Just something i was thinking about id appreciate everyones feelings on this, a good hollow point is designed to give you the best out of your shot. When it comes to .45 maybe you dont need the hollow point just that huge bullets hitting the guy will knock him down and over penetration is not such a worry because its a big slow moving bullet, maybe FMJ is even better than hollow point because your getting maximum penetration out of it

I'd still go HP.

why handicap yourself? HP is best. Will limit penetration (A FMJ will go through ALOT) plus will do alot more damage and will more quickly and effectivly stop a threat

I'd go with what Nick said, I'd chose HP or Hornady CD rounds for protection.

 

Harry

huge bullets hitting the guy will knock him down

 

The difference in bullet diameter between a 9mm and .45 acp is .102. Just over 1 tenth of an inch. Not exactly what I consider huge.

 

Bullets typically don't knock people down. People may get a hit to the central nervous system and fall down, but knock down? No.

 

When you shoot a .45 acp, are you knocked down? That same force is roughly what hits the bad guy.

I'd definitely go HP. I don't see a reason why you wouldn't...

hollow point for the win. Why would you want to possibly over penetrate.

a 45 is NOT the be all and end all in stopping power, no matter what the gun rags say. its not a magic bullet, it wont compensate for bullet design, it wont do anything special. a shot to the chest with a 32 hollow point is better then a hit to the foot with a 45 ball.

I think the spent energy in the expansion of the HP for a .45 that's a slower bullet to begin with could potentially kill your penetration needed to stop a bad guy. More flesh damage but the bullet might not reach the kill areas that's just my thought.

I think the spent energy in the expansion of the HP for a .45 that's a slower bullet to begin with could potentially kill your penetration needed to stop a bad guy. More flesh damage but the bullet might not reach the kill areas that's just my thought.

 

You need to look at ballistics gel tests then...

Blah, Blah Blah!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Just make sure whatever you shoot feeds reliably. Classic 1911 design was made to feed ball ammo.

 

 

Blah, Blah Blah !!!!!!!!!!!

I think the spent energy in the expansion of the HP for a .45 that's a slower bullet to begin with could potentially kill your penetration needed to stop a bad guy. More flesh damage but the bullet might not reach the kill areas that's just my thought.

 

 

Speed doesnt have everything to do with it. .45 bullets are heavy, and weight means momentum. I have never ever heard of .45 being a light penetrator with HPs, and you can bet if there was ANY doubt you would hear the argument all over the internet. Like Nick said, ballistic gel doesnt lie, .45 HPs are more effective and still penetrate alot.

Blah, Blah Blah!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

Just make sure whatever you shoot feeds reliably. Classic 1911 design was made to feed ball ammo.

 

 

Blah, Blah Blah !!!!!!!!!!!

 

I agree.

But also add regardless of the caliber you are shooting, hit what you are aiming at.

Don't mean squat if you big bucks "HD" ammo misses the intended target.

I agree.

But also add regardless of the caliber you are shooting, hit what you are aiming at.

Don't mean squat if you big bucks "HD" ammo misses the intended target.

 

Who are you? Where do you live? You are talking sense.... Careful there lad. We could ban you from the forum for that...

I used to be part of the AmmoLab. The founder, David DeFabio, was shot after he had shot his assailents. This prompted him to form the Ammolab for in depth analysis. We reviewed a metric ton of actual shootings and then measured what those bullets actually did in geletin etc etc. The best actual street performers penetrated around 12 to 14" of geletin and all the usual measurments of crush cavity, stretch etc etc(I dont recall these #'s). Any new ammo that had roughly the same math as proven performers generally could expect to have similer results in the real world. There were always exeptions of course. The study done by NYPD has convinced me that there are other circumstances to consider beyond just stopping power. The danger of ball ammo to innocents from "pass though" shots is a strong consideration. So for me, I want HP ammo that penetrates 12 to 14 inches in moderately covered test media. There are those that feel ball offers enough feeding reliability advantage to outweigh the stopping benefits. I think thats a worthy consideration so it is important to shoot enough of your HP def ammo to know for sure it reliable in your defensive arm.

 

Shane

Who are you? Where do you live? You are talking sense.... Careful there lad. We could ban you from the forum for that...

 

just a semi sharp tool in a shed.

Careful there lad. We could ban you from the forum for that...

 

I think something like that has happen to Ronny before...

I used to be part of the AmmoLab. The founder, David DeFabio, was shot after he had shot his assailents. This prompted him to form the Ammolab for in depth analysis. We reviewed a metric ton of actual shootings and then measured what those bullets actually did in geletin etc etc. The best actual street performers penetrated around 12 to 14" of geletin and all the usual measurments of crush cavity, stretch etc etc(I dont recall these #'s). Any new ammo that had roughly the same math as proven performers generally could expect to have similer results in the real world. There were always exeptions of course. The study done by NYPD has convinced me that there are other circumstances to consider beyond just stopping power. The danger of ball ammo to innocents from "pass though" shots is a strong consideration. So for me, I want HP ammo that penetrates 12 to 14 inches in moderately covered test media. There are those that feel ball offers enough feeding reliability advantage to outweigh the stopping benefits. I think thats a worthy consideration so it is important to shoot enough of your HP def ammo to know for sure it reliable in your defensive arm.

 

Shane

 

 

Another guy making sense...This could get contagious!

 

Now that's two guys that don't shoot there pistols sideways, in one day no less...

 

Thanks Shane!

Don't believe the hype...A .45 caliber round isn't bowling anyone over. Handguns basically suck when it comes to stopping power. They are just much more convenient to carry then rifles. Anything you can do to improve the terminal ballistics of a handgun is a good thing...

This from a guy who's carried one pistol or another daily for the last eighteen years, and a .45 ACP every day for the past few...

You need to look at ballistics gel tests then...

A HP round in general will not go as deep as a FMJ that is my main point. A round such as the .45 that's pretty big to begin with I feel your end result will be similar hp or fmj, the extra money spent is not necessary.

Another guy making sense...This could get contagious!

 

Now that's two guys that don't shoot there pistols sideways, in one day no less...

 

Thanks Shane!

 

Sadly I have and advocate the shooting of one's pistol sideways when under the right conditions.

It actually works when done "correctly".

A HP round in general will not go as deep as a FMJ that is my main point. A round such as the .45 that's pretty big to begin with I feel your end result will be similar hp or fmj, the extra money spent is not necessary.

 

How much extra money are you talking about? It seems trivial.

Anthony, let me make my position perfectly clear, in my humble opinion shot placement is number one. But if there is one thing I learned, that is that there are ALWAYS exceptions. So we need to look at more of a cross section of results to have a clearer picture. From a numbers stand point, even in 45ACP there was a pretty big disparity between the effectiveness of FMJ and quality HP ammo. Its been a long time since I really tracked this stuff but the performance of modern ammo is worth the expensee in my opinion. If my life depends on it, I want every advantage I can get, luck favors the prepared. I wish the Ammolab was still around, there was a lot of good info there.

Stick with Hornady Critical Defense...

This is how I feel... If it's for shooting in defense, HP all the way. If it's for practice, regular ball FMJ is all you need.

 

I don't know about Hornady C.D. ammo though. There are far better, more proven products to buy.

 

I don't know about Hornady C.D. ammo though. There are far better, more proven products to buy.

 

Care to elaborate???

 

Harry

Harry:

 

When it comes to products of similar design, one would have to assume that he is speaking about Federal EFMJ's and/or Corbon PowrBall ammo. While I might agree with the "more proven" - simply on a chronological basis, I'd be curious with what he can back-up the "far better".

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

Accept no substitute!

 

In the grand scheme of things (defensive ammo) Hornady CD isn't ****. Who uses it besides civilians? No one. As for "far better" defensive loads... I would say there are none better and more proven then Win Ranger T Series or Fed HST's. Hornady CD can't even come close to either of those loadings and really, aren't even in the same arena.

a 9mm or .38 hp might expand at times under ideal conditions , imho a .45 does not have to ! - most solid nose lead bullets of correct hardness gives you the best of both penetration + expansion -