Some depts have 'caliber" restrictions some dont. I dont know. Anything that could be seen as an off-duty would be exempt, what that is may be debateable, but the law is what it is.

While at a LGS when a police officer in uniform stopped in and said he needed to return a department shotgun for repair that was in his cruiser. The guys behind the desk said to bring it in. The cop said he couldn't because he didn't have a case for it. The guys working there said "yeah, but you're in uniform." The cop said, "So what. The law says it needs to be cased. Do you have a case I can borrow to carry in the shotgun?"

 

So, if you don't like the laws, blame the legislature, don't blame the cops.

I have definitely purchased more than one a month. When nics sees the Leo id they don't say anything. I have don't this multiple times.

A trooper was telling me that they used to do troopers PPP's in house at the barracks they work out of and not through the town they live in, they have now stopped doing this and told them they must go through the process in the town they live in like everybody else.

 

Federal LEOs can buy work related handguns through their office direct from the manufacturers (and at a discount) without the normal paperwork or a NICS check. The agency (I believe) is supposed to record who got what, and when they retire they are required to follow all applicable laws in the state they live in - which means in a state like NY they would need to register it at that time.

Ok, questions here. So as long Leo qualifys with a proper calibor hg and its supposed use is for duty theres no limit on purchases & doesnt that mean it actually needs to be carried? Also is there actually a regulation stating a min of carry days to be met or is that some "ambiguous" detail?

No to all. LEO's are exempt from 30 day restriction.

While at a LGS when a police officer in uniform stopped in and said he needed to return a department shotgun for repair that was in his cruiser. The guys behind the desk said to bring it in. The cop said he couldn't because he didn't have a case for it. The guys working there said "yeah, but you're in uniform." The cop said, "So what. The law says it needs to be cased. Do you have a case I can borrow to carry in the shotgun?"

 

So, if you don't like the laws, blame the legislature, don't blame the cops.

 

The LEO under this particular circumstance , if he was on duty is covered under exemptions to posess and carry the shotgun without a case just like he would have been with his service weapon.

 

A civilian wouldn't need a case if he had his FID card and it was unloaded. In NJ, with an FID card, you can carry unloaded long guns in public, provided it is not an exempted edit:"prohibited" location like school property, courts, etc. Nobody ever does, and you would problably be arrested by LE if you did just b/c this is NJ.

 

As a civilian without an FID, then you have to travel with it according to the travel exemptions, aka directly to and from ... cased.. unloaded, etc

 

 

 

Just another example on how there are so many incorrect perceptions of what NJ gun laws really are, and a testament to how confusing they can be.

so you dont have to wait 30 days. You dont even have to actually carry the guns you buy at a discount. sounds like SPECIAL TREATMENT and i think its UNFAIR and I'm really jelous.

Federal LEOs can buy work related handguns through their office direct from the manufacturers (and at a discount) without the normal paperwork or a NICS check. The agency (I believe) is supposed to record who got what, and when they retire they are required to follow all applicable laws in the state they live in - which means in a state like NY they would need to register it at that time.

 

Used to be. Not any more.

 

Last I did a direct purchase thru the agency was in 1997. I used to have the manufacturer/dealer fill out the permits or I would do it myself and return them to Division HQ.

 

At that point FIU basically told me to do the permit now or when I retired. Former head of FIU told me they weren't really clear on it, but by now they require the permit since the weapon wil be a personal weapon for use OTJ.

 

AFA as LEO exemptions to the PP process, I seem to recall there was a court case in the late 60's/early 70's where the ruling was that LE were not exempt the PP process for personally owned weapons.

They arent exempt from the PP process but the are exempt from the 30 day rule.

Yes LEO's have to fill out all required paperwork and yes they are exempt from the one handgun every 30 days.

 

+1

This thread was answered in the second post by blksheep, yet here it is at post #41.

I'm in the same boat as you, active TS/SCI clearance. The fact that I need a bogus state background check irks me in an annoying way.

 

This is the result of the separation of federal and state authority. You get your TS/SCI from the the federal government. Once you get your clearance you should report any arrests or things of that nature to your supervisor but if you don't you probably won't get caught until your next periodic review.

 

A trooper was telling me that they used to do troopers PPP's in house at the barracks they work out of and not through the town they live in, they have now stopped doing this and told them they must go through the process in the town they live in like everybody else.

 

Federal LEOs can buy work related handguns through their office direct from the manufacturers (and at a discount) without the normal paperwork or a NICS check. The agency (I believe) is supposed to record who got what, and when they retire they are required to follow all applicable laws in the state they live in - which means in a state like NY they would need to register it at that time.

 

Federal law allows any LEO to purchase directly from a manufacturer or FFL anywhere as long as the order is accompanied with the proper paperwork. Whether other than Federal LEOs can do so or not is dependent on the state law and NJ is a no. The Federal agency is not required to comply with any laws, Complying with state laws is the responsibility of the retired LEO. You are correctas far as NY goes. Before I retired I had to hold the personal guns of guys retiring in NY and deliver them to the police station or precinct where ther lived.

Please show me where it says LEO's are exempt from the 30 day rule other then for handguns purchased FOR duty. Not trying to start a pissing match here... just looking for the written exemption in the statute.

 

(1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

 

How that translates into them being completely exempt is beyond me.

a federal, State or local law enforcement officer

 

Its right there.

 

The second part is seperate.

 

or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

Please show me where it says LEO's are exempt from the 30 day rule other then for handguns purchased FOR duty. Not trying to start a pissing match here... just looking for the written exemption in the statute.

 

(1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

 

How that translates into them being completely exempt is beyond me.

 

Same thing I asked. Doesn't matter to me since I am just a civilian............

a federal, State or local law enforcement officer

 

Its right there.

 

The second part is seperate.

 

or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

I admit, i am not lawyer, nor am i a grammatical genius... but u cant just take a statement and separate it into two meanings where it is convenient for you.

 

The law translates very simply into, LEOS or their agency are exempt from the 30 day rule when purchasing duty weapons....

I am just reading it.

 

First part states any Fed, State or Local LEO are exempt.

 

Then the second part is an agency..blah. The second part is if you have an agency with 500 guys you dont have to wait 500 months to equip them all.

It is two seperate statements in the law.

Dude, do know what commas are for?

 

If it read (1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer, or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

 

With out that comma, the purchasing part incorporates everything it follows.

Let's eat grandpa.

Let's eat, grandpa.

A comma can make all the difference.

(1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer or agency

These people qualify for the exemption

and in order to meet that exemption they must be

purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

Call every state gun shop and tell them they are wrong.

Call every state gun shop and tell them they are wrong.

I'm not debating what is practiced, just what the law says.

Im just telling you how it is. Interpret it however you like. I didnt write the law. Dont be mad at me.

Im just telling you how it is. Interpret it however you like. I didnt write the law. Dont be mad at me.

Ohhh im not mad, lol. I just enjoy ripping NJ's laws apart. Trust me, i hate the 30 day rule, i wish it upon no man.

I thought you were mad at me... I have nothing to do with it

Actually I Initially asked the question because I thought that LEO’s are subject to more stringent background checks (like myself) due to their profession than what is required to obtain a handgun permit. If that was the case then it seems like a waste of money and manpower to perform a lesser background check. The intent was not to start a us/them war.

 

there was a time when we could just go to the department where we worked and get permits from them, no matter where we lived, That exemption was done away with IIRC when the Pickle Pirate was Governor. My wait time for permits is between 7 and 8 weeks.

Dude, do know what commas are for?

 

If it read (1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer, or agency purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

 

With out that comma, the purchasing part incorporates everything it follows.

Let's eat grandpa.

Let's eat, grandpa.

A comma can make all the difference.

(1)a federal, State or local law enforcement officer or agency

These people qualify for the exemption

and in order to meet that exemption they must be

purchasing handguns for use by officers in the actual performance of their law enforcement duties

Off-duty firearms ARE for use in the performance of Law Enforcement Duties, since I I am carrying, i am bound by the AG guidelines for Use of Force, and I am doing so under the color of Office. A subtle distinction, but a distinction nonetheless. That said, I play by the 30 day rule anyway...

I'll take that argument. I didn't even think about that aspect.

How can one be "jealous" over the fact that LEO's are treated a bit differently than the rest of us re: handgun purchases? We are purchasing for home defense, recreational shooting, etc., while the police are equipping themselves to deal with the vast ocean of violent scum they may encounter on any given tour.

 

Do I wish we had more liberal gun laws? Absolutely! Do I vehemently oppose OGAM and other restrictions that the law-abiding citizen has to suffer? I sure do. But again, for LEO's their firearms are tools of the trade and could be the difference between life and death, and I'm not about to get into a peein' match debating why they should get "special" treatment.

I do not believe it is jealousy

 

I believe it is the misconception that "No man is above the law"

Used to be. Not any more.

 

Last I did a direct purchase thru the agency was in 1997. I used to have the manufacturer/dealer fill out the permits or I would do it myself and return them to Division HQ.

 

At that point FIU basically told me to do the permit now or when I retired. Former head of FIU told me they weren't really clear on it, but by now they require the permit since the weapon wil be a personal weapon for use OTJ.

 

AFA as LEO exemptions to the PP process, I seem to recall there was a court case in the late 60's/early 70's where the ruling was that LE were not exempt the PP process for personally owned weapons.

 

Sorry I missed your post before I posted mine but Feds can still acquire guns from the manufacturer. I don't know why you had the manufacturer fill out P2Ps for you. If you are ordering guns to use in conjunction with your official duties and they are delivered to your office, state law has no impact whatsoever. Any "official acts" by a Federal agency or LEO done in conjunction with official duties are not subject to any state or local law.

 

In actual practice I've seen it applied differently. Some agencies won't do it all, some agencies will do something uncalled for (like require you to get P2P, some agencies differ from office to office, and some agencies not only allow it they have it written into their firearms policies.

 

Before anyone gets cranky about Feds getting all these guns at a discount, they have to be used for official duties (like you can't buy a Glock 34 unless it is authorized by your agency) and you can't get away with buying 5 or 6 a year.