I know this will piss some people off but, how about we forget about new gun control laws and follow the laws that are all ready on the books and send the people to jail that break the law. How about people with mental illness get the help they need instead of putting them back out on the street after 30 days.. How about we look at other avenues like parents not teaching there kids and relying on the government to teach our kids right from wrong. How about the politicians stop imposing new taxes, fees etc on the people so people can make a living instead of both parents working in order to just pay the bills. On my block where I live there are at least 4 families that the 4th grader has a key to the house because both parents are working, who is teaching those kids right from wrong?

Requiring firearms to be locked when not on someones person may be a step in the right direction. Yes, it MAY not actually prevent anything, same with a new AWB, but at least its not stripping us of something and it makes people feel a little better.

 

SCOTUS already ruled that this was unconstitutional in Heller. Also, it's completely unenforceable.

the issue is simple common sense....

 

you don't want criminals to have guns... I am sure we all agree about that?

the way the system is now there is NO guarantee that the person is not a criminal when you do a FTF transaction..

the simple solution is to make transfers through a licensed dealer...

 

I am sorry but $15 on a $400... $500... $900.. purchase is not really impacting to me, and shouldnt be to most people...

you paint it as this huge hassle... how hard is it really?

 

you don't need stats to know that FTF sales are a problem.. in many states you dont need anything for FTF long gun... that is probably not a great system.. since you could EASILY be selling a gun to a criminal without knowing it... why would you even want to be a part of potentially putting a gun in the wrong hands?

 

I am all for freedom.. but what you are saying makes no sense.. why even have nics for sales through a dealer.. if you are not going to require them for FTF...

 

to require them at a dealer but not FTF is the very definition of a loophole.. and it is part of the fuel anti gun community uses to burn us..

the issue is simple common sense....

 

you don't want criminals to have guns... I am sure we all agree about that?

the way the system is now there is NO guarantee that the person is not a criminal when you do a FTF transaction..

the simple solution is to make transfers through a licensed dealer...

 

I am sorry but $15 on a $400... $500... $900.. purchase is not really impacting to me, and shouldnt be to most people...

you paint it as this huge hassle... how hard is it really?

 

you don't need stats to know that FTF sales are a problem.. in many states you dont need anything for FTF long gun... that is probably not a great system.. since you could EASILY be selling a gun to a criminal without knowing it... why would you even want to be a part of potentially putting a gun in the wrong hands?

 

I am all for freedom.. but what you are saying makes no sense.. why even have nics for sales through a dealer.. if you are not going to require them for FTF...

 

to require them at a dealer but not FTF is the very definition of a loophole.. and it is part of the fuel anti gun community uses to burn us..

 

Again, this solution means that my Right to Keep and Bear Arms is predicated on someone else's ability to supply them to me... I don't want to have to drive my ass to an FFL to meet some guy before the FFL closes to transfer a rifle. It's stupid. Just give me access to NICS and be done with it.

 

As for the NICS fee? I don't get why we as gun owners are footing the bill for this at all. It should be paid for by the taxpayers AT LARGE. Do we pay money to vote? NOPE! So I shouldn't pay money for a background check.

 

There are no stats which definitively show FtF transfers are any more of an issue than Straw Buyers. None. Until you manage to come up with that, then shut your trap. I already provided an effective solution to this "non-problem" and it's giving everyone access to NICS. Boom! Done! Non-problem solved without requiring a middleman FFL.

 

Stop parroting your same crap in this thread. No one wants to have to run to an FFL to transfer a rifle between father and son, husband and wife, or friend to friend. Almost everyone on this forum depends on FtF transfers to sell guns at our leisure.

 

Frankly, I could care less about criminals getting their hands on guns, because as I mentioned earlier, it's not really too difficult for them to do so. HECK, EVEN IN ENGLAND, THEY STILL MANAGE TO GET THEM!

I just hope they don't ban my semi auto comic books. That would be completely unfair.

it is important to note that there is information that the shooter tried to legally buy a gun.. and was turned down.. if he lived in PA he could have easily purchased a long gun face to face.. that is a very simple illustration of how NICS works.. and are actually pretty useful and important..

 

The gunman in the Newtown massacre tried unsuccessfully to buy a rifle three days before he killed 20 children, six adults and himself at Sandy Hook Elementary School, Connecticut and federal officials told NBC News Saturday.

 

Adam Lanza, 20, went to a Dick's Sporting Goods store in Danbury, Conn., on Tuesday to buy the weapon, but was turned down because he didn't want to undergo a background check or abide by the state's waiting period for gun sales, the officials said.

the issue is simple common sense....

 

you don't want criminals to have guns... I am sure we all agree about that?

the way the system is now there is NO guarantee that the person is not a criminal when you do a FTF transaction..

the simple solution is to make transfers through a licensed dealer...

 

I am sorry but $15 on a $400... $500... $900.. purchase is not really impacting to me, and shouldnt be to most people...

you paint it as this huge hassle... how hard is it really?

 

you don't need stats to know that FTF sales are a problem.. in many states you dont need anything for FTF long gun... that is probably not a great system.. since you could EASILY be selling a gun to a criminal without knowing it... why would you even want to be a part of potentially putting a gun in the wrong hands?

 

I am all for freedom.. but what you are saying makes no sense.. why even have nics for sales through a dealer.. if you are not going to require them for FTF...

 

to require them at a dealer but not FTF is the very definition of a loophole.. and it is part of the fuel anti gun community uses to burn us..

 

What happens when NICS is down for a day? A week? A month?

Again, this solution means that my Right to Keep and Bear Arms is predicated on someone else's ability to supply them to me... I don't want to have to drive my ass to an FFL to meet some guy before the FFL closes to transfer a rifle. It's stupid. Just give me access to NICS and be done with it.

 

As for the NICS fee? I don't get why we as gun owners are footing the bill for this at all. It should be paid for by the taxpayers AT LARGE. Do we pay money to vote? NOPE! So I shouldn't pay money for a background check.

 

There are no stats which definitively show FtF transfers are any more of an issue than Straw Buyers. None. Until you manage to come up with that, then shut your trap. I already provided an effective solution to this "non-problem" and it's giving everyone access to NICS. Boom! Done! Non-problem solved without requiring a middleman FFL.

 

Stop parroting your same crap in this thread. No one wants to have to run to an FFL to transfer a rifle between father and son, husband and wife, or friend to friend. Almost everyone on this forum depends on FtF transfers to sell guns at our leisure.

 

Frankly, I could care less about criminals getting their hands on guns, because as I mentioned earlier, it's not really too difficult for them to do so. HECK, EVEN IN ENGLAND, THEY STILL MANAGE TO GET THEM!

 

the system stopped the shooter from legally purchasing a gun... while it did not stop the crime.. the system in itself worked how it should have.. if only his mom had secured the weapons... this MAY not have even happened..

 

exactly how many guns do you buy and sell a month that you are so worried about this huge inconvenience.. LOL

your reaction to logic is why the anti gun community thinks we are nuts...

 

"we RELY on face to face sales to get guns at our leisure"

"I don't care if criminals get guns"

What happens when NICS is down for a day? A week? A month?

 

NICS is never down for a month... ever....

 

what happens if you go to renew your drivers license and DMV is down for a year...

Then you can't get a gun....

I know this will piss some people off but, how about we forget about new gun control laws and follow the laws that are all ready on the books and send the people to jail that break the law. How about people with mental illness get the help they need instead of putting them back out on the street after 30 days.. How about we look at other avenues like parents not teaching there kids and relying on the government to teach our kids right from wrong. How about the politicians stop imposing new taxes, fees etc on the people so people can make a living instead of both parents working in order to just pay the bills. On my block where I live there are at least 4 families that the 4th grader has a key to the house because both parents are working, who is teaching those kids right from wrong?

 

 

WOW. Isn't that illegal. Sorry guys, but I'm not leaving anyone 10-years old home alone to fend for themselves. Have you ever considered reporting these people. I'd not be able to sleep at night if something terrible were to happen and I could have prevented it.

NICS is never down for a month... ever....

 

what happens if you go to renew your drivers license and DMV is down for a year...

 

NICS has been down plenty of times. Especially during States of Emergencies. Frankly, I believe that if NICS doesn't give you a response in 24 hours, then the transaction should automatically be allowed to proceed.

its funny I have bought and sold MANY guns... and I have never felt this insane urgency I am seeing in some of these responses.. most of the time it could take several days to meet up... I exclusively use FFLs now because they are actually MORE convenient.. instead of relying on my schedule I just set something up with the FFL... he receives the gun.. and then transfers it to me when I can swing by... it honestly could not be more convenient..

I have no issue closing the loophole with face-to-face purchases. For the little bit of inconvenience it may create, I think the benefits are worth it.

 

NICS has been down plenty of times. Especially during States of Emergencies. Frankly, I believe that if NICS doesn't give you a response in 24 hours, then the transaction should automatically be allowed to proceed.

 

an FFL can chime in here... but I have NEVER heard of NICS being down for weeks..

NICS is never down for a month... ever....

 

There's no incentive to have it down that long. But, if all transfers were required to use it, one very anti-gun president could shut it down and end all gun sales in the US without having to go through Congress. NICS doesn't have a guaranteed availability, so there is nothing stopping them from shutting it down.

I'd imagine that NICS is a pretty big revenue generator. No one is going to want to keep it down for any length of time.

the system stopped the shooter from legally purchasing a gun... while it did not stop the crime.. the system in itself worked how it should have.. if only his mom had secured the weapons... this MAY not have even happened..

 

exactly how many guns do you buy and sell a month that you are so worried about this huge inconvenience.. LOL

your reaction to logic is why the anti gun community thinks we are nuts...

 

"we RELY on face to face sales to get guns at our leisure"

"I don't care if criminals get guns"

 

Dude, face it, no one wants your idea. It sucks because no one wants to have to go out of their way to go to an FFL. If you're SOOOOOOOOOOO worried about the non-problem of FtF transfers, then simply let everyone access NICS. Give everyone an FFL with an FFL number, and let them access NICS to run other people's FFL/FFL number. Make it a smartphone app and you've just eliminated a dumb system of bureaucracy.

 

Simple solution.

 

 

NICS has been down plenty of times. Especially during States of Emergencies. Frankly, I believe that if NICS doesn't give you a response in 24 hours, then the transaction should automatically be allowed to proceed.

 

Wow more brilliance.. So if someone provides false info and the delay is for that reason it should be approved. I can play the dumb what if game

I'd imagine that NICS is a pretty big revenue generator. No one is going to want to keep it down for any length of time.

 

I don't think it's fair for NICS to be a user-fee system. It's akin to a poll tax.

There's no incentive to have it down that long. But, if all transfers were required to use it, one very anti-gun president could shut it down and end all gun sales in the US without having to go through Congress. NICS doesn't have a guaranteed availability, so there is nothing stopping them from shutting it down.

 

if he REALLY wanted to.. he could push to ban ALL guns completely...

 

here is the thing...

when people talk about gun laws.. we all get scared.. clam up... or start screaming NOPE NOPE NOPE...

 

what I am saying is take these moments and make them teachable... I have had this exact conversation with liberals... and MANY of them are understanding that I own guns.. and shoot as a hobby... they do not necisarily want me to lose my guns... I have explained to these people that YES there are some things to improve..

 

take the time to really look at gun laws... take the ones that make NO sense.. mag limits for example.. and talk about them... and in the same breath hear what others are saying and think.. think MAYBE it is a bad idea that just any idiot can buy a long gun without a background check... all I am saying is there is room to improve BOTH ways..

Wow more brilliance.. So if someone provides false info and the delay is for that reason it should be approved. I can play the dumb what if game

 

How long does it take to check out false info... goodness. Type it into a system, check it, done. But if NICS is down? I don't think I have to wait because the Government is incompetent at doing its job.

Dude, face it, no one wants your idea. It sucks because no one wants to have to go out of their way to go to an FFL. If you're SOOOOOOOOOOO worried about the non-problem of FtF transfers, then simply let everyone access NICS. Give everyone an FFL with an FFL number, and let them access NICS to run other people's FFL/FFL number. Make it a smartphone app and you've just eliminated a dumb system of bureaucracy.

 

Simple solution.

 

no one obviously likes your system either... which is why we are on the verge of losing it ALL..

 

stay on with that... be hard on the issue and completely inflexible... and when they steam roll you over keep crying like you are doing now..

 

 

 

I know I know.. you know everything.. just like you made up laws about 922... you really don't have a clue and seem to just argue about everything.... possibly for the sake of arguing... almost feels troll like at times..

How long does it take to check out false info... goodness. Type it into a system, check it, done. But if NICS is down? I don't think I have to wait because the Government is incompetent at doing its job.

 

agreed far better just to provide access to a gun to anyone... maybe we should restore a persons ability to own a gun after he gets out of jail... seems unfair that he should have to pay for that forever..

 

sarcasm..

Uh... Do you know how long I have waited for warrant verifications or prints to come back after live scanning perps. Or if I have to fax prints to the FBI. So yeah stuff can take time. God forbid you wait your majesty

if he REALLY wanted to.. he could push to ban ALL guns completely...

 

here is the thing...

when people talk about gun laws.. we all get scared.. clam up... or start screaming NOPE NOPE NOPE...

 

what I am saying is take these moments and make them teachable... I have had this exact conversation with liberals... and MANY of them are understanding that I own guns.. and shoot as a hobby... they do not necisarily want me to lose my guns... I have explained to these people that YES there are some things to improve..

 

take the time to really look at gun laws... take the ones that make NO sense.. mag limits for example.. and talk about them... and in the same breath hear what others are saying and think.. think MAYBE it is a bad idea that just any idiot can buy a long gun without a background check... all I am saying is there is room to improve BOTH ways..

 

Vlad, the only ones here who are scared are you and BLF. Acting like a bunch of punks who don't know what it means to support and defend our inalienable Right to own firearms.

 

Why the fugg are we always the ones who have to cave in to the other sides demands? Gun crime in our country is on it's way down under our present system, so why the hell are we as a group getting punished. Those anti-gun assholes always want more, more, more. I say NO! We should be fighting to lessen the restrictions on firearms, we should be able to own SBR full auto weapons if we damned well please. We should be able to carry our guns, own suppressors, and not deal with FFLs. We should be able to order guns and ammunition using AMAZON PRIME!

 

But no, folks like you are willing to bend over and take it instead of fighting for what is rightfully ours. Guess what, you can appease them all you want, but it's not gonna stop them.

Uh... Do you know how long I have waited for warrant verifications or prints to come back after live scanning perps. Or if I have to fax prints to the FBI. So yeah stuff can take time. God forbid you wait your majesty

 

he does not deserve that...

 

he is entitled to immediate satisfaction...

no one obviously likes your system either... which is why we are on the verge of losing it ALL..

 

stay on with that... be hard on the issue and completely inflexible... and when they steam roll you over keep crying like you are doing now..

 

 

 

I know I know.. you know everything.. just like you made up laws about 922... you really don't have a clue and seem to just argue about everything.... possibly for the sake of arguing... almost feels troll like at times..

 

Oh yeah, because we need an FFL to dial a phone number and tell the person on the other line your name and drivers license number!!! LOL

 

Listen dude, just go. Go "appease" them... we'll see how far that gets you.

Lol..apparantly so. There is a lot of entitlement in this country...that's the problem. Too many diva's. Maybe we can change his name o DivasAdvocate

Vlad, the only ones here who are scared are you and BLF. Acting like a bunch of punks who don't know what it means to support and defend our inalienable Right to own firearms.

 

Why the fugg are we always the ones who have to cave in to the other sides demands? Gun crime in our country is on it's way down under our present system, so why the hell are we as a group getting punished. Those anti-gun assholes always want more, more, more. I say NO! We should be fighting to lessen the restrictions on firearms, we should be able to own SBR full auto weapons if we damned well please. We should be able to carry our guns, own suppressors, and not deal with FFLs. We should be able to order guns and ammunition using AMAZON PRIME!

 

But no, folks like you are willing to bend over and take it instead of fighting for what is rightfully ours. Guess what, you can appease them all you want, but it's not gonna stop them.

 

I AGREE

we SHOULD fight for less restrictions on things like SBR.. mag limits.. etc.. because those limits do NOT help society.. I AGREE completely...

 

in trade..

we should look at LOGICAL laws made in common sense to replace the ones that are nonsense... gun laws have not worked.... so MAYBE background checks for ALL would help in some instances...

 

 

thats all I am saying.... I am WILLING to accept some common sense laws... to REPLACE some of the nonsense laws..

if they are going to make laws anyway... I would rather suggest laws on acquisition, as opposed to laws on limitation...