5th4x4

Or if you wanted the 16" version https://www.bravocompanyusa.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BCM-URG-M4-16

Yes. Very true. That may prove to be a good work-around for me. Thanks for that thought.

At least something good came out this dopey thread : )

But a "functional" adjustable stock + a hand grip + a removable magazine = No go. So adjustable is only a temporary state, and therefore the buffer tube's role reverts back to it's primary purpose only. Yes, there are fixed stocks that will provide what I desire. But as I have already stated, I wanted to try an adjustable stock because I wanted to adjust it to find the right "fit" for me. That said, the fact remains that I still haven't sent a single round down range with this rifle yet, so the "fit" is yet to be finalized. Dry-firing is good for pre-configuring this rifle, but it is not an adequate substitute for live fire. Therefore the "look" is a compromise that leads to a greater purpose for me. But that doesn't mean that I'm not interested in then altering that look (if possible) after I have configured the length as I prefer to have it. But I guess I really didn't expect the type of reaction that I'd encounter for simply asking about altering that look (which is fine - different strokes for different folks - I understand that). But the bottom-line is that the purpose of my question wasn't based on altering the functionality of the rifle strictly for the sake of making it "look cool" (or whatever). So I'm a bit surprised that I've suddenly become the enemy of the buffer tube's honor for not revering it's external appearance. After all, I do understand that it gives the rifle a look that people like. I just didn't realize how sacred that look was.

Again, I never said it was ugly. It's just not my ideal of "beauty" (and I am now unmistakably aware that I am completely alone in that opinion). For me the buffer tube is an "inside" part of the rifle. And as much as I love every one of the 206 bones in my body... I have no desire to ever physically look at any of them. So I can assure you that I would be looking for a solution for putting my bones back inside just as I want to find a solution for putting that buffer tube inside ; )

Yeah, good point. I was aware of that before I purchased the adjustable version, but I truly expected that I would take advantage of the adjustability aspect to experiment with different lengths in order to find my ideal setting (length). So if it turns out that the 2nd click is better than the 3rd click, I will have to decide whether or not I want to shell-out more rifle-dollars to replace the "gappy" version with the carbine version. After all, I did admit that this issue was "cosmetic" and nothing more. In other words, what's it really worth to me.

I certainly respect your opinion enormously, so I'm only asking this for reasons of clarification. I'm not sure I understand the meaning of "function" as it's stated. As I view it (as someone admittedly 100% new to adjustable stocks), an adjustable stock obviously has the function of being adjustable. Although here in NJ that function loses it's "adjustability" aspect immediately upon pinning. So a stock becomes just a stock, regardless of it's length. (fixed or adjusted to fixed). That doesn't necessarily make it pretty (in my eyes at least : P ) but I'm truly not grasping the context of your statement. (although I sincerely wish to, so I hope that you will help me understand what you are trying to tell me)

Paracord is obviously a McGuyver possibility (combined with something to fill the lower portion). And btw, the sling attachment that you posted earlier is certainly a less intrusive means of filling the gap directly behind the end-plate. So that's a potential partial work-around. But anyway, this is obviously not the best received request that I could have presented today, so I'll take that as a sign that my cosmetic tastes are are a bit more exotic than normal ; ) Oh well. But as I said right from word-one: beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

The minute I picked up the rifle after attaching the rear site (last position on the upper) I naturally gravitated to a NTCH location (although probably a fat finger... or 2 skinny fingers back from there) and then I sought the best length for the stock for my shoulder. And the position I chose allows me to attain a pretty compact hold (no flying wing). And yes, the position of the stock is far enough back that my cheek rest is partially on the buffer. Even so, moving the stock closer does not feel right for me. Besides, the fixed length stocks - including the A1 that I was accustomed to - are at least an inch longer than the position that I am set at right now. Like I said, the range will determine the exact position, but I've already snapped-in using closer positions, and the only position that was comfortable to me was the one shown (as well as 1 click closer). Regardless... still a gap. I'm certainly not suggesting that dry-firing is a substitute for live firing at a range, but "feel" matters when dry-firing, and that is the position that feels right to me. Perhaps that changes with the introduction of optics... but I have no frame of reference with that as of yet.

I did come across this.... And even though it doesn't exactly fit what I'm looking for, it at least plugged the gap on that particular rifle. I was just wondering if there was something else out there that accomplished something similar (minus the strap fittings).

Never said it was ugly, I'm just not fond of how it looks. I'm probably in the major minority on this (maybe even alone in this) but it is what it is. I'm certainly not dissing other people's likes or dislikes, I'm only expressing my own tastes in this regard. If this is a first, well.... there's a first for everything ; )

I'll McGuyver something if necessary. The main caveat however is that the charging handle needs to maintain the same low-profile clearance for the castle nut and the upper boundary of the stock itself. That's the reason for seeking an existing solution to this (if any).

The Magpul fixed stock that is being suggested is 1" longer than my current setting. And even my current setting was a compromise between that click and the next closest (shorter) click. I'm counting on range performance to determine the actual length that fits me best.

Fixed is fixed. I'd prefer to find the click that works best for me, and not a predetermined length.

While my iron sights are a must for me, I do plan on adding/using optics as well. And even though this stock is already pinned, it's pinned with a pin... so that can be tapped-out and the stock re-adjusted as necessary. That said, the gap is the issue for me at the moment, and that's what I'd prefer to address right now.

Pending the outcome of how me/rifle perform at the range, this appears to be the comfortable position for me. Simply pinning the stock at position zero is not a comfortable position for me.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and this particular beholder is not fond of the "the gap" between the end-plate and the stock. F'rinstance: (please excuse the horrible picture quality. For those who have followed my build thread, this is my current - and highly inadequate - plan B for addressing my digi-cam problem. But this should at least provide enough of a visual supplement for representing the situation) Deal killer? Of course not. But I already know that I'm not the first guy here who hasn't had the desire to cosmetically alter their rifle to one degree or another. And since an "adjustable" stock in this state is adjustable only until it gets pinned, the cosmetic end-result for my particular adjusted/pinned stock length doesn't necessarily appeal to me. Therefore I'm wondering if anyone here has addressed this situation and found something - or DIY'ed - to close that gap (cosmetically). Obviously a fixed stock wouldn't present this type of gap situation. But I elected to go with an adjustable stock because I did not have that luxury (stock length adjustability) with my USGI M16's, and I wanted my AR rifle build to produce MY rifle as I wanted it to be configured, and as I wanted it to look. I'm a handy guy, so I could obviously figure something out. But I also don't believe in reinventing the wheel. Therefore if someone has already found/created this particular wheel, I would appreciate a heads-up for dealing with this situation. Thanks!

With all due respect, the op also didn't ask if it is anyones opinion as to whether it appears legal (or not) either. He wants to know if it is. In your case Howi, I would contact someone with legal authority in one of the NJ military bases and pose that question. If your Army try Ft Dix. If your Marine/Navy try Naval Weapons Station Earl. If your AF try McGuire. I didn't include a Coastie, since with a screen name such as "Howi", I assume that you are either Army or Marine (although you could also obtain the legality of that from a CG base too, I suppose, so maybe try Air Station Atlantic City) They have guys transferring in and out from everywhere, so someone with actually authority at one of those bases could provide you with what you can/can't bring into the state.

On the first point, yes, there has been progress, so I really should provide some updates. Unfortunately it's a bit of a buzzkill that my dig-cam has now officially bit the dust, since pictures speak louder than words. So in lieu of pictures, you're all stuck with just 'words' for the moment. (I'll go to a plan B regarding pics though, so stand by for that). The rifle is officially built! So aside from a mag (ordered, but apparently the last item to actually be delivered) I'm gtg! I slapped the handguards on yesterday (and I've been negligent about thanking checko/Chris for shipping them off to me. Sorry bro. But just so you know, I'm definitely liking the look and feel!). I had also acquired and mounted the most basic of iron sights (rear); a Knight's Armament 600m Micro, courtesy of a fellow jarhead. Lacks visual 'pop' but it sights just fine for me (for now, at least). Speaking of "for now".... I've already swapped out a few basic items for different preferential choices; The lower PK came with a basic pistol grip and trigger guard. I upgraded to a BCM Gunfighter grip and a Magpol enhanced trigger guard. Much better! Lesson learned.... I should have purchased the trigger parts separately and saved myself a few dollars (including shipping costs). NOTE TO POTENTIAL FIRST TIME AR BUILDERS: Learn from my mistake. Buy what you need, and buy what you want, but don't just buy to "get'er done" quick. You'll only end up spending more $ in the long run. (my impetuous nature has truly worked against me throughout this build process : / ) The bottom-line is that this was totally worth doing. Therefore I definitely appreciate the encouragement from you guys to build instead of buy. I do feel somewhat short-changed by my (impetuous) decision to buy a fully assembled upper instead of building it. But my upper is sweet... so I doubt that I would have ended up with the BCM if I had actually built it from scratch. My rifle is not the 'looker' that most of you guys post pictures of, but it's beautiful as far as I'm concerned - and I'm sure to add more to it over time. I'll post some pics as soon as I have time/a plan B. As per the second point, I think it would be great to head out to PA and meet some of you guys, but I'm really backed-up on work these days, and that's a lot of hours that I really can't afford to spend on 'play' at the moment. (btw, most of my 'play' time lately has actually been spent here on the NJGF site! So that right there tells you where my playtime preferences gravitate) But anyway, please don't let this 'no' dissuade any further offers. (because as George Costanza would say, "I'm down!")

Hey, the fact that I choose to acclimate to the ways here is a testament to my ability to alter previously held beliefs (that were drilled into me like few will ever truly know!). I wasn't complaining... or criticizing. Just commenting. It's an adjustment for me. That's all I'm saying.

I brought my upper to OSA for that very purpose. I believe the original quote was $30 (maybe $35. I'll check the rcpt if you want me to). However....... ...my previous experience with AR's (and I'm specifically referring to the M16), meant that the bayo lug didn't even register with me as something that would be considered a no-go (it looked perfectly normal to my eyes). But Vlad and Lalo did notice (of course. These guys don't miss anything) so after I had dropped off my upper with OSA, I rcvd a call from the gun-shop there telling me that the lug also needed to be gone. They charged me an additional $20 for that, I believe. And just for the record: Much to the chagrin of Vlad and others here, I myself did not have my 'lawless' rifle parts directly shipped to an FFL when I purchased them. My impetuous nature just wanted parts to build(!). So the legal ramifications of my actions were not anywhere to be found on my radar. It was however, fully on theirs. So I can assure you that while it initially seemed to me that it was all a lot of overkill to be as cautious as they were advising me to be, they do preach the letter of the law - and for that they cannot be faulted. And I'll even go a step further and say that they should be commended for expressing the level of concern that they do for the less knowledgeable members here. Because seriously... the help that you get here is not half-azzed. It's hard core. These guys are really good! So if you aren't as impatiently ignorant as I had proven that I could be regarding my own build, then I strongly suggest that you heed the advice of these guys. It might seem like overkill at the time.... but if something were to happen, and the state were to somehow come down of you because of it.... 'overkill' would be working against you at that point. And the thoughtful advice that you had rcvd here would then have been unnecessarily wasted. These guys look out for you.... and that's solid! Btw, when I first became a member here, it was my goal to acclimate myself into the NJ gun culture. But little did I know that when you enter here, there are guys here who are very eager to help you in ways that go beyond your own expectations. And for that I am truly grateful. And ok.... I'm still acclimating myself to the fact that they all seem to refer to their rifles as 'guns' (shudder). And that they take a peculiar pride in keeping 'dirty' weapons (double-shudder). But if that's the culture here, then it's on me to acclimate. I'm just glad to have gotten the opportunity to get to know these guys. And that part has been very easy to acclimated myself to! Bottom-line: Unless you know that you know more than these guys; listen.... and learn.

And btw, when I say that I just did this exact same thing, I mean this upper: https://www.bravocompanyusa.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=BCM-URG-M4-16 And instead of the M1 brake I got the M2. And I'm in Bergen County. And I'm a newbie here building my first rifle. And in case you haven't already noticed.... this place is a gold-mine of helpful, knowledgeable, and good guys!

I just did this exact same thing with a BCM upper. Just bring the upper only. I took it to Ottomanelli's in Woodland Park http://osarms.com/

I'd still do her ; ) Btw NJdiverTony, what grip is that? My zoom can't quite make it out. SCRATCH THAT. NOT IN STOCK.

Hmmm.... that's a little bit of a news flash for me. Seeing as I've never had a rifle that was a virgin when I got her, I guess I really never considered that there was a breaking in period that included early malfunctions. But I guess that makes sense; everything needs to get all heated up together, form a bit of a fit with each other. Sure, makes sense. So.... first time (or two) out, just focus on spitting out rounds for a while? Yeesh... I have no idea why it didn't occur to me that this rifle will have never even been test-fired before. Brain malfunction.