Not only that, whats up with that lady she like moves 6 inches over, you would think she would head to the other side of the room..

 

Was my other thought as well. She didn't flinch or anything. Maybe she's used to it?

Why not this video then? Which is just as popular?

 

 

This one works just as well for the argument as well. Of course the argument would have to be slightly different because not everyone is allowed to have a holstered gun at every range, so you would have to argue that "One guy shooting himself is no reason to taking guns away from thousands of others that do handle a firearm safely." In the way I was presenting videos I would title this one "Probably why you shouldn't practice holster draws at a range" The fact that they are LEO or non-LEO has nothing to do with the argument. I do not see LEO or non-LEO as any different.

ok

 

 

My first thought when I watched that I'm surprised he didn't get charged with endangering the welfare of a child. He was firing only a few feet away from the poor kid.

 

Good for the shooter to stop the perp, but with a woman and a child, i would have just given the money and let it be personally. But to each's own. If he trusts his abilities that much, more power to him.

 

What if there was return fire. These are the things you have to take into account when starting a firefight in public areas. You have to be smart about consequences to each action. Glad it worked out ok but if the child was hit by either party he'd be crucified. Bad decision IMO

I never understand the analogy with a firearm and a car.

I would choose concealed , hands down. Unless you're Ricochet Rabbit I'm thinking you are at more of an advantage if they do not know you are armed.

 

And IMO , in that video , that mother seems too casual until the clerk starts firing. If someone comes in waving a gun , I'm not picturing myself just sitting there with my kid on the counter like she is waiting for a lolly from the teller. The woman seemed to not notice anything until the clerk was firing at the BG . Weird.

I would choose concealed , hands down. Unless you're Ricochet Rabbit I'm thinking you are at more of an advantage if they do not know you are armed.

 

And IMO , in that video , that mother seems too casual until the clerk starts firing. If someone comes in waving a gun , I'm not picturing myself just sitting there with my kid on the counter like she is waiting for a lolly from the teller. The woman seemed to not notice anything until the clerk was firing at the BG . Weird.

 

You are right.

What if there was return fire. These are the things you have to take into account when starting a firefight in public areas. You have to be smart about consequences to each action. Glad it worked out ok but if the child was hit by either party he'd be crucified. Bad decision IMO

 

Good point. I didn't even think of the perp firing and accidentally hitting the kid or woman. If the perp decided to open fire rather than run it would have become a story of tragedy rather than a story of a guy fighting back against a robber.

Thats why if you are concealed you can choose when to enter the fight vs. someone makes you enter the fight.

Here are other reasons why you probably shouldn't open carry...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Harassment.

 

 

About 5-7 LEOs a year get killed by their own sidearm. It usually works out to about 10%. Small percentage sure but sucks to be one of them.

 

I don't know how many get their gun snatched. It used to be more common before retention training and holsters became commonplace. If you look at photos of NYPD in the 60s and 70s when they wore that swivel holster with the cilp that held the trigger guard you'll see many guys wearing their gun so it lays on their right (or left) thigh.

 

Cops don't get their guns grabbed because somebody decides it must be a good idea to rob them. Cops get their guns grabbed because people don't want the cop to send them to jail.

I never understood OPEN carrying.

 

Depending on where in the country you are I will agree, however I would like to see in all states that allow CCW to also allow OC, just for that chance you print or somehow someone sees your CCW. Just protect from that, and it's a choice thing.

I always carry and my wife doesnt even know most times that I am.

 

Been married a while, huh??

Almost 5 years in August

Good luck with your tactics.

About 5-7 LEOs a year get killed by their own sidearm. It usually works out to about 10%. Small percentage sure but sucks to be one of them.

 

I don't know how many get their gun snatched. It used to be more common before retention training and holsters became commonplace. If you look at photos of NYPD in the 60s and 70s when they wore that swivel holster with the cilp that held the trigger guard you'll see many guys wearing their gun so it lays on their right (or left) thigh.

 

When you say 10%, that means 10% of all LEO shootings are with their own gun? That seems like an awful big percentage to me. I would guess that few guns were "snatched" before being used to shoot the LEO, versus LEO being overpowered and then having his gun stolen and turned on him. Any thoughts?

Not a fan of open carry but I would prefer that over no carry. Ideally ccw is the best of both worlds. Hurt feelings report has been saved and will be used at work in the very near future.

Not a fan of open carry but I would prefer that over no carry. Ideally ccw is the best of both worlds.

 

My take was that the incident in the op happened before Wisconsin passed concealed carry, so the guy didn't have the option. And he was actively advocating that option.

I never understood OPEN carrying.

 

Me neither. Paint a big ole' target on yourself.

 

 

Cops don't get their guns grabbed because somebody decides it must be a good idea to rob them. Cops get their guns grabbed because people don't want the cop to send them to jail.

 

Exactly. Cops open carry is not the same as a civilian open carry. The numbers of people stealing guns from a cop is irrelevant.

Depending on where in the country you are I will agree, however I would like to see in all states that allow CCW to also allow OC, just for that chance you print or somehow someone sees your CCW. Just protect from that, and it's a choice thing.

 

Very good point. Whether open carry is the best option for your own personal safety is a subject worthy of discussion. But if a state allows ccw they should allow oc, because it is beneficial to those who ccw. It should be your choice how you want to carry your firearm. I was reading about gun laws in TX, you can't open carry in TX. I can't find the site where I read this but basically it was Texas gun owners talking about how they ran into legal issues because there ccw was prinitng. It wasn't a few people complaing either, it was at least 2 forum pages of people running into this same legal issue.

how many people open carry on a daily basis..

how many have been held up and had their guns taken..

of those how many would CCW have helped..

 

the reality is if you are a complete idiot carrying openly or concealed is not going to help you..

people get a nice high end IWB holster... nice gun.. loaded up with SD ammo.. put it in the lower back.. snap some pics post them on the interwebs and feel safe and secure.. they are armed.. and ready..

how many do you think practice falling to the ground and drawing and shooting?

how many you think can even draw while on their backs?

how many you think practice shooting targets at point blank range?

how many have taken self defense training to handle retaining a weapon in a struggle?

 

I am sure police shootings occur yards away.. unfortunately I think civilian shootings would be far closer.. I am not going to shoot someone unless I am afraid for my life.. I assume more often that not that would involve a weapon in my face..

 

it is easy to say open carry is dangerous.. and risky.. but countless individuals do it every day..

how many were NOT robbed because there was a gun on their hip..

I think everyone should be able to CCW or Open carry. Thats not the issue I have. I just think in my Professional Opinion that it is a bad idea from a tactical standpoint.

I think everyone should be able to CCW or Open carry. Thats not the issue I have. I just think in my Professional Opinion that it is a bad idea from a tactical standpoint.

 

Totally agree. As civilians, we're painting a target on our backs. We become target number 1. Plus having the bad guys never sure of who's carrying is a nice deterrent. However, I do like Open Carry because it can provide some legal cover in case we inadvertently flash our CCW weapon or a breeze blows open a shirt. It just gives us some legal cover when CCWing.

Kevin (speicalK) is 100% correct.

About 5-7 LEOs a year get killed by their own sidearm. It usually works out to about 10%.

 

??? so, there are 50-70 cops?

??? so, there are 50-70 cops?

 

LOL math ftw..

Main reason I wouldn't open carry is cause I wouldn't want to be harassed by authorities

or get looks from people. I know some people feel the need to make a statement by

carrying open (not all people, just some people) but not me. If it were legal I'd definitely

carry concealed.

Here it is in a nutshell. You don't like open carry, then don't do it! But don't tell me that I can't (theoretically, of course) because you think it's dangerous or whatever.

I think everyone should be able to CCW or Open carry. Thats not the issue I have. I just think in my Professional Opinion that it is a bad idea from a tactical standpoint.

Here it is in a nutshell. You don't like open carry, then don't do it! But don't tell me that I can't (theoretically, of course) because you think it's dangerous or whatever.

 

No one said you cant (theoretically, of course). Being a Firearms Instructor it is my professional opinion that it is not a great idea, however people are more than welcome to carry however they wish.