GRIZ

Checked with my Trooper friend. He didn't know the brands (thanks HE) but said they were having failures to extract with service and practice ammo. Practice ammo is brass case. He never had any problems with his issue gun but said there was a lot of failures to extract on the range with other guns. He's been issued a Glock 19. Runs fine with the same ammo. Everybody else's does too Sounds like a gun issue to me.

Maks, I think the ammo issue is speculation. I would be surprised if NJSP hadn't considered this. I have very limited experience with steel case ammo. What I've shot worked okay. I've shot at least several thousand rounds of aluminum case ammo. Extraction sometimes sticky with revolvers but no issues with 9mm and 45 ACP. Now that's in Glocks, Walthers, S&Ws, Taurus, Colts, H&Ks, and others. But no Sigs. If an ammo works fine in everything else I'd consider it a gun issue. JMO. Checking to see what NJSP uses for duty and practice ammo.

I don't think so. The bad guy had already broken through one door. If the victim hadn't had his bedroom door locked no doubt the BG would have been on top of him before he could do anything. That locked bedroom door is the only reason the victim wasn't brutally beaten. The victim didnt know if it was one BG or several. He made his presence known to whoever broke down his front door. How did the intruder(s) respond? By starting to break down the bedroom door. That door was most likely not as durable as the entrance door. Shooting through a door is generally not a good idea. I can't say the guy was totally wrong here. The fact that one door was already broken down and the BG was in the process of breaking down an interior door has a lot of bearing here. Where was the teacher supposed to retreat to? He was on the 3rd floor. He was reasonably in fear of his life or serious bodily harm AFAIC. I can't see a prosecutor in NJ trying to pursue this.

I wouldn't call it ragging. NJSP had problems with the guns. Sig acknowledged there was problems and tried several ways to fix it but they didn't work. Would you be satisfied?

If you want a decent looking shooter that should last the rest of your life you may want to consider a CMP Special Field Grade. I think they're about 800. New barrel, new stock, and pretty much a new looking M1. A friend bought a CMP Special and it looks as close to new as you'll get without spending many thousand dollars. If you have any issues with it CMP will fix it. Description says it will have some pitting above the wood line. CMP descriptions are usually pretty conservative to my experience. I hand picked a Field Grade a few years ago in the North Store. The only reason I can see it was a field grade is some wear on the receiver. It had all walnut wood, WW2 receiver, VAR barrel, measured a 2 at each end, and mostly Beretta parts. It's my best shooting M1.

We are discussing things on a forum. Not writing a history book. If I were I would double check my info. I guess you have never made a mistake. Okay I erred. However I corrected myself in the subsequent post. It was Colts not S&W. The fact is they had 10mm handguns. I took a hit for the 10mm MP5 although I may not be wrong. Yes, military and LE have different needs. Do you expect everyone on the House appropriations committee to understand them? If you recall correctly Sig won the first round of tests for the 9mm, they were cancelled and Beretta won the contract. Many strange things happen in government when you're asking for money to spend. The FBI of course never made a mistake. Back in the 70s their ammo tests showed the 95 gr RP JHP "high velocity" 38 load worked the best. That wasn't reflected in actual use though. My sources were guys involved in the testing. Yes, as the head of the firearms unit Hall okayed the final report. So it contained what he wanted. You can listen to him. You don't have to listen to my sources. Oh yes, to be clear. Sources say Mireles had a 686 and Platt a 586. Look at the Wiki entry for one. It really doesn't make a difference unless you're writing the investigation report. The finish has no effect on the gun's performance. Suffice it to say it was a L frame. We can agree on that. I'm guessing you've never been in a confrontational situation. You don't remember everything. There were no dash cams in those days. One has to reconstruct as best as possible from what people involved did. How are you so sure Platt was moving much more slowly when Mireles shot him? From the TV movie? Everything goes slow mo in a fight. You can look that up if you don't believe me. You can think I'm just an old man with short term memory issues and have no idea what he's talking about. And you would be wrong. As for cracked S&W frames I'm guessing you didn't look hard enough. I never said it was a common occurrence but common enough to be a concern. Just like the slide separations on M9s. I've never claimed to know everything. I'm too smart to say that. I don't know where you get off saying I have a pompous attitude. I never said I'm always right. If it makes you feel powerful and intelligent to do research to sharpshoot me on things that I'm recalling from 30 years ago have at it. A 4" 357 is the best all around handgun IMO. I never said you can deal with everything with it. Most things. Very good for SD against bad guys. I'd prefer something bigger if I had to contend with grizzlies for example. You like a 44 Magnum. That's okay but what do you base that selection on? A 44 mag has less recoil and muzzle blast than a 357? A 48 oz M29 shooting a 240 gr bullet has less recoil than a 45 oz GP100 shooting a 158 gr bullet? Does your 44 defy the laws of physics? If a 44 mag is the ideal handgun for SD why isn't there a single agency or organization that has EVER issued it as primary handgun? Are you basing your choice of a 44 on your extensive gunfighting experience? A full charge 44 is pretty much overkill as a SD handgun. You think a 9mm out of a 2" is a better round than a 38 +P. I dont. But I'm old so what can I know? Think what you want. I don't care. I'm old enough to know I can't please everyone. I've been that way for some time now.

I always encouraged my people to take a long gun when they were going out on something that had the potential to escalate. Not only for the firepower but the good guys having long guns increased the probability there would be no need for them. More than once I had a pair of bad guys with handguns surrender with no fight to 3 agents armed with a shotgun, subgun, and M4. They said they didn't fight because they felt they couldn't win. My favorite was a guy who looked at me with an AUG, threw up his hands and said "What's that you got? An AK 92?".

You are really asking the impossible IMO. If you want something great on the highway you have to give up off road capabilities and vice versa. Just look at some facets of what you're asking. Great highway tires suck off road. You want good ground clearance off road which raises your center of gravity. Not conducive to high speed handling. Suspension requirements are very differect for both applications. I could go on and on. Anytime you ask a vehicle to do more than one job with vastly different requirements it will excell at none of them. Most SUVs are designed more for the highway as that's where they spend 99% of their time. You can option up just about all of them and be far from spartan.

Howard, you said "full militarization of police". Having a long relationship with LE and the military the "full militarization of police" is way far from reality.

This is also an example of what can happen mixing drugs and alcohol. You may be a docile marijuana user and a happy drunk. Mix the two and you may become a raving lunatic.

Whoa, some of your info is wron too. Let's get this straightened out. I never said the FBI was using S&W 10mms when I first encountered them. The HRT guys I was working with carried Colt 1911 10mms. The guns the guys had were in production. I'm not imagining guns that weren't made yet. As far as the 10mm MP5 I could be mistaken. If it makes you feel better I'll take a hit for that. But it wouldn't be unusual for an agency to request some prototypes well before they went into production. Not a rare occurrence. I saw SEALS with prototype S&W 59s in Vietnam in 68-69 (I think they use Hi Power magazines). S&W also made stainless 59s for the Navy a few years before the 59 went into production. The information I have in regards to the 45 coming out #1 in FBI testing is from several reliable sources including FBI Agents assigned to the Firearms Unit at Quantico. I already told you why they didn't adopt it. You think they would get money to adopt a "new" caliber that DOD was abandoning? Yes, at one point FBI agents did carry 1911s. But this went away for the rank and file agent. HRT guys carried 1911s. Don't know if they still do. I also agree with something Ayoob said once. A 1911 might be the greatest combat handgun there is. LEOs use handguns for threat management more that combat shooting. A DA/SA, DAO, or striker fired semiautomatic is better for threat management and general issue to the troops. You do have one important fact correct. The 9mm Silvertip penetrated through Platt's arm, into his chest, taking out a chunk of his brachial artery, and stopped about an inch short of his heart (thats from the autopsy report). He was going to die from that. The 9mm Silvertip was designed to be a rapidly expanding low penetration round. It performed as it was designed. If it continued to penetrate his heart it's total speculation on whether that would have stopped the fight. I've seen people shot through the heart fight for 30-60 seconds, run 100-200 yds, and then drop dead. I know of a guy shot through the heart on 6th and 42nd in Manhattan, he ran a block over to 5th Avenue and dropped dead in front of the library. Yeah, Mireles was using a 686. Not the first time I made that error. More importantly he was using 38s. He was shooting Platt with it when Platt stopped fighting. One can argue which of the dozen or so wounds Platt succumbed to but he stopped fighting after he was hit with a 38. As for cracked frames on S&W 10mms Google "cracked 10mm frames". Your comment about using your handgun to fight your way to your rifle I always find entertaining. That sounds good from an instructor in a class you paid $1000 to attend. Having a rifle for a fight makes sense. Platt proved that. Nearly all LE and SD fights are right there, right now. You don't have time to fight your way to a rifle. The few seconds that transpire from start to finish don't allow time to "go for your rifle". When it's over there is no need to go for your rifle. You really need to get a 4" 357. Most versatile handgun made IMO.

Okay, the militarization of police gambit. You want police to be able to respond to something like the LA bank robbers clad in body armor or a Mubai or Paris type terrorist attack. They need rifles. No time to call out the SWAT team. A shotgun, 9mm, 45, or even a 38 (not a std velocity lead bullet) do well on car doors and windows. I concur with HE's statement.

Don't drink and smoke dope if you can't handle it. That's the moral to the story AFAIC. The guy broke down one door and from the story found himself in an empty room. He was so drunk (like .18) mixed with the effects of marijuana he didn't realize it wasn't his girlfriend's apartment. He then proceeded knock down the second door. Just about all of us have gotten drunk celebrating something. But not so drunk we didn't realize where we were. Something like this would have happened to this guy eventually with his alcohol and drug problem. The article fails to speculate on that. They want to get more mileage from "this young man with a promising future" than discuss his alcohol and drug problem.

I'll start with saying I never had any love for the 40 S&W. Most on this forum are too young to know the story how the 40 S&W came about. The FBI was using the 10mm a few years before it was officially adopted. I remember going on jobs with the FBI and some guys had 10mm S&Ws and 10mm MP5s in the mid 80s. The FBI started looking for a new standard handgun in the early 80s. They conducted their tests. The winner? Ready? 45 ACP! The FBI knew they couldn't go to Capitol Hill asking for money for new guns in a caliber another bigger part of government was abandoning. How could they justify going to a 45 when DOD was going for a 9mm. Reasons don't mean anything to Congress, most of which don't know anything about firearms. So the FBI went to adopt the #2 in their tests the 10mm. It didn't take them long to realize full power 10mm was too much. Not only for agents but for the guns. The full size S&Ws were having frame cracking problems. To alleviate this, plus buy time to pick a new gun and caliber, the FBI adopted a downloaded 10mm ammo that would reliably function the gun they had. They also started buying 3" Model 13 S&W 357s. They actually started doing this earlier as an option for agents who preferred a revolver. Agents were armed with them at the Miami Shootout in 86. It was actually one of these revolvers that ended the fight. 9mm Silvertip performed as it was supposed to and was not a failure IMO. That's another discussion though. Now we're in the late 80s. S&W have been selling 39s and 59s to a variety of LE agencies for almost 10 years. They flocked to the 9mm and American made (S&W) in the 80s. 45 was considered "too powerful". Few agencies wanted a caliber with "magnum" in the name. Ammo manufacturers catered to that by calling what they sold as "high velocity" as +P and created +P+ first for Treasury and now for everyone else. Again that's another story. S&W executed a brilliant engineering and marketing ploy. They realized they could duplicate the ballistics of the FBI 10mm load in a shorter case. More importantly the shorter case fit in the 9mm frames and slides. LE agencies sucked up the 40 as not only was it marginally more powerful than the 9mm but new S&W 40s fit the same holsters and mag pouches as the 9mms they had. IMO the 40 is not a great improvement over the 9mm. If I want something bigger I'll take a 45 thank you. I was sold on the 45 20 years before the 40 came out. It won't become as rare as the 357 SIG or 45 GAP. The 357 SIG is a 9mm magnum. If I need those ballistics I'll use a 357 magnum and be more versatile. The 45 GAP was a solution to a problem that didn't exist. The 40 S&W was more an effective marketing exercise for S&W. Never owned one, never will.

If it's a 38 short COLT you can shoot it in a 38 special. There are USPSA shooters who use 38 Short and 38 Long COLT brass to make powderpuff loads. If it is 38 S&W Short you can't shoot it from a 38 special. The case is fatter and shouldn't even chamber in a 38 special.

You may not believe what I say has no bearing because I'm not a "NJ cop". Let me enlighten you. I was a "NJ cop" before I went to the Federal government and yes that was some time ago. We had Task Force Officers (TFOs) assigned to my office in Newark. These were state, county, and local LEOs assigned to my office. They were sworn in and had the same powers I did. What did the agency get in return? We paid their overtime and the agency got asset sharing. How much could their agency get for asset sharing? NJSP got over $1,000,000 one year I'm aware of for having one Trooper assigned to my office. That paid his salary and let NJSP collect the change. There were many times we encountered state violations where there was no comparable Federal law. TFOs usually would make those arrests and make those cases. The US Attorney's Office would decline prosecution on some cases for various reasons. If there was a comparable state law I would make the arrest and see the prosecution through the state courts. Federal officers have full police powers in NJ. My knowledge of NJ state criminal law and the judicial system is a lot more than you think. Federal LEOs do not pursue enforcing state laws but if it happens it happens. You are right in saying what I say or even a "NJ cop" tells you means nothing if you get picked up. I can tell you about some more pretty much worthless advice. If you get arrested and tell the cop, "Evan Nappen said this was okay" it wont help you either. I've dealt with at least several hundred lawyers in my time. Unless something is very clear in the law and you ask a lawyer for advice they will tell you not to do it. Yes, prosecutors make the decision to prosecute a case. Guess where they get there input? From cops. Do some cases get thrown out because there is not enough probable cause? Sure that happens rarely. Cops don't make their careers by making bum arrests. It is the prosecutor's duty to pursue a case as long as there is probable cause and the evidence was obtained legally. To do anything else is malfeasance or nonfeasance depending how it is done. Yes, there are things like plea bargaining and PTI which are designed to let a prosecutor clear his or her case load for not so serious offenses and offenders. So yes, what I say will not help you if you get arrested. But neither will anything told to you by an attorney. I think I've eliminated some of the "many reasons" you claim one should not listen to what I say.

Undoubtedly!!!!

Okay, please show me someone who got 5-10 years or even 5-10 days for leaving a locked up gun at a relative's house. Trump is required to take compensation by the COTUS. I quess one needs the $1 a year lease if they are worried about getting kicked out. What you say is true but I feel unnecessary. Why do you think the FFL thing is different? The FFL thing is only for you to transport guns to and from. It's not a transfer. You are the only one to have a key.Otherwise you would need P2Ps, COEs, and 4473s. It's just like you rented a storage locker. A transfer would denote use. If the gun is locked up there is no use. Your Tavor is a totally different issue. There's no one who has been prosecuted for 922r BTW.

Mrs Peel, not to worry. I've met Zeke and Mrs Zeke socially and Mrs Zeke is very adept at keeping him under control.

Please stop with the phony baloney $1 lease stuff. As far as storing a firearm in a locked container at a relative's house. I don't see a problem there. It's not a transfer. The relative has no access to the firearm if its locked up. It's not a transfer when you leave your guns at home and youre gone for a week is it? When you store firearms at one of these FFLS that rent you storage space it's not a transfer. I can see why it would be different. Reasonable deviation? That's up to interpretation. However, in 45 years of owning guns in NJ I have never heard of anyone arrested because they made an "unreasonable deviation" going to or coming from a range. If anyone knows of such an incident, please enlighten me. I've asked that question numerous times on this forum since it started and no one has been able to come up with one. IANAL, but I think too many over think the reasonable deviation issue.

https://www.leopulse.com/jobs/view/border-patrol-agent-direct-hire-16378?utm_content=buffera6d5a&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer For those looking for a LE career and a way out of NJ the Border Patrol is hiring for positions on SW Border. FWIW the maximum age is now 40. Used to be 37.

If it's a handgun purchased on a NJ permit or if you voluntarily reqistered it. When I had a only a few guns I kept a list of serial numbers in my wallet and at home. I've kept an inventory on an Excel spreadsheet on my hard drive for years. I print out a copy, email a copy to my daughters, and save a copy on my phone. I understand why many keep P2P and COE copies. I dont. I've never sold or bought a gun from anyone who seemed to be a questionable character.

So true. Too many think they can buy their way into being great long range shooters. There's not much difference between a $500 Savage with a $200 scope and a $10,000 combination in the right hands. The rifles Carlos Hathcock used for his amazing shots were only capable of about 2 minutes of angle accuracy. A $500 Savage does better than that now.

I joined a few years ago when it was considerably less expensive. Being retired I usually go during the week and make one less person showing up on weekends. Tuesday there were 5 people on the General Purpose Range and that was it. It was down to two when I left. I've been there in beautiful weather during the week and I'm the only person there. The term "long range" is relative. Many have never shot ARs and AKs farther than 25 yds on an indoor range. Most of my needs can be met with a 300 yd range. I can understand there are few, very few, who need more.

If you don't know someone who's a member and want to look around the easiest way to look around is on a match day. Best is to shoot the match and you'll have plenty of people there to answer quustions.