Time to take the Saigas off the shelves and get rid of them, Banning it and other semi auto shotguns

 

New this year from LAW AND PUBLIC SAFETY (a)

DIVISION OF STATE POLICE Firearms and Weapons

Proposed Readoption with Amendments: N.J.A.C. 13:54

Proposed New Rules: N.J.A.C. 13:54-1.16, 1.17, and 3.21…

 

will change...

"iii. A semi-automatic shotgun that has at least two of the following:

(1) A folding or telescoping stock;

(2) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(3) A fixed magazine capacity in excess of six rounds; and/or

(4) An ability to accept a detachable magazine;"

 

2015 into this....

"iii. A semi-automatic shotgun that has one or more of

the following:

(1) A folding or telescoping stock;

(2) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon;

(3) A fixed magazine capacity in excess of six rounds; and/or

(4) An ability to accept a detachable magazine;"

 

Submit comments by February 13, 2015, to:

Colonel Joseph R. Fuentes, Superintendent

Attn: Firearms Investigation Unit

New Jersey State Police

PO Box 7068

West Trenton, New Jersey 08638

[email protected]

 

http://njsp.org/news/pdf/rp_20141215_1354.pdf

Because guns kill people... WTF.

How the f*ck will Christie get away with this if he wants to be President!!   WTF!

We should be all over this like we were the magazine ban they tried to stuff down our throat!

 

 

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How long before they pass a law that says:

"iii. Any type of shotgun that has one or more of
the following:

(1) Uses any type of ammunition.
(2) Is available for sale anywhere in the universe.
(3) Is made of any type of material, real or imaginary.
(4) The user does not have a may issue shotgun permit.
 
 

How the f*ck will Christie get away with this if he wants to be President!!   WTF!

 

THAT ↑  needs to be the message.  That it's Christie's anti-gun executive branch that's doing this.   The superintendent of NJSP doesn't care if he's seen as anti-gun but if we can tie this to Christie, it might not be adopted as proposed.  He's already said that NJ's gun laws might be "a little too strict".  He's vetoed new gun control laws that his past suggests he probably really liked a lot.  He does not want to be seen as anti gun - until after 2016.

Not familiar with the process here do we simply write comments via US Mail to the name above?

This isn't a change in the law - NJ Statute has banned semi-auto shotguns with folding stocks and/or pistol grips since Florio passed the original law in the 1990s. Nothing new here.

Molon Labe!

This isn't a change in the law - NJ Statute has banned semi-auto shotguns with folding stocks and/or pistol grips since Florio passed the original law in the 1990s. Nothing new here.

 

You are missing the point, with a stroke of the pan an unelected body is now banning guns that were legal before under the same laws that haven't change. This bans all removable magazine fed semi shotguns, which isn't the case today.

From the OP I see we can contact Colonel Joseph R. Fuentes, Superintendent NJSP, I would assume we should also contact Christie as well as our local state representatives.  Is there anyone else we should contact?

They intend to make us all felons eventually.

Getting out of this state is turning into more of a jailbreak rather than just moving.  

 

They intend to make us all felons eventually.

They intend to make us all felons eventually.

Let's never forget:  http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2013/05/pro-gun_advocates_angry_over_n.html

From the OP I see we can contact Colonel Joseph R. Fuentes, Superintendent NJSP, I would assume we should also contact Christie as well as our local state representatives.  Is there anyone else we should contact?

 

I wouldn't bother to contact Fuentes.  Obviously he would be acting as a little dictator in his own right.  I would contact Christie, though, and maybe the attorney general.  I would also contact your NJ representatives.  

 

I am sure that the complacent, smug, indifferent fudd-types won't care.  Until they change "semi-auto" to "any"  by the stroke of a pen, and the list of features to "any". 

You are missing the point, with a stroke of the pan an unelected body is now banning guns that were legal before under the same laws that haven't change. This bans all removable magazine fed semi shotguns, which isn't the case today.

 

Exactly!  They are circumventing one of the fundamental principles of our government, that it is the job of the legislative branch to make new laws.

This will never stop until we stop it. Our elected officials are no longer servants of the people; they are acting like public masters (as Anthony Colandro perfectly puts it) and we really can't keep just chatting online. We have to like go to where these guys are and tell them to their face. And we need numbers.

 

 

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What do you think will happen if you currently own one?

What do you think will happen if you currently own one?

 

Depending on how things are written one of three things:

 

1) Become a felon overnight

2) Become a felon within 30-90 days (grace period to dump the offending firearms at below-market values due to a flood of people selling)

3) Possession could be grandfathered by those who own them and only ban the sale of new shotguns (laughable, especially in NJ)

You missed the option of becoming a felon overnight but never knowing about it because odds are no one will tell you that what you bought legally 2 years ago is now no longer legal seeing how no laws were even passed. 

You missed the option of becoming a felon overnight but never knowing about it because odds are no one will tell you that what you bought legally 2 years ago is now no longer legal seeing how no laws were even passed. 

 

We can call that option 1a) You don't know that you become a felon (most likely) not to be confused with option 1b) You become a felon and know about it because you're a member of NJGF.

Im so glad that i got out of this state!!

I submitted a comment through email a day or two ago and I actually received a response today from the head of the FIU asking me to call him. I talked to him and he said he read my comment to Colonel Fuentes and that they would have to go back and review the proposed changes to account better for the detachable magazine shotguns. We'll see I guess.

I wouldn't bother to contact Fuentes.  Obviously he would be acting as a little dictator in his own right.  I would contact Christie, though, and maybe the attorney general.  I would also contact your NJ representatives.  

 

I am sure that the complacent, smug, indifferent fudd-types won't care.  Until they change "semi-auto" to "any"  by the stroke of a pen, and the list of features to "any". 

 

Lots of people saying to contact the Governor.   Feel free but that's not the process. There is an official process for commenting on proposed changes to the administrative code.  There is a 60 day public comment period open until February 13th.   The instructions for submitting comments and all of the proposed changes can be found here:  http://njsp.org/news/pdf/rp_20141215_1354.pdf

Is there any chance one of you more enlightened Pro2A citizens could highlight and interpret the proposed changes that will REALLY screw us over? I've read through this once casually and then spent over an hour scrutinizing it. That I can tell, retailers will be bothered the most. However my contentions (as I interpret this gibberish) are with giving local police departments more control over deciding who gets a permit and who doesn't, banning of certain popular shotguns and keeping records of all the guns we have and who gas what. Am I right?? I try to understand this and sometimes I think I know what the paragraph is saying but I don't have confidence that I do fully understand. The enemies of the 2A have extremely deep corporate pockets AND more attorneys than they know what to do with. If humble ol' me sends the colonel something that makes me look like a rube he's gonna laugh and hit delete. We need our OWN lawyers to translate this into English and give us an idea of what our approach should be. NJ2AR has been going after all the towns who break the law by stalling and not following the rules. It looks to me like all the other crap on here is to mask that they are really looking to give the PDs the RIGHT to stall and delay issuing an FID.

 

 

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Is there any chance one of you more enlightened Pro2A citizens could highlight and interpret the proposed changes that will REALLY screw us over? I've read through this once casually and then spent over an hour scrutinizing it. That I can tell, retailers will be bothered the most. However my contentions (as I interpret this gibberish) are with giving local police departments more control over deciding who gets a permit and who doesn't, banning of certain popular shotguns and keeping records of all the guns we have and who gas what. Am I right?? I try to understand this and sometimes I think I know what the paragraph is saying but I don't have confidence that I do fully understand. The enemies of the 2A have extremely deep corporate pockets AND more attorneys than they know what to do with. If humble ol' me sends the colonel something that makes me look like a rube he's gonna laugh and hit delete. We need our OWN lawyers to translate this into English and give us an idea of what our approach should be. NJ2AR has been going after all the towns who break the law by stalling and not following the rules. It looks to me like all the other crap on here is to mask that they are really looking to give the PDs the RIGHT to stall and delay issuing an FID.

 

 

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NJ2AR hasnt done anything. I think you might be thinking of NJ2AS Operation Task Force and ANJPRC's

Strikeforce.

Is there any chance one of you more enlightened Pro2A citizens could highlight and interpret the proposed changes that will REALLY screw us over? I've read through this once casually and then spent over an hour scrutinizing it. That I can tell, retailers will be bothered the most. However my contentions (as I interpret this gibberish) are with giving local police departments more control over deciding who gets a permit and who doesn't, banning of certain popular shotguns and keeping records of all the guns we have and who gas what. Am I right?? I try to understand this and sometimes I think I know what the paragraph is saying but I don't have confidence that I do fully understand. The enemies of the 2A have extremely deep corporate pockets AND more attorneys than they know what to do with. If humble ol' me sends the colonel something that makes me look like a rube he's gonna laugh and hit delete. We need our OWN lawyers to translate this into English and give us an idea of what our approach should be. NJ2AR has been going after all the towns who break the law by stalling and not following the rules. It looks to me like all the other crap on here is to mask that they are really looking to give the PDs the RIGHT to stall and delay issuing an FID.

 

 

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 Significant to me are:

 

• Semi auto shotguns with a detachable magazine now become assault firearms with no provision to comply.   Once this passes, you're a felon and you have no grace period to alter, sell, turn in, or otherwise comply with the law.  you're stuck as a felon with no way out.
• FID card now becomes invalid 30 days after you move, change your name, or change your sex.   The problem is that NJ's PD's rarely issue a new FID in 30 days.
• This will re-adopt the definition of "justifiable need" to get a NJ ccw.  The last time this was adopted in 2007, there was no Heller or McDonald decision.  Now that we have those decisions, the definition off justifiable need is clearly illegal now.
• Another change codifies the practice of NJ NICS being closed on holidays and Sundays.  This practice causes economic harm to NJ dealers who lose business to NY, PA, and DE who's NICS are open 7 days a week and on holidays.

there's more that might matter to you.

NJ2AR hasnt done anything. I think you might be thinking of NJ2AS Operation Task Force and ANJPRC's

Strikeforce.

Yes I meant ANJRPC - thanks for correcting me.

 

 

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Significant to me are:

• Semi auto shotguns with a detachable magazine now become assault firearms with no provision to comply. Once this passes, you're a felon and you have no grace period to alter, sell, turn in, or otherwise comply with the law. you're stuck as a felon with no way out.
• FID card now becomes invalid 30 days after you move, change your name, or change your sex. The problem is that NJ's PD's rarely issue a new FID in 30 days.
• This will re-adopt the definition of "justifiable need" to get a NJ ccw. The last time this was adopted in 2007, there was no Heller or McDonald decision. Now that we have those decisions, the definition off justifiable need is clearly illegal now.
• Another change codifies the practice of NJ NICS being closed on holidays and Sundays. This practice causes economic harm to NJ dealers who lose business to NY, PA, and DE who's NICS are open 7 days a week and on holidays.

there's more that might matter to you.

Yeah so I wasn't that far off in my interpretation. Thanks for helping clarify!

 

 

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Can someone give me a Cliff Notes version of what I should be writing to Col. Fuentes? Maybe a generic letter as to what we are opposed to and then I can add my own points to it?

 

Like Norseman said, I am getting a headache trying to interpret what they are trying to make illegal.

 

Thanks,

S