically interested in meeting the NJ transport requirement ... Not FOPA.." I'm ain't looking to transport a truck load of live stock No need form any other responses... I got what I needed already... And for those who did try to help i do appreciate the effort. You guys need to work on hospitality, especially with new comers. If you want this place to grow it takes effort. Otherwise you end up talking with that same 20 guys for years in the little all boys club.

I'm not looking for legal advice., just was a few reasonable people think would be sufficient to technically meet the requiremt for having partaked in the required activity. I go the way I do because it is the quickest.. The NY leg is clearly FOPA protected. No grey area there so no concern for me.