http://forum.pafoa.org/concealed-open-carry-121/140698-fopa-transport-protection-states-origin-destination-unlikely-report.html

 

If I lived in NJ, I'd probably agree with you guys. Out of desperation. Desperation can twist your mindset.

Seemingly well researched, although I find it hard to believe that the intent of FOPA was to exclude the origin and destination states. But, giving this credence, just remember, should you get stopped during the NJ leg of your journey to freedom, simply state that you are traveling under one of the NJ exemptions - Going to the range / Going to an FFL etc. Once you are in PA (with a recipocal permit), you're golden.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

If you want just have a range in another state that you are going to, after you get out of NJ you can decide to go where ever you want because now matter what NJ transportation laws and restriction end when you cross the state line.

 

You can leave the state of NJ with your firearms and not worry.

 

Harry

please show me the distinction in NJ law that says it is ok to go to your families house for a week or so and do some target shooting.. VS going to PA a state that recognizes your legal right to carry while bringing your firearm....

Seemingly well researched, although I find it hard to believe that the intent of FOPA was to exclude the origin and destination states...

 

Whoah, really? I've heard people (only from NJ) argue over what the statute actually means, but you are the first person I've ever heard say it was actually intended to allow you to do something illegal while leaving your state of origin. I wouldn't take what I am about to say too seriously, since I don't have any citation, but I've read over the years that it was specifically intended and modified to not be a blanket variance in state of origin or destination.

...but you are the first person I've ever heard say it was actually intended to allow you to do something illegal while leaving your state of origin.

 

 

Where did I say that? The usual belief of those in NJ is that FOPA protected us within the borders of NJ when traveling out of state. Legal @ point of origin - residence / Legal @ destination - free state. Actually, I have also stated what I believe Vlad is trying to say - how can the state restrain you from leaving the state with your gun? If that were the case, we'd all be land-locked.

 

Adios,

 

Bob

Whoah, really? I've heard people (only from NJ) argue over what the statute actually means, but you are the first person I've ever heard say it was actually intended to allow you to do something illegal while leaving your state of origin. I wouldn't take what I am about to say too seriously, since I don't have any citation, but I've read over the years that it was specifically intended and modified to not be a blanket variance in state of origin or destination.

 

 

the purpose is specifically outlined.. the purpose is to not subject law abiding gun owners from being prosecuted while traveling through states with strict gun laws..

 

something like..

 

One of the law's provisions was that persons traveling from one place to another cannot be incarcerated for a firearms offense in a state that has strict gun control laws if the traveler is just passing through (short stops for food and gas) and the firearms and ammunition are not immediately accessible, unloaded and, in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment, in a locked container

 

even if my home state is NJ.. my end state is still PA (which recognizes my license to carry a firearm..)

so I am passing through NJ (in that I am driving through the state to get to my destination)..

so I maintain that while I am passing through NJ with my inaccessible firearm and ammunition.. proceeding to a state in which I am carry a recognized license.. providing I do not make any lengthy unnecessary stops.. I am within the law..

Where did I say that? The usual belief of those in NJ is that FOPA protected us within the borders of NJ when traveling out of state. Legal @ point of origin - residence / Legal @ destination - free state. Actually, I have also stated what I believe Vlad is trying to say - how can the state restrain you from leaving the state with your gun? If that were the case, we'd all be land-locked.

 

Adios,

 

Bob

 

 

right.. 2 day competition in PA? forget it.. target shooting on a friends property in upstate NY.. nope.. ONLY DIRECTLY TO AND FROM.. but again.. it does not address the obvious.. leaving the state.. because well.. there is no reason to..

Where did I say that? The usual belief of those in NJ is that FOPA protected us within the borders of NJ when traveling out of state. Legal @ point of origin - residence / Legal @ destination - free state. Actually, I have also stated what I believe Vlad is trying to say - how can the state restrain you from leaving the state with your gun? If that were the case, we'd all be land-locked.

 

Adios,

 

Bob

 

How can they outlaw anybody carrying a handgun while almost all the rest of the country does, it's protected by The Constitution, and was recently incorporated against the States by the Supreme Court?

 

Simple. They passed a law against all those things in your state.

 

Yes, you're land-locked.

 

vladtepes - You were right with the dead horse. Beyond that, don't think you are going to explain this statute to me, not necessary. You're wrong. I was good with the dead horse. I thought this would be interesting and possibly useful, possibly save somebody's a**, and I don't plan on beating the dead horse.

 

Probably should not have brought this up. But I worry about you guys. And, back to the OP, and even the last post by Pizza Bob, I think your vision is twisted out of desperation. Nobody outside of NJ believes what you guys do regarding this statute.

This again? Now my brain really hurts!

do you agree that there is no legal difference between "bringing your gun with you to your friends farm" and "bringing your gun to PA for lawful carry"?

I guess we wouldn't be covered driving to Newark to fly out either then?

I'm transporting for purpoaes of appraisal/gunsmithing/ hunting/ etc at said destination in pa/ Alaska/ your moms house/ wherever you may be leaving nj to go

Ok, so my Polack brain runs slow. If I leave from my house to go to PA with a handgun and get pulled over in NJ, and the cop searches car, sees I have a handgun I will be doing something illegal? And for intents and purposes lets say the handgun was in the trunk, locked in the case and ammo was seperate. I didn't think it would, but I dunno. Can someone try and put this in stupid people terms?

Ok, so my Polack brain runs slow. If I leave from my house to go to PA with a handgun and get pulled over in NJ, and the cop searches car, sees I have a handgun I will be doing something illegal? And for intents and purposes lets say the handgun was in the trunk, locked in the case and ammo was seperate. I didn't think it would, but I dunno. Can someone try and put this in stupid people terms?

 

Make it real easy, Just say your on your way to a range, after you get to the state line you can change your mind.

 

Harry

Make it real easy, Just say your on your way to a range, after you get to the state line you can change your mind.

 

Harry

 

Got it. Thank you.

The range excuse sounds good. But can you use it at 10 pm comming home from PA like I just did. I guess you should also have the name of a PA range handy. Also lets say I'm on my way to PA real late like 12-3am .will that pass the smell test.I think if I told a cop I was on the way to a range at 1 am he would lock me up for being a wise guy.

Well to be honest I haven't even been to PA in years, so if I do it will beduring the day. But if I did get stopped then I'm going to/from the Firing Line, and that's all they need to know.

The range excuse sounds good. But can you use it at 10 pm comming home from PA like I just did. I guess you should also have the name of a PA range handy. Also lets say I'm on my way to PA real late like 12-3am .will that pass the smell test.I think if I told a cop I was on the way to a range at 1 am he would lock me up for being a wise guy.

 

Who cares what time it is, you were at the range, went out to dinner did some other things and didn't get back into NJ until late, who cares, you were out of NJ and there are not the restriction we have so who's to say anything. Now if your leaving the state at that time, who cares again, just say you going to a range in another state or what ever.

 

It's really sad that we have even think about this let alone have a thread this long about it. Again might I add.

Well to be honest I haven't even been to PA in years, so if I do it will beduring the day. But if I did get stopped then I'm going to/from the Firing Line, and that's all they need to know.

 

Better make sure you really were where you said you were. Lying to the police will not be a good thing at 1am. Saying you're headed to/from a range is not some sort of free pass to transport a handgun in your trunk whenever you want. If the cop doesn't believe you and arrests you and then the Firing Line cannot corroborate your story... You're going to be in trouble.

There are no provisions in NJ's exemptions that I can find that would allow for legally transporting a HG from your NJ home to another state for the purpose of carry (self defense). This is especially frustrating if FOPA only kicks in when you perform the act of crossing the first state boundary at the start of your trip from the legal origin location. Take it hunting, to the range, place of repair, or moving when traveling out of the PRNJ. I suppose if you owned land in the destination state, you could be traveling from one dwelling/residence to another.

That whole thread is a search for the boogeyman. Although it wouldn't surprise me if a prosecutor in NJ attempted such a thing, it would clearly be a folly.

 

I find it annoying when, in the absence of case law, someone tries to announce their own "ruling," and the wrong ruling at that.

 

I prefer to stick with the facts, not conjecture and speculation.

 

In addition, it is harmful to perpetuate this myth. We would all be better off if every thread mentioning it were deleted.

The better question is:

 

Why does the officer know you have firearms with you?

The better question is:

 

Why does the officer know you have firearms with you?

 

Ok, so hypothetically...

 

Let's say I'm on my way home from Philly. I'm driving south on Route 55. Get pulled over for whatever reason. Now let's say it's 11 at night. State Trooper runs my info and then he asks if he can search my car. Now as far as I know this will play out one of a few ways. I give permission, he searches, finds handgun, or I tell him its there and give permission to search. Or I decline. Now I don't know what would happen if I decline. Would they just automatically impound my car and get a warrant? I'm fairly new to this whole thing and the laws are nuts. It's alot to take in. So what is the best course of action in a situation like this? I've been pulled over a few times but never had an officer ask to search my car. Even taking the guns out of the equation I wouldn't know what the right/best thing to do would be. To me it seems like a double edged sword, if you give permission to search or deny permission.

Ok, so hypothetically...

 

Let's say I'm on my way home from Philly. I'm driving south on Route 55. Get pulled over for whatever reason. Now let's say it's 11 at night. State Trooper runs my info and then he asks if he can search my car. Now as far as I know this will play out one of a few ways. I give permission, he searches, finds handgun, or I tell him its there and give permission to search. Or I decline. Now I don't know what would happen if I decline. Would they just automatically impound my car and get a warrant? I'm fairly new to this whole thing and the laws are nuts. It's alot to take in. So what is the best course of action in a situation like this? I've been pulled over a few times but never had an officer ask to search my car. Even taking the guns out of the equation I wouldn't know what the right/best thing to do would be. To me it seems like a double edged sword, if you give permission to search or deny permission.

 

You said it yourself. You've never been asked for your car to be searched. Unless you are doing something to cause the officer to feel like he needs to search your car, you probably won't be asked. If you are asked, yes, you decline.

 

Of course I can come up with about a million hypothetical situations that lead to a police officer discovering I have firearms and arresting me wrongly (or rightfully). But there is a reason they are hypothetical scenarios which is why aren't seeing tons of people being arrested because they left NJ to go elsewhere with there firearms.

Ok, so hypothetically...

 

Let's say I'm on my way home from Philly. I'm driving south on Route 55. Get pulled over for whatever reason. Now let's say it's 11 at night. State Trooper runs my info and then he asks if he can search my car. Now as far as I know this will play out one of a few ways. I give permission, he searches, finds handgun, or I tell him its there and give permission to search. Or I decline. Now I don't know what would happen if I decline. Would they just automatically impound my car and get a warrant? I'm fairly new to this whole thing and the laws are nuts. It's alot to take in. So what is the best course of action in a situation like this? I've been pulled over a few times but never had an officer ask to search my car. Even taking the guns out of the equation I wouldn't know what the right/best thing to do would be. To me it seems like a double edged sword, if you give permission to search or deny permission.

 

 

If the officer has enough R.A.S. to conduct a search, he won't be asking you. If he does ask, he obviously does not have enough R.A.S. to search without permission, or to get a warrant to search. Not to mention that in a severe majority of cases concerning traffic stops, you won't be asked to search. You are also under no obligation to divulge where you were coming from/going to. Again, if he has suspicion that something is a amiss, he won't ask, he'll just put you in his car and search. When I get stopped, it's "why did you stop me officer?", followed by handing over my credentials through a window only partially opened. Cordial, polite, even friendly, but in no way whatsoever will I consent to a search, of anything, for any reason. If you consent, you have forfeited your fourth amendment rights, and will never get them back. If they search anyway, and even if they find something that is genuinely illegal, without consent, and without enough R.A.S. to convince a grand jury that the search was just, the search gets thrown out. You have nothing to lose by refusing to consent to a search, and everything to lose by doing so.

You have nothing to lose by refusing to consent to a search, and everything to lose by doing so.

 

This, PERIOD. Keep your mouth shut too.

Thanks for clearing things up for me, guys.

My wife finds it funny that everytime we go to/from a range I actually drive the exact speed limit..........