Hi all!

I am starting to get into learning more about caliber and what guns have what, etc. I started by reading the wiki on caliber

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caliber

 

There is a table in there that lists the caliber and their inch and metric values. I see a lot of folks on here talk about reloading 9mm. According to this table calibers equivalent to 9mm are .38, .380, .357, .35. Is this correct? Does that mean that the same ammo can be used in any of those caliber firearms? Thanks in advance for the info!

 

Eddie

No. Means the bullet itself is the same width, however not the same length and the shells are different sizes.

 

That.... Is.... AWESOME!!!! Thanks!!!

So is the top strictly long guns and the bottom handgun? So what would be the difference between let say .45GAP and .45ACP. Can any .45 utilize either?

9mm, 45, 38 refer to bullet diameter, you still have different cases.

 

9mm typically refers to 9mm luger aka 9x19, but there is also 9x17, 9x18 Makarov, 9x20, etc.

So is the top strictly long guns and the bottom handgun? So what would be the difference between let say .45GAP and .45ACP. Can any .45 utilize either?

 

NO!

 

Only use ammo that your gun is designed for.

The 45 GAP is a shorter round than the 45 ACP.

If you somehow got an ACP in a gun chambered for GAP at best the slide wold not close, at worst the gun was fired it would blow up in your face.

 

The size of the round really has little to do with how big the gun/rifle is. The 22lr is a small round that is used in rifles and handguns. There are many other combos where ammo can be used in a longgun or handgun.

no, there is a difference in the length of the shell casing

 

There are very few you can mix and i wouldnt recommend it. one example you can is 223 in a 556 upper but NOT 556 is a 223 upper. Read read read.

That.... Is.... AWESOME!!!! Thanks!!!

 

That is a really cool graphic and I never imagined there were so many calibers.

So is the top strictly long guns and the bottom handgun? So what would be the difference between let say .45GAP and .45ACP. Can any .45 utilize either?

 

 

There may be numerous cartridges that use bullets of the same diameter and weight, but they have different cases. In your example, the difference is case length. In a semi-auto you could not use a GAP in an ACP chambered gun because semi-autos headspace (look it up on wiki) on the case mouth. If case length were the only difference between these two cartridges, then a GAP could be fired in a revolver chambered for .45 ACP that uses moonclips (another wiki research project), since they now both headspace off the moonclip and chamber depth/OAL cartridge length is not a factor.

 

Probably confused more than helped. Try this: A .45/70 and a .460 Weatherby both can use the same 500 grain .458" diameter bullet, but the cases are vastly different precluding their use in anything not specifically chambered for that round.

 

Just give it time.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

This is all definitely helpful. Thanks again. I fully appreciate your patience and responses on my questions!

 

Eddie

It gets worse than that too. a 7.62x39mm's bullet is actually larger in diameter than a 7.62x51mm's bullet because the russians measure 7.62 from land to land while we measure it from groove to groove. So 7.62mm for them is .311" and for us its .308". So 7.62 ≠ 7.62 lol. Same with 9x18 mak, their 9mm bullet is .365" and our 9mm bullets are .355.

 

Even more confusion

Here is a .22 LR with a .223 cartridge. Technically both are the same 22 caliber.

That is a really cool graphic and I never imagined there were so many calibers.

 

And the goal is to own 1 gun for each caliber.

The "doubles and triples" are as follows:

 

.223 ok in a 5.56 gun - not the other way around

38 Special ok in a .357 magnum gun - again, not the other way around. Please note there's also 38 S&W which cannot be used in either.

SOME 22 caliber guns can handle 22 short, 22 long and 22 long rifle - they are usually marked as such.

There's something with 32 caliber and 327 Federal I think but I'll let someone else weigh in on that.

 

 

There are also several names for the same cartridge:

9mm = 9x19 = 9mm Luger

 

Makarov = 9mm Makarov = 9x18

 

9mm Largo = 9x23 = 9mm Bergmann Bayard = 9mm Bayard

 

.380 ACP = 9mm kurz = 9x17 = 9mm BrC (Browning Corto) = 9mm short

 

.32 ACP = 7.65x17 = 7.65mm Browning

7.62x51 ok in 308 win but not the other way around

The "doubles and triples" are as follows:

 

.223 ok in a 5.56 gun - not the other way around

38 Special ok in a .357 magnum gun - again, not the other way around. Please note there's also 38 S&W which cannot be used in either.

SOME 22 caliber guns can handle 22 short, 22 long and 22 long rifle - they are usually marked as such.

There's something with 32 caliber and 327 Federal I think but I'll let someone else weigh in on that.

 

 

There are also several names for the same cartridge:

9mm = 9x19 = 9mm Luger

 

Makarov = 9mm Makarov = 9x18

 

9mm Largo = 9x23 = 9mm Bergmann Bayard = 9mm Bayard

 

.380 ACP = 9mm kurz = 9x17 = 9mm BrC (Browning Corto) = 9mm short

 

.32 ACP = 7.65x17 = 7.65mm Browning

 

9mm = 9mm NATO = 9mm Para(bellum)

And the goal is to own 1 gun for each caliber.

 

LOL!!! That would be a hell of a collection!

There's something with 32 caliber and 327 Federal I think but I'll let someone else weigh in on that.

 

 

Guns chambered in .327 Federal Magnum can also shoot: .32 H&R Magnum / .32 S&W Long

Guns chambered in .44 Magnum can also shoot: .44 S&W Special / .44 Russian / .44 American

 

A revolver chambered in 10mm can also shoot .40 S&W (it's that moon clip thing again)

 

A lot to absorb. Just have fun. If you stick with it long enough, you'll get most of this simply by osmosis.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

And the .460 S&W magnum can fire .454 casull and .45 long colt.

 

.38 specials bullet is actually .357-.358 but is called .38 because originally it used a heeled bullet like .22lr, and the bullet was the same diameter of the case which was .38". Now it uses modern non heeled bullets so while its still called .38 the bullet isnt .38....

 

More trivia

And the goal is to own at least 1 gun for each caliber.

 

Fixed that for you

I'm going with what Pizza Bob said and I'll learn all through osmosis! I picked up a few mags and I really enjoy reading them but they throw around the numbers and talk about these guns and its hard to get a good visual on it all. For example when I read .45ACP for the first time I googled ACP and found out it means Automatic Colt Pistol. Now I thought a Colt was an actual handgun but there are a lot of guns that use that ammo. On the other side I read up on the history of the 1911 (BTW there is Nighthawk 1911 on the cover of Guns & Ammo that is flippin' sweet looking!). I learned that it was made by John Browning yet a bunch of other manufacturers make 1911's where in my head initially I thought only Browning would have made it. When I get involved in something I have to grab all the knowledge I can. I want to know everything which keeps me learning and interested. Hence all these rudimentary questions. Right now I am trying to get to the point to understand the different kind of guns, the basic differences between calibers, and more so why I would chose one caliber over another. I am not a hunter and never will be so this would be more for marksmanship and collecting for me. As a hunter you need certain guns for the stopping power. As a collector/marksman what drives you to different calibers firearms?

 

Eddie

Eddie, there is enough learning for a lifetime when it comes to firearms. I've been at it over 50 years and still learn new stuff everyday.

 

Cartridges are usually named for the inventor - or, as in the case of the 1911, for the gun manufacturer. Yes John Moses Browning invented the 1911, but Colt owned the patent. .460 S&W and its patner the .500 S&W were invented by S&W and initially guns chambered in those calibers were only available from S&W. Often times a gun manufacturer will partner with an ammo maker to introduce a new cartridge. Doesn't do the ammomaker any good to bring a new cartridge to market if there are no guns chambered for it.

 

The patent on the 1911 design has long since expired and everyone and their brother now build 1911 pattern guns. That Nighthawk you're coveting probably runs north of $2500.

 

Caliber is a personal choice. If you are just punching paper, sometimes it comes down to economics. If you are serious about punching paper, other factors come into play. Many members on this board are active in the action shooting sports, so they need a particular power level, as dictated by the rules of the sport of their choice.

 

Firearms and the shooting sports is a multi-faceted, multi-dimensional endeavor that transcends one demographic and encompasses all different people with different backgrounds and outside interests. Welcome to a lifetime hobby.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob

I'm going with what Pizza Bob said and I'll learn all through osmosis! I picked up a few mags and I really enjoy reading them but they throw around the numbers and talk about these guns and its hard to get a good visual on it all. For example when I read .45ACP for the first time I googled ACP and found out it means Automatic Colt Pistol. Now I thought a Colt was an actual handgun but there are a lot of guns that use that ammo. On the other side I read up on the history of the 1911 (BTW there is Nighthawk 1911 on the cover of Guns & Ammo that is flippin' sweet looking!). I learned that it was made by John Browning yet a bunch of other manufacturers make 1911's where in my head initially I thought only Browning would have made it. When I get involved in something I have to grab all the knowledge I can. I want to know everything which keeps me learning and interested. Hence all these rudimentary questions. Right now I am trying to get to the point to understand the different kind of guns, the basic differences between calibers, and more so why I would chose one caliber over another. I am not a hunter and never will be so this would be more for marksmanship and collecting for me. As a hunter you need certain guns for the stopping power. As a collector/marksman what drives you to different calibers firearms?

 

Eddie

 

There is a symbiosis between caliber and firearms. A company many invent a new caliber and a new gun to shoot it. For example, 45ACP. Then, other companies might make a firearm to shoot the same 45ACP ammo. Then, after 70 years the copyrights/patents expire and companies start to make clones of the 1911 firearm. Some calibers are very old like 38special. Some are newer like .40Smith&Wesson.

 

Every caliber is a compromise. Some are small and weak but cheap and easy to carry lots of. Others are big and powerful but expensive and since they're large, you can't carry as much ammo with you. People will argue about caliber forever.

... and some calibers are solutions to problems that never existed.... 45 GAP.

 

Created by Glock to pack 45 stopping power into a medium frame. Too bad Glock was the only one suffering from it, and other 45's mostly had thinner/smaller frames than the Glock Large Frame guns. (45 ACP/10mm)

On the other side I read up on the history of the 1911 (BTW there is Nighthawk 1911 on the cover of Guns & Ammo that is flippin' sweet looking!). I learned that it was made by John Browning yet a bunch of other manufacturers make 1911's where in my head initially I thought only Browning would have made it.

 

During WW2 everyone was making everything for everyone else just to win the war effort. Smith Corona (the typewriter people if you know what a typewriter is) made guns in WW2. Jeeps were made by Willys Overland as well as Ford - which during "normal" times would have been competitors making the same product...

Wow, did not know about Ford making Jeeps. I knew about Eastman Kodak making grenades iirc.

Wow, did not know about Ford making Jeeps. I knew about Eastman Kodak making grenades iirc.

 

At some point, anything that was a factory was making something relevant to the war effort - or so it seems in reading about the war effort. Watching Auction Kings today I learned that Harley made motorcycles for the lend/lease program that were sent to Canada and exported to Europe...

 

Remington made Mosin-Nagant Rifles (russian). Canada made SMLE's (Enfield rifles) for Britain. There was a camaraderie which I believe we are totally missing today. The country came together to fight a common enemy.

Remi and Westinghouse made Mosins for Russian civil war. =) The two I am still looking to find in good condition.

 

Canada made high powers too.

Since we seem to have strayed a bit from the OP, I'll add another historic footnote. The Mercer County Airport was built so that Grumann Avengers, built at the Parkway Ave General Motors plant in Ewing Twp, could be flown to staging areas for deployment.

 

Adios,

 

Pizza Bob