You can always get a BHP in .40

 

That's sacrilege.

That's sacrilege.

 

Agreed. Would make a nice L10 gun though.

blah, sorry jon, you want a nice l10......

Yea yea yea, we're not all able to dump 4k on an SVI.

Yea yea yea, we're not all able to dump 4k on an SVI.

Or wait a year to get one. =)

 

Used market = winning.

Get a Glock 23 Gen4. Best all around size to weight to capacity to reliability to function to simplicity to trigger available. Don't worry about the 40s&w being "to snappy" , you will get used to it. I swear, when it comes to 40s&w everyone seems to turn into a sissy wrist. .357 magnum revolver, now that's recoil, or a airweight J frame 38 special, that makes 40s&w seem like a cream puff.

 

Don't let the 40s&w naysayers scare you. There is good reason why 80% of LE agencies use 40s&w.

Get a Glock 23 Gen4. Best all around size to weight to capacity to reliability to function to simplicity to trigger available. Don't worry about the 40s&w being "to snappy" , you will get used to it. I swear, when it comes to 40s&w everyone seems to turn into a sissy wrist. .357 magnum revolver, now that's recoil, or a airweight J frame 38 special, that makes 40s&w seem like a cream puff.

 

Don't let the 40s&w naysayers scare you. There is good reason why 80% of LE agencies use 40s&w.

 

Yes, they were conned into it by Mfr. =) with free or dirt cheap guns.

There is a reason why alot are going to 45 or 9 now.

 

 

 

There is a reason why alot are going to 45 or 9 now.

 

is that a general trend now? Where can I read about it ? which agencies already switched ?

there was one here recently posted, glock 22's to m&p 45's

 

a few other agencies.

 

Then you have the military contract, they are looking for a 45 to replace the 9mm. Will have to look at various articles.

there was one here recently posted, glock 22's to m&p 45's

 

a few other agencies.

 

Then you have the military contract, they are looking for a 45 to replace the 9mm. Will have to look at various articles.

 

The interesting thing about .45 vs .40, is that there is not much a difference in recoil. Everyone preaches how the .45 is a sweet shooter or it pushes instead of snaps. I say BS, I shoot a Glock 21 along side a Glock 23 all the time and feel the recoil or kick is about the same. Are the ballistics of a 45 better than the 40?, all depends how you look at it, but they are pretty close. Personally, in a duty weapon id rather have 15rds of 40 than 10rds of 45 anyday.

 

The military will not be replacing the 9mm anytime soon. That rumor has been around a long time. Just the cost alone to replace all those Beretta M9's will prohibit that from happening.

Yes, they were conned into it by Mfr. =) with free or dirt cheap guns.

 

I thought they were conned into Glocks, not actually .40s&w?

The interesting thing about .45 vs .40, is that there is not much a difference in recoil. Everyone preaches how the .45 is a sweet shooter or it pushes instead of snaps. I say BS, I shoot a Glock 21 along side a Glock 23 all the time and feel the recoil or kick is about the same. Are the ballistics of a 45 better than the 40?, all depends how you look at it, but they are pretty close. Personally, in a duty weapon id rather have 15rds of 40 than 10rds of 45 anyday.

 

The military will not be replacing the 9mm anytime soon. That rumor has been around a long time. Just the cost alone to replace all those Beretta M9's will prohibit that from happening.

 

Everyone's experience will be different for sure. It's not so much a 45 kicks less, it kicks differently. Probably takes

at least a few hundred rounds side by side though to really tell a difference. Personally I do not like 40sw, but love

45acp.

 

To the OP, Shoreshot I believe has every single gun listed for rent and I think in 40. If you rent and stay within the

same caliber they only charge you one rental fee. It is a separate fee only if you change calibers. Mention you're

a NJGunForum member and I believe pistols are only 10 bucks to rent. You will have to buy their ammo but it is

worth it to find out what you really want.

I don't think anybody should be using a glock as a reference for recoil. It is obviously only able to compared to polymer guns. Apples to apples.

diamon, the problem is.... not the round, but the make of the gun. a Glock 21 should not be the gold standard of shooting 45's. I recently shot an M&P 45, and it was just a joy to shoot, might I add a bit nicer than shooting 45 out of an hk 45, and seemed to cycle a bit faster than most factory 1911's I have played with.

 

Go shoot a a few back to back. I know there is a difference when wifey, who is sensitive to recoil, asks me to load more mags for a baby eagle 45 (factory loads) because she enjoys shooting it.

 

I am not crapping on glocks or even going to go say that they are not reliable, not withstanding gen 4 issues, but you will be hard pressed to find someone who will genuinely say that a glock 21 or glock 23 is a joy to shoot box after box over the tons and tons of competitors.

 

The one glock that I will say was a joy to shoot is my Glock 37, shooting hand loaded 230 grain 45 gap loads. Unfortunately, it still could not help overcome the fact that it had the ergonomics of a brick.

I don't think anybody should be using a glock as a reference for recoil. It is obviously only able to compared to polymer guns. Apples to apples.

 

But we are talking about going from 40 to 45 in Poly frame pistols (Glock 22 to M&P 45). I don't think any department will be outfitting personnel with steel frame 1911's anytime soon.

 

 

 

diamon, the problem is.... not the round, but the make of the gun. a Glock 21 should not be the gold standard of shooting 45's. I recently shot an M&P 45, and it was just a joy to shoot, might I add a bit nicer than shooting 45 out of an hk 45, and seemed to cycle a bit faster than most factory 1911's I have played with.

 

Go shoot a a few back to back. I know there is a difference when wifey, who is sensitive to recoil, asks me to load more mags for a baby eagle 45 (factory loads) because she enjoys shooting it.

 

I am not crapping on glocks or even going to go say that they are not reliable, not withstanding gen 4 issues, but you will be hard pressed to find someone who will genuinely say that a glock 21 or glock 23 is a joy to shoot box after box over the tons and tons of competitors.

 

The one glock that I will say was a joy to shoot is my Glock 37, shooting hand loaded 230 grain 45 gap loads. Unfortunately, it still could not help overcome the fact that it had the ergonomics of a brick.

 

I really can't see a M&P 45 having less recoil than a Glock 21. The Glock 21 has a larger and heavier slide. Not to mention I have the Gen 4 with the new dual recoil setup. You must just like the ergos better. The Baby Eagle, sure, it is a big heavy steel gun, correct?

 

BTW, I enjoy shooting box after box through the 23 and 21 and 19.

But we are talking about going from 40 to 45 in Poly frame pistols (Glock 22 to M&P 45). I don't think any department will be outfitting personnel with steel frame 1911's anytime soon.

 

 

 

 

 

I really can't see a M&P 45 having less recoil than a Glock 21. The Glock 21 has a larger and heavier slide. Not to mention I have the Gen 4 with the new dual recoil setup. You must just like the ergos better. The Baby Eagle, sure, it is a big heavy steel gun, correct?

 

BTW, I enjoy shooting box after box through the 23 and 21 and 19.

 

 

Have you shot or owned anything other than glocks?

 

Go shoot an M&P, Hk P30/45, etc. You will be amazed there are fantastic peoples once you drop the Glock Kool Aide. =)

 

Baby eagle is a semi compact steel 45. It is not a big big gun.

 

Xd 45 is also quite enjoyable to shoot.

Have you shot or owned anything other than glocks?

 

Go shoot an M&P, Hk P30/45, etc. You will be amazed there are fantastic peoples once you drop the Glock Kool Aide. =)

 

 

 

What I have owned, shot, and sold.

 

Beretta 92 Vertec (sold)

Bereta 92 Compact (sold)

Beretta 92 (sold)

Beretta 96 Inox (sold)

Beretta PX4 40 Full Size Type G (for sale soon)

Beretta PX4 SubCompact 9mm type G (sold)

 

Glock 21 Gen 3 (selling)

Glock 21 Gen 4

Glock 23 Gen 4

Glock 19 Gen 4

Glock 27 Gen 3 (sold)

 

S&W 686 Plus

S&W 642-2

S&W M&P40 (sold)

S&W M&P40C

 

Colt 1911 Defender (sold)

 

Kimber 1911 (sold)

 

SIgs & HK = never could bring myself to pay a $200-$400 premium for guns that do nothing better. Also, I am no longer a fan of DA/SA triggers.

 

XD's = if I want a grip safety ill just buy another 1911. And they are ugly.

 

CZ = Again, no longer a fan of DA/SA

 

Baby Eagle/Desert Eagle = dont know anything about them, except I can get a autoloading 44mag.

 

 

Do you hate everything Glock?

Never said I hate glock. All I said is don't drink the Glock Kool Aide. They make nice handguns, but there are far better alternatives out there. I owned a few glocks, 37, 23, 26.

 

Go shoot sigs, hk's, there is reason why they cost more, they are worth it. In the same price range, CZ's, Sig Polymers, FNH, Springfields. Come out to an event, and ask to shoot some guns. And yes... M&P 45 feels so much better than a 21.

 

You won't know till you actually shoot them. =)

 

The only guns I really really don't like are Ruger polymer guns, they look nice, but don't like the triggers, at all.

I've got a smattering of a variety pistols. Currently, in .40, I own a Gen 4 G23, M&P40F and a CZ75SA. I've owned and sold a Beretta 96 Centurian and a Gen3 G22. I've shot a variety of P series Sigs as well.

 

The G4 G23 and M&P are my current fav's. Recoil, while a bit more stout than 9mm, is doable and w/ practice, controllable as well. I would say for a new manufacture .40, either Glock or M&P. If you're willing to go used, consider P series Sigs as well. I currently have a purchaser's permit and I'm somewhere between a Gen4 G19, G21, G22, G35 or another M&P w/ thumb safety. I will say this though. IMHO, the M&P is not the best out of the box pistol I've ever had. If you're willing to polish the trigger related internals and add some flavor of aftermarket or Pro sear ( I have the Apex sear), the gun gets, or rather the trigger gets really nice. Also, for me, I had to do some sanding on the grip to get a better handhold on the grip. In my mind, the leading attribute of the M&P is the controllability in shooting quickly. At just under a "rapid fire" pace (since the Bullet Hole doesn't allow rapid fire), the M&P blows just about everything else out of the water in front sight tracking and controllability. I find the Glock to be more accurate though. The Glock, aside from night sights, doesn't need anything. Having said that, I put in a smooth face trigger and also polished the internals. I've owned and sold a couple of XD's. Wouldn't get another one.

 

I see some folks say that .40 is more expensive, and if you shop at your local gun store, it is. However, look at places like SG Ammo. They typically have contract overruns on .40 in FMJ and top tier defensive ammo that are cheaper than what you can get 9mm for.

Have you ever rented one? It snaps your wrist & is really loud. if you don't like 38 super, 357 sig or 357 mag, 44 mags, you won't like this one