Just as a general comment here, I personally will not offer to buy or sell something if I am not immediately ready to take the steps to make the transaction occur.

 

Don't post something for sale then go on vacation.

Don't "I'll take it" if you don't have the money and won't for a month or will otherwise be unavailable to complete the transaction.

Don't put in a placeholder "I'll take it" then shop around and see if you can save a few bucks. Make all those decisions before you start the process. If you miss out because of the vetting process, so it goes, your integrity is more important.

 

Finally, most people who want something and agree to buy it, want it right away. Nothing worse than ordering something and having it take 4-6 weeks for delivery and the same applies here. By pushing the transaction as fast as possible, everyone is happy and fewer people will have the will or opportunity to back out of either side of a transaction.

I personally think the "I'll take it" is unnecessary BS, no offense meant for the site or staff. That is directed at members who will go out of order to get the best deal. There's no reason to go out of line. The person that is first in line is first. Yea if they're pulling my let, shopping around, or trying to haggle immensely....I'll kick them out of line. But if they say something like "I won't be free because of work for 3-4 days." then whatever, it's theirs.

About the OP's situation, does he have legitimate gripe? Sort of. It sounds like they had already made arrangements. But at the same time, as Maks said, you can't force people to sell to anybody in particular, or just because he saw it first. Sure that would be nice, but it doesn't always work out. What if they are trying to unload something ASAP. If Joey can make it happen the quickest, even if he is the 10th person to inquire, it is his. Maybe it is simply easier to sell the buyer 7 than buyer 1 because of logistics, work schedules, time constraints, etc. If I'm selling something and Billy from next door offers to buy it but Bobby from 2 hours away wanted it first, well sorry Bobby. It is easier for me to walk next door then arrange a meet, or ship something (which cost money), or whatnot.

 

Why do people sell things on this forum? Because the people here have a similar interest in things and most people are pretty local. Or in other words, it is convenient. Unfortunately for the buyers, the convenience is almost always in favor of the seller. That is just how it is. This isn't ebay or another site like that. So as a buyer, you just have to take it for what it's worth.

 

That is just my 2 cents.

Just as a general comment here, I personally will not offer to buy or sell something if I am not immediately ready to take the steps to make the transaction occur.

 

Don't post something for sale then go on vacation.

Don't "I'll take it" if you don't have the money and won't for a month or will otherwise be unavailable to complete the transaction.

Don't put in a placeholder "I'll take it" then shop around and see if you can save a few bucks. Make all those decisions before you start the process. If you miss out because of the vetting process, so it goes, your integrity is more important.

 

Finally, most people who want something and agree to buy it, want it right away. Nothing worse than ordering something and having it take 4-6 weeks for delivery and the same applies here. By pushing the transaction as fast as possible, everyone is happy and fewer people will have the will or opportunity to back out of either side of a transaction.

 

If this was on facebook, I would add a "likes" here. Well said!

I personally think the "I'll take it" is unnecessary BS,

 

Not sure, I don't think it's BS, I do think that posting it in the forum and then sending a separate PM to the seller might be a better practice and one I do, I think it not only puts a time stamp in the thread so other members who may be interested know that someone is interested in the item for sale, and the PM is best for the seller and buyer to communicate the details of the sale. Also give members the ability to post I'll be 2nd 3rd etc so if the SPF falls through there is an order of who may be next.

 

Not that any of this needs to be written in stone or anything but think it may cause the least amount of confusion. Also that provides the most transparency for all here so no one can feel like they were passed up for a person who is a friend or more popular.

 

Harry

The only thing I have seen I'll take it or dibs do on most forums is establish who got in line when. I agree the OP got hosed. The OP didn't contact them in a timely manner, but the seller wasn't exactly on the ball with communication either. You want to be a hard a**, it cuts both ways. Same if you expect to be cut some slack. IMO OP should leave negative feedback, and admins should let it stand.

 

About the only thing we might need long term is a guideline on how much negative feedback you can get without being locked out of the for sale sub-forum.

I am an unfortunate product of a million and one people committing to buying things on craigslist and never showing up.. so my opinion is somewhat different.. I will agree to disagree since I understand the moral obligation to following through with your deal.. but I just don't get bent when things are sold out from under me.... I subscribe to two different thought processes..

 

1) if it is a known member.. someone you feel comfortable with.. and you make a deal with them.. then yes.. it is messed up to sell it to someone else..

 

2) if it is someone you have absolutely no idea about.. then honestly.. first come first serve..

 

I don't think there is necessarily anything really wrong with having a "first come first serve" policy... maybe if that was disclosed in the sale it would not offend people so much? "so and so for sale.. first person to come get it gets it.." that is how I typically and forced to sell things on craigslist.. or I end up with endless amounts of "promised meetings" that never happen.. and that does get kind of frustrating..

 

2 cents

1. Rules are only here for the special doucehbags who can't follow common sense, courtesey and ethical values of how to treat people. For them, we have "rules".

 

 

+1

 

I would agree with that completely.. not even JUST The classifieds.. it took me a minute or two to get situated, but all in all the staff is very hands off.. allows the site to move at its own pace.. and really only seem to step in when something that legitimately needs to be addressed has occurred..

Tim,

 

what the point of calling somebody out. It changes nothing.

 

Maks,

I missed one deal really. I understand what your saying, I just don't agree. It's your forum so hey... I also agree that they can sign back up after banning them.

 

I personally like I'll take it because it's just the same as giving somebody your word. Your prepared to complete the deal barring a catostrphic mess. Pm'ing just add's to the confusion afterwards. I think the post followed by a PM is usually good.

 

To mae toe/ to mot toe.

To mae toe/ to mot toe.

 

Dude - On this I have to disagree wholeheartedly with you.

 

 

It's Toe-May-Toe / Toe-MAAH-Toe... not to be confused with "other" <cough> toes.

 

:thsmiley_deadhorse:

Cant we all just get along? Not trying to fan the flames here but I believe its tuh-May-toe/ tuh-Mah-toe.

I will agree that you both have spelled it out better than I. I stand corrected.

Cant we all just get along? Not trying to fan the flames here but I believe its tuh-May-toe/ tuh-Mah-toe.

 

Depends on whether you are talking about hothouse tomatoes or Jersey tomatoes...

When I was new to this site I saw that Tim had a Remmington 1100 for sale. I told him I would take it plus PM'd him. I explained that I did not have an FID at the time and was expecting it shortly. Well, I had NO idea how long of a wait that was going to take. I did stay in contact with him, offered to give him a deposit or pay for it in full, until my FID arrived. I think it took 3 or 4 weeks from the time I told him I would buy it until the day I was finally able to go get it from him. He could have sold it to someone else. He didn't know me from Jack.......... He trusted me and my word, and I am glad he did! I have used that gun a LOT since I bought it from him. Sometimes things don't work-out as planned, but there are worse things in life to worry about.

Tim,

 

what the point of calling somebody out. It changes nothing.

 

Because sometimes it makes you feel better to act childish and call some one a name. Granted, most of the time I just yell it at my computer screen while I read.

When I was new to this site I saw that Tim had a Remmington 1100 for sale. I told him I would take it plus PM'd him. I explained that I did not have an FID at the time and was expecting it shortly. Well, I had NO idea how long of a wait that was going to take. I did stay in contact with him, offered to give him a deposit or pay for it in full, until my FID arrived. I think it took 3 or 4 weeks from the time I told him I would buy it until the day I was finally able to go get it from him. He could have sold it to someone else. He didn't know me from Jack.......... He trusted me and my word, and I am glad he did! I have used that gun a LOT since I bought it from him. Sometimes things don't work-out as planned, but there are worse things in life to worry about.

This is a perfect exapmle of how things are supposed to work. Mike is a man of his word and made every attempt possible to kep me in the loop. Most of us on here are like that.

Every once in a while a Magic Man or New 09 comes along, then they are gone real soon.

Because sometimes it makes you feel better to act childish and call some one a name. Granted, most of the time I just yell it at my computer screen while I read.

 

So I'm coming home from the State fair tonight and there's construction on 94. There is about 1/2 mile between the signal men...but they're letting car after car after car come from the other direction for about 15 minutes. When we finally moved, I had to roll down the passenger window and yell "A@@hole!!". It certainly made me feel better.

"A@@hole!!". It certainly made me feel better.

 

ROFLMAO!

All - Thanks for all the inputs. I talked to the seller again and he made good on the original deal. I did not realize this post would expode the way it did. Thanks again.

All - Thanks for all the inputs. I talked to the seller again and he made good on the original deal. I did not realize this post would expode the way it did. Thanks again.

Glad we could help you get your widgets.

All - Thanks for all the inputs. I talked to the seller again and he made good on the original deal. I did not realize this post would expode the way it did. Thanks again.

 

Wait - how did he make good on a deal that was already sold to someone else?

Hello all, I have a few suggestions. I belong to a HUGE forum with a marketplace and their system is pretty darned good. I see in our marketplace the users feedback is in one thread. Some improvements I think can be implemented are:

 

Place marketplace feedback scores right under "Home Range" category on your username. Make this item clickable and have it go to the users entire marketplace history, specifically, feedback. Make a "make offer" option and have the rules say, once offer is made, the transaction is binding. This way if the user flakes, EVERYONE will know about it by looking at his or her feedback. It will also allow a person to see a users good feedback. When transaction is complete, give both users a place to enter comments about their experience with each other that will be permanent. HOwever, do give a user who feels he has received unwarranted feedback a chance to rebut the negative feedback. This person would have to prove he held up his end of the bargain.

 

A typical feedback comment I see on the other marketplace I visit is, "User was serious about getting his items. Great communication and super fast payment. Hope to do business again with user!" And the bad feedback usually looks like, "Sellers beware! This guy's a flake! Don't waste your time! User kept sending me pm's saying yada yada yada and each time he never held up his end of the bargain" Or, "Buyers beware! I sent my money and never received my item, i'm opening a case against him."

 

On the other forum, this is an invaluable stat (listed right under usernames) that I go by in determining if I want to do business with a user. Being that this is NJ and most of us live in NJ, I can see meetups would probably be the most common form of transaction. However, PayPal, USPS money orders with tracking, and hidden cash at one's own risk should be options too.

 

The benefits of the official "make offer" option is, it will cut down on all the "on a whim" and non-serious potential buyers. The seller will know the potential buyer is serious simply because they made an official offer. To put it bluntly, it cuts down on all the "private message" buyers who send a million pm's promising saying they are interested and never end up buying.

 

Another improvement could be to require the seller to provide at least one tagged picture of said item for sale. The tag proves it is his item and not some random pic from the net. The tag is simply a piece of paper with the users username and date on it in the photo of the item being sold. (ive seen some pretty elaborate tags in my day lol with some guys using their smartphones as tags lol).

 

Another improvement could be in the trades area. If a person wants to trade with another person with low or negative feedback, give the option of a willing and trusted ffl holding member to be the middleman. Have each party legally transfer the item (if a firearm) to the ffl member (for a small fee of course) and once the ffl has both items, he can send the items to the respective party. This way, if one of the users flakes, the middleman can send the item back to the sender without him being burnt by a thief. Ive seen this done with items not firearms related and it works like a charm every time.

 

Immediately ban any user that does anything fraudulent, no exceptions. On top of that, turn over IP information to the burned user so they can file a case against the bad user.

 

If any of the people in charge of designing our marketplace or creating the rules there want to know what marketplace I'm referring to so they can see it for themselves, just let me know and i'll pass you the link in a pm. That forum has over 200,000 members (its not ebay or a firearms related forum).

 

Place marketplace feedback scores right under "Home Range" category on your username. Make this item clickable and have it go to the users entire marketplace history, specifically, feedback. Make a "make offer" option and have the rules say, once offer is made, the transaction is binding. This way if the user flakes, EVERYONE will know about it by looking at his or her feedback. It will also allow a person to see a users good feedback. When transaction is complete, give both users a place to enter comments about their experience with each other that will be permanent. HOwever, do give a user who feels he has received unwarranted feedback a chance to rebut the negative feedback. This person would have to prove he held up his end of the bargain.

 

 

 

+1

These huge forums have a large number of administrators and moderators that are on top of things. I know on the forum my son is a global moderator on, there are like 10 global moderators, 80 subject moderators and a full staff of Admins. this is a hobby for Maks and i am betting the software he uses may not even be able to do all the things that are being suggesting? We are supposed to be a family here, we should be able to behave ourselves?

These huge forums have a large number of administrators and moderators that are on top of things. I know on the forum my son is a global moderator on, there are like 10 global moderators, 80 subject moderators and a full staff of Admins. this is a hobby for Maks and i am betting the software he uses may not even be able to do all the things that are being suggesting? We are supposed to be a family here, we should be able to behave ourselves?

 

This is true but you can't place blind trust in folks without running the risks of getting screwed. Plus we're dealing with firearms so the risk of running into legal issues is greater. Don't get me wrong, i'm not knocking the current marketplace, we are a MUCH smaller forum, just added some suggestions since the OP had issues with buying through PM's. Had an official offer been made and the seller accepted it, the item would have automatically been listed as sold and the seller not immediately able to list the item again without going through a fair feedback process.

I also agree that the "I'll take it" thing is nonsense. Until both parties agree on terms, the seller STILL OWNS THE ITEM, and IMO can sell it to whoever he pleases. Once both parties are in agreement, however, you should make good on the deal.

 

For example, I list a rifle for sale, and in 10 minutes two different members post "I'll take it". The first one to post lives in Cape May, and the second one lives in my town. You can bet your a** I'm going to deal with the local buyer rather than the guy who needs to drive 2 hours to meet me.

For example, I list a rifle for sale, and in 10 minutes two different members post "I'll take it". The first one to post lives in Cape May, and the second one lives in my town. You can bet your a** I'm going to deal with the local buyer rather than the guy who needs to drive 2 hours to meet me.

 

right... exactly..

 

or even simpler.. I post something and someone I have never spoken to before a day in my life says "ill take it at the end of the week".. but then YOU for example.. want to come up and get it tonight.. well sorry I am not going to be out waiting for someone who may or may not come through... when I have someone I trust to come and get it now.. but maybe the seller needs to be more clear with the buyer and that would solve all this.. just tell them.. ok fine... the end of the week? that is good.. but just so you know if someone comes and gets it sooner.. it is first come first serve... I have always worked like that.. in fact I bought a rifle from nick308.. and we went back and forth offer counter offer.. and I always told him.. hey if you get someone who shows up cash in hand.. you sell that thing...

I here you there Vladtepes. If we made a few changes, that's the benefit of an official offer vs a pm or thread reply. The seller does not have to accept any official offer. Lets say two people make an official offer, since were dealing with firearms, the seller could have 5 days (or any set amount of time) to accept the official offer of his choosing. After the 5 days, each person that has made an official offer would receive a message saying "no decision taken, offer expired." Or if in Vladtepes case, he chose to accept the guy he trusts offer over the other guy's offer, the other guy would get the no decision taken message and the local guy would get a "offer accepted" message. To put it simply, the seller can accept whichever offer he feels at any point within the allotted time.

 

I get what Vladtepes is saying but this way it really cuts down on the seller or buyer flaking. In defense of the hypothetical guy that lives two hours away, if he made an official offer, he would have to agree to Vladtepes terms on getting Vlad (I'm sure) the payment first by the agreed time before Vladtepes shipped the item. The 2 hour guy could ask Vlad if he can overnight him a USPS money order and if Vlad says yes, 2 hour guy has to stick to that. This way, Vlad is in no risk of being burned and it keeps sellers from flaking too.

 

That system is fair to both buyers and sellers.

right... exactly..

 

or even simpler.. I post something and someone I have never spoken to before a day in my life says "ill take it at the end of the week".. but then YOU for example.. want to come up and get it tonight.. well sorry I am not going to be out waiting for someone who may or may not come through... when I have someone I trust to come and get it now.. but maybe the seller needs to be more clear with the buyer and that would solve all this.. just tell them.. ok fine... the end of the week? that is good.. but just so you know if someone comes and gets it sooner.. it is first come first serve... I have always worked like that.. in fact I bought a rifle from nick308.. and we went back and forth offer counter offer.. and I always told him.. hey if you get someone who shows up cash in hand.. you sell that thing...

 

 

So you will commit to sell to a buyer that says he will be there in a week, but then you will sell it out from under him if someone shows up before then with money in hand?

 

 

 

Is this really this complicated???:thsmiley_deadhorse:

 

Harry