January 31, 201115 yr This legal talk is hurting my head. I'm gonna carry in PA (or wherever else has repricity with AZ) when I get there.
January 31, 201115 yr Why do you keep bring up that you are satisfying NJ law "(in the trunk unloaded etc..)"? You are breaking NJ law. We already went over this before and you said that's not what you meant the first time. "(in the trunk unloaded etc..)" does not satisfy NJ law for possession of a handgun. You have no reason to satisfy NJ law if you are relying on FOPA and you are not satisfying NJ law anyway. Please stop saying that. You are breaking NJ law, and relying on FOPA. You are confusing people who may read this in the future. They need to make an informed decision on this, whichever decision they come to. In NJ.. when you transport a handgun.. it has to be unloaded.. and not readily accessible.. that can mean in a case in the trunk.. or locked in a case of a vehicle that does not have a trunk.. which mutually satisfies FOPA.... by your logic one could not bring a handgun to a competition in PA and spend the night.. because NJ law says directly to and from the range.. to take it a step further.. you could not attend ANY shoot that is outside NJ UNLESS you were going directly there and back... NJ has every right in the world to tell you where in NJ you can and can not bring a handgun.. but their jurisdiction ends at the door.. they can not stop me from driving to my friends house with my gun in Florida and staying the week while attending a competition.. they lack the jurisdiction to do that.. NJ law.. NO exceptions.. directly to and from the range.. using your logic NOTHING else is acceptable.. and the difference between my post and yours.. is I make an effort to support the information I have provided.. where as you blindly say "people smarter than you and I disagree.." that is not exactly the most solid argument in the world.. one thing I am not afraid to be is wrong.. if I were wrong in this instance I would be the first to admit it.. but in a clear reading of the law.. there is nothing more to go on than to take it at face value..
January 31, 201115 yr and the difference between my post and yours.. is I make an effort to support the information I have provided.. where as you blindly say "people smarter than you and I disagree.." that is not exactly the most solid argument in the world.. I can't argue with that one bit. You win the argument 100%. Not even 99%, 100%. You win. How long have you been following this argument? I've been following it for almost 10 years. Does that make me right? No. It means it is a dead horse until there is some case law that is binding. It also means that after 10 years I'm not going to clutter this thread with a .45 vs. 9mm debate because this has been beaten to death. I'm not going to come up with some sort of gem that solves the whole thing and I'm not going off topic in this thread or any thread to rehash 10 years of this BS. You've educated yourself, that's the best anybody can do.
January 31, 201115 yr In NJ.. when you transport a handgun.. it has to be unloaded.. and not readily accessible.. that can mean in a case in the trunk.. or locked in a case of a vehicle that does not have a trunk.. which mutually satisfies FOPA.... It does not mutually satisfy FOPA and NJ. It does not satisfy NJ law, you are breaking NJ law, it has nothing to do with NJ law, it's FOPA only. And, as previously mentioned, you said before you made a mistake by posting the exact same thing. Please just don't say "in accordance with NJ law." I think that will confuse people into thinking that they are in some kind of compliance with NJ law while doing this. That's the only reason I'm making a point of it.
February 1, 201115 yr fair enough.... but one last thing.. maybe the following statement says a lot in itself... in 10 years.. there has not been some test case.. where the merit of the law was challenged in the way we are discussing.. maybe the reason there has been no case.. is because there is simply no case to be had.. I've been following it for almost 10 years.............. until there is some case law that is binding.
February 1, 201115 yr fair enough.... but one last thing.. maybe the following statement says a lot in itself... in 10 years.. there has not been some test case.. where the merit of the law was challenged in the way we are discussing.. That is a very good point. I only disagree with maybe the reason there has been no case.. is because there is simply no case to be had.. There have been a number of high-profile FOPA cases that were clear-cut legal situations and still landed people in jail and went to trial before being acquitted. A questionable interpretation seems perilous when clear-cut interstate travel puts you in jail for at least a while. So I look at the blessing of lack of binding (upper court) case law from the other perspective - It seems like it doesn't come up much. Which probably means the chances of having to go to court over it are small, whether we are right or wrong.
February 1, 201115 yr Got my Arizona permit! Took exactly 2 weeks. Big shout out to Ed (mipafox) for cluing me in on the ease of obtaining said permit.
February 1, 201115 yr Author In NJ.. when you transport a handgun.. it has to be unloaded.. and not readily accessible.. that can mean in a case in the trunk.. or locked in a case of a vehicle that does not have a trunk.. which mutually satisfies FOPA.... by your logic one could not bring a handgun to a competition in PA and spend the night.. because NJ law says directly to and from the range.. to take it a step further.. you could not attend ANY shoot that is outside NJ UNLESS you were going directly there and back... NJ has every right in the world to tell you where in NJ you can and can not bring a handgun.. but their jurisdiction ends at the door.. they can not stop me from driving to my friends house with my gun in Florida and staying the week while attending a competition.. they lack the jurisdiction to do that.. NJ law.. NO exceptions.. directly to and from the range.. using your logic NOTHING else is acceptable.. and the difference between my post and yours.. is I make an effort to support the information I have provided.. where as you blindly say "people smarter than you and I disagree.." that is not exactly the most solid argument in the world.. one thing I am not afraid to be is wrong.. if I were wrong in this instance I would be the first to admit it.. but in a clear reading of the law.. there is nothing more to go on than to take it at face value.. This thread just emphasizes how bad things are in NJ. Even when you *TRY* to use your best judgement - you are still on shaky ground. If you get the wrong prosecutor and/or the wrong judge, you could wind up behind bars *EVEN* if you did NOT break any laws. The NJ2AS has been working with a number of legislators to create legislation that would insure that a law-abiding individual, with no criminal record, who is not in the process of committing a crime, with no evidence of intention to commit a crime, can always legally transport his firearms unloaded and locked away.
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