"Such deviation from the law is exemplified in recent undercover videos released by an advocacy group that appear to show police officers responsible for processing FID card and permit applications in the townships of Orange and Edison misrepresenting the process, discussing unauthorized standards and outright discouraging applicants from seeking an FID card or permit."

 

Nice!!!

"As noted, New Jersey law reflects a presumption that the acquisition and possession of firearms is unlawful."

The Commission also recommends that the standard ought to be amended to make explicit what we believe has always been implicit: that the requirement be that the permit should issue where the dangers to the applicant's life cannot reasonably be avoided other than by issuance of the permit. Without this change, the regulation appears to suggest that if there is anything the applicant could do to avoid the danger-including move to another state or even another country-the permit should not issue. But it defies our imagination to believe that this is what the Legislature intended by requiring "justifiable need." Instead, as in so many other areas of the law, what we believe the Legislature and our Supreme Court intended was for the applicant to show that she could not take other reasonable steps to avoid the danger.

I was in awe reading them explain how justifiable need should work, saying that you just have to be mugged first and then you should get a permit. Except that you still won't. I hate this state.

If you live through the attack.

 

"[T]he urgent necessity for self-protection, as evidenced by serious threats, specific threats, or previous attacks which demonstrate a special danger to the applicant's life that cannot reasonably be avoided by means other than by issuance of a permit to carry a handgun."

How can you reasonably avoid the unknown.  I don't know if I will be mugged, I cannot avoid it.  Give me my f@#king permit!

How can you reasonably avoid the unknown.  I don't know if I will be mugged, I cannot avoid it.  Give me my f@#king permit!

Don't leave your house. Hide in the closet and piss yourself.

I'm not surprised that this commission did us no favors.

 

I am somewhat surprised that ANJRPC is applauding it.

 

I am *VERY* surprised that Colandro/Gunforhire is applauding it.

"Maintaining the Administrative Code's present misreading of Siccardi and Preis that an applicant must demonstrate a "specific threat" in order to obtain a carry permit seems likely to result eventually in a successful constitutional challenge to the justifiable need standard."

All this shit is simply a political tactic. And alot of people are falling for it. And some will say atleast it's something we need to take baby steps. Bullshit,we need to be able to carry like 90% of the rest of the country. And guess what if Sweeney the swine makes it into office(which he has a shot in this democratic republic ) Things will get very bad

from what i read, it sounds like thye just changed the wording, but said exactly the same thing.

Don't leave your house. Hide in the closet and piss yourself.

 

Ill just make sure to hide in the closet with all the guns... 

It means nothing. It recommends the current laws in different words but doesn't offer any enforecement for those that don't honor it. For carry their is still justifiable need and permitting is the same for FID and P2P. So what's changed? It may smell a it different but it's still shit.

from what i read, it sounds like thye just changed the wording, but said exactly the same thing.

Zackly

Good. Now I'm going to apply for a permit based on ISIS calling for attacks on my place of employment. I consider that a "serious threat".

Zackly

i thought i was the only one seeing that. a couple of the guys on farcebook seem to think it's a step in the right direction, but it's not even close. shit.......it's not even a step.

You guys expect a governor to wave a magic wand, dissolve the legislature, have the judiciary tarred and feathered, and declare NJ a constitutional carry state. His willingness or unwillingness to exercise magical powers notwithstanding, you're blaming Christie for not having them.

 

Would you not say that:

 

* allowing detours to/from the range

* enforcing the 30-day max for all paperwork, or perhaps streamlining the process to allow same-day processing (I'm dreaming)

* expanding concealed carry to some meaningful degree

 

are not improvements? Are not something to build on? If so we do not speak the same language. 

I am not sure but if you are attacked by someone with a weapon and call 911 they will shorten the wait time to get a carry permit to 2 weeks (assuming you survive the attack and you have the photo ID of the attacker to verify the attack-although hospital reports of you having bullets removed will also be accepted).

You guys expect a governor to wave a magic wand, dissolve the legislature, have the judiciary tarred and feathered, and declare NJ a constitutional carry state. His willingness or unwillingness to exercise magical powers notwithstanding, you're blaming Christie for not having them.

 

Would you not say that:

 

* allowing detours to/from the range

* enforcing the 30-day max for all paperwork, or perhaps streamlining the process to allow same-day processing (I'm dreaming)

* expanding concealed carry to some meaningful degree

 

are not improvements? Are not something to build on? If so we do not speak the same language.

I don't expect the governor to do anything more than he is authorized to do. You are the one saying support him and maybe he can do more. Let's see if any real changes comes out of this.

You guys expect a governor to wave a magic wand, dissolve the legislature, have the judiciary tarred and feathered, and declare NJ a constitutional carry state. His willingness or unwillingness to exercise magical powers notwithstanding, you're blaming Christie for not having them.

 

Would you not say that:

 

* allowing detours to/from the range

* enforcing the 30-day max for all paperwork, or perhaps streamlining the process to allow same-day processing (I'm dreaming)

* expanding concealed carry to some meaningful degree

 

are not improvements? Are not something to build on? If so we do not speak the same language.

This report offered recommendations, not finalized orders or laws. They're small steps, but important.

 

Are changes long overdue? Yes.

 

Is this enough? Not in my opinion as my friends & relatives across the Delaware River don't live with this bullshit.

 

I shouldn't have to prove to anyone after the fact that I've been threatened or attacked and need the state's permission to defend myself. Ask Ms. Bowne how that worked for her.

You guys expect a governor to wave a magic wand, dissolve the legislature, have the judiciary tarred and feathered, and declare NJ a constitutional carry state. His willingness or unwillingness to exercise magical powers notwithstanding, you're blaming Christie for not having them.

 

Would you not say that:

 

* allowing detours to/from the range

* enforcing the 30-day max for all paperwork, or perhaps streamlining the process to allow same-day processing (I'm dreaming)

* expanding concealed carry to some meaningful degree

 

are not improvements? Are not something to build on? If so we do not speak the same language.

Well said...can we wait and see what his final actions are before we go through the litany of usual b!tching ...good lord the defeatist attitudes here are alarming...imagine if throughout this nations history we were populated by people with this "oh well that's the way it is I'll just keep moving throughout my life to avoid the govt".. there are no safe havens anywhere anymore.. the fight is on nationwide... so again can we hold on just one freaking minute and see what the final outcome is here.

 

If Christie is gonna make one of the final 4 or 5 POTUS candidate spots... maybe he's waiting until he's on even more TV/debates to make some 2a moves here in NJ ...for the rest of the nationwide voters to see.

 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

 

 

UPDATED: http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/12/dems_gun_activists_blast_christies_concealed_carry.html#incart_river_home_pop

 

"Stat Sen. Loretta Weinberg (D-Bergen) said the commission's recommendations are merely "something for him to wave around to the New Hampshire voters." "

 

------

 

"We're dumbfounded that any Second Amendment supporter would consider this a success," said Alexander Roubian, the president of the New Jersey Second Amendment Rights Society, a gun owners advocacy group. "If he walks into Iowa and New Hampshire with this report, he will be booed and kicked out of that state faster than he can believe it."

 

"It's saying Carol Bowne now has enough reason to apply for a concealed carry permit, but when she was alive, she didn't," said Roubian.

 

------

 

Bowne's brother, Mark Ehly, said he didn't agree with Christie's approach to merely broadening a citizen's access to carry permits after being attacked or threatened.

 

"My sister got murdered in her yard and she couldn't protect herself," said Ehly. "If you want to carry a gun, you should be able to carry a gun. I think everybody should be legit: If you're background's good, you should be able to carry. But it ain't worth applying for a gun in New Jersey, cause you're not gonna get it. "

 

 

I don't expect the governor to do anything more than he is authorized to do. You are the one saying support him and maybe he can do more. Let's see if any real changes comes out of this.

I'm not very optimistic, and as I've posted many times I absolutely DESPISE any subservience to or acceptance of justifiable need. It is a profoundly immoral and illogical policy. That's why I was against demonstrating it in the case of Mr. Almeida, etc. 

 

But imagine future consideration of CC in this state, after 5,000 ordinary citizens have been carrying for several years and not one was arrested for anything.

 

I'm not saying support him in any shape manner or form except when he does the right thing. But always engage the only hope you have for any positive change. 

Well said...can we wait and see what his final actions are before we go through the litany of usual b!tching ...good lord the defeatist attitudes here are alarming...imagine if throughout this nations history we were populated by people with this "oh well that's the way it is I'll just keep moving throughout my life to avoid the govt".. there are no safe havens anywhere anymore.. the fight is on nationwide... so again can we hold on just one freaking minute and see what the final outcome is here.

 

If Christie is gonna make one of the final 4 or 5 POTUS candidate spots... maybe he's waiting until he's on even more TV/debates to make some 2a moves here in NJ ...for the rest of the nationwide voters to see.

 

Sent from my SM-G920V using Tapatalk

It's not just defeatism, it's absolute childish hyperbole ("He's just as bad as...") and a deep-rooted unwillingness to try to win the argument or part of it. People who think that calling schoolyard names will get someone to do your bidding. Very sad.

UPDATED: http://www.nj.com/politics/index.ssf/2015/12/dems_gun_activists_blast_christies_concealed_carry.html#incart_river_home_pop

 

"Stat Sen. Loretta Weinberg (D-Bergen) said the commission's recommendations are merely "something for him to wave around to the New Hampshire voters." 

 

"We're dumbfounded that any Second Amendment supporter would consider this a success," said Alexander Roubian,

 

1. Anything that pisses off Loretta Weinberg can't be all bad. I'll take that cynical motive on Christie's behalf any day of the week over nothing. 

2. Speaking of which, what did that recall effort get NJ gun owners except for a refreshing shower on a very hot day?

1. Anything that pisses off Loretta Weinberg can't be all bad. I'll take that cynical motive on Christie's behalf any day of the week over nothing.

 

I agree. Her comment makes me wonder where she got her info for her smart gun law.

 

 

2. Speaking of which, what did that recall effort get NJ gun owners except for a refreshing shower on a very hot day?

Some regional and national attention and a spot on Sweeney's hit list.

 

I agree. Her comment makes me wonder where she got her info for her smart gun law.

 

... a spot on Sweeney's hit list.

1. You don't actually have to be smart to propose a smart-gun law. In fact it helps if you're stupid.

2. True dat. The next shower he provides us will be liquid doo-doo instead of water. 

Another update to that article:

 

ANJRPC -

 

We welcome Governor Christie's acceptance of these historic recommendations and thank the Governor for taking unprecedented action in support of Second Amendment rights," said Scott Bach, exec. director of the ANJRPC. "When fully implemented, these executive actions will make a real difference in the lives of law-abiding gun owners, without compromising the Governor's tough record going after violent criminals."

Wow. Seems to me that ANJRPC is the FUD of the NJ RKBA groups.

2. True dat. The next shower he provides us will be liquid doo-doo instead of water.

"Bryan Miller, executive director of the advocacy group Heeding God's Call to End Gun Violence, had a different take. The panel's recommendations "run directly contrary to the wishes of the overwhelming majority of New Jerseyans, but since he virtually moved out of the state months ago, Christie cares not what Garden Staters want," Miller said.

 

"Christie has ignored the great body of evidence that the state's gun laws work to reduce violence in favor of kowtowing to the demands of pro-gun extremists in another state. Shameful," he said."

 

Read more at http://www.philly.com/philly/news/new_jersey/20151222_Report__Revise_N_J__s__strict__gun_laws.html#367bygPVMqYEOTKs.99

 

------

 

I guess Bryan is OK with Ms. Bowne's death then?

 

SHAME!!!

 

Everyone here is crying about Christie, but has anyone though what will happen when a Dem gets elected in a few years. 10 round limit is certain, as is an assault weapons ban of any and all so called "assault rifles" with no grandfathering on either one. And that's just a start.