I always thought I would always buy a American, my 1st new car was a Chrysler Sebring, LOOKED GREAT, but the side panels fell off every 2 months and the aluminum rims bent every 30,000 miles, awfully engineered car. My next car was a Lincoln Aviator, LOOKED GREAT, but was a piece of garbage, transmission blew at 14,000 miles, cylinders started going at 50,000 miles, I was driving on route 80 and twice the car shut off at 65mph, customer service was awful.

 

My next 2 cars, Lexus and an Acura, and I will never buy another car that isnt one of these brands. My MDX currently has 160,000 miles on it, never broke down and I have only changed the oil, replaced fluids and timing belt. Best investment ever.

 

When I heard about the 5,000 in pension $ buried in GM cars and then the bailout so Obama can pay back the unions, I will never buy a GM product ever. Why pay $5000 more than a car is worth? Why support Unions when there $ will go to the Democrats and they will support gun bans.

Well since the door is open, unions support democrats, democrats are anti gun, that is going to cause conflict, like it or not, some of us gun lovers can carry, can have assault guns, etc. , and the rest of us cannot, some will pass it of as a job perk where others will say the second amendment right is being denied to those who cant carry or own those other guns. Yes we all say we love guns, but in such an injust state conflicts over these facts will happen. How about those mets?

Well since the door is open, unions support democrats, democrats are anti gun, that is going to cause conflict, like it or not, some of us gun lovers can carry, can have assault guns, etc. , and the rest of us cannot, some will pass it of as a job perk where others will say the second amendment right is being denied to those who cant carry or own those other guns. Yes we all say we love guns, but in such an injust state conflicts over these facts will happen. How about those mets?

 

That has been my point for a long time about this forum's attempt to limit political speech when 90% of the problems we have as gun owners are a direct result of, you guessed it, politics. I'm not Democrat or Republican; I am a Libertarian and I'm sick of the left and the right. I use the gun issue as a litmus test. How people relate to guns tells you everything you need to know about their political ideology and whether or not they believe in a sovereign people's ability to live their lives free of government or not. I for one could give a rat’s ass about issues like gay marriage because as far as I am concerned marriage is a function of the church, the government should have no role regarding it what so ever. I love how libtards love to talk about "the separation of church and state" yet want the state involved in marriage, gay or otherwise, which throughout history has always been a function of the church. I'm also a big fan of the "right to choose", If libtards want to eradicate their next generation of libtarded children who am I to try to stop them. My personal belief is more of a right to life position but I don't feel compelled to force my belief on others. Imaging where we would be today if all those libtards that aborted their kids over the last 40 years raised them as good little Democrat voting libtards, we wouldn't be so much as allowed to look at pictures of guns today, you know, zero tolerance, from the self-proclaimed educated, enlightened and tolerant crowd. Just sayin'.

 

 

That has been my point for a long time about this forum's attempt to limit political speech when 90% of the problems we have as gun owners are a direct result of, you guessed it, politics. I'm not Democrat or Republican; I am a Libertarian and I'm sick of the left and the right. I use the gun issue as a litmus test. How people relate to guns tells you everything you need to know about their political ideology and whether or not they believe in a sovereign people's ability to live their lives free of government or not. I for one could give a rat’s ass about issues like gay marriage because as far as I am concerned marriage is a function of the church, the government should have no role regarding it what so ever. I love how libtards love to talk about "the separation of church and state" yet want the state involved in marriage, gay or otherwise, which throughout history has always been a function of the church. I'm also a big fan of the "right to choose", If libtards want to eradicate their next generation of libtarded children who am I to try to stop them. My personal belief is more of a right to life position but I don't feel compelled to force my belief on others. Imaging where we would be today if all those libtards that aborted their kids over the last 40 years raised them as good little Democrat voting libtards, we wouldn't be so much as allowed to look at pictures of guns today, you know, zero tolerance, from the self-proclaimed educated, enlightened and tolerant crowd. Just sayin'.

 

Quite wrong. If you want to discuss politics, become a premier member and do it respectfully. Like it or not, many people I know here personally share different views, even on guns. While someone's view on guns may be a common trait that other Libertarians, Conservatives or other share, there are plenty of people Pro gun, but also are for having a larger government more involved with their lives.... much like someone else I know, granted not on the forum, who is a gay african american, who is also a conservative republican and all for the 2a. go figure.

 

Your blinded view is why people paint a lot of gun owners as they do. I would encourage you to really go out and view each issue individually and form your opinion on the overall person, and not how they react to one issue.

 

Btw, if you want to discuss politics, there are plenty of other forums for that.

So we have to pay you now to use our freedom of speech on a gun forum? Wow is all I can say!

Here we go again...

So we have to pay you now to use our freedom of speech on a gun forum? Wow is all I can say!

 

Try posting a video of Feinstein saying she wants every gun in America. That'll get deleted. Or find stuff that takes the credibility away of people insulting you. Yup that gets deleted

Also I'm proud to say I'm a union member.

 

http://www.nj.com/gloucester-county/index.ssf/2012/07/local_labor_unions_make_a_stat.html?mobRedir=false

 

Try posting a video of Feinstein saying she wants every gun in America. That'll get deleted. Or find stuff that takes the credibility away of people insulting you. Yup that gets deleted

. Ya they do delete a lot of things even simple answers.

So we have to pay you now to use our freedom of speech on a gun forum? Wow is all I can say!

 

 

Oh please. Are you friggin' serious. You're basically in someone's house here. You have no "rights" here. You're to operate in the confines of this forums rules and those of it's owners. Your freedom on speech on this forum (and every other forum in the country) is limited by the forums rules set forth by the owner(s), as it should be. Follow the rules or go elsewhere to "exercise your rights".

Oh please. Are you friggin' serious. You're basically in someone's house here. You have no "rights" here. You're to operate in the confines of this forums rules and those of it's owners. Your freedom on speech on this forum (and every other forum in the country) is limited by the forums rules set forth by the owner(s), as it should be. Follow the rules or go elsewhere to "exercise your rights".

^^^This

 

So we have to pay you now to use our freedom of speech on a gun forum? Wow is all I can say!

Radek is that you?

So we have to pay you now to use our freedom of speech on a gun forum? Wow is all I can say!

 

Why is it there are so many people who don't grasp the concept of freedom of speech. You can say whatever you want. No guarantee is made to provide you with a venue, an audience, or freedom from consequences resulting from what you say.

 

You are guest in someone else's venue. You live by their rules or you pay rent for the venue.

+111 on the above. We are guests here. and what the devil anyway, I thought this was a "gun forum". Let's face it democrats and republicans, union and non-union, will never agree. It's what makes the world go round.

What a catastrophe it would be if there were monolithic agreement. Opposition is key to avoiding a complete spiraling.

 

As far as the forums go. Their house, their rules. Don't like it? Move along. Anyone with that big of a problem with it isn't contributing in a meaningful way and won't be missed anyway.

+111 on the above. We are guests here. and what the devil anyway, I thought this was a "gun forum". Let's face it democrats and republicans, union and non-union, will never agree. It's what makes the world go round.

 

Until they take it all away from you, And then it will all go to the white house!! Unless they paint the f@*%#r PINK..

Why were the pensions underfunded?...top executives making 7 figure salaries + bonuses had nothing to do with that, along with several 50 million dollar G-5 corporate jets..because you know those white collar guys cant fly commercial.. Nope its those evil UAW's who are merely depending on a penion to live their lives after their working years have passed..big problem in this country is too many people think their poop dont stink

It went (or maybe still goes) well beyond just the top executives. I have plenty of experience dealing with GM people of all levels. Everyone I saw working at GM was spolied, even the assistants to mid level execs. When they would come out from Detroit for the NY Auto Show they would spend an absurd amount of money. "How does 50 rooms for 5 nights each at The Penninsula Hotel off 5th Ave sound guys?" At $500+ a night per each of those 50 rooms you can imagine how it adds up. Now they can't just eat anywhere. They need to be loaded into a dozen Escalades and driven into Williamsburg so they can eat at Peter Luger's. Don't forget the petty cash since they don't take credit. Now when it was time to go back to the hotel those Escalades were waiting for them. At $125/hour for each car/driver. Yup thats well over $4k just for transportation to dinner and back, not including the Luger bill. Everywhere they went it was spend spend spend and nothing but the best. The examples can go on for ever. Waste was always the order of the day and it would not surprise me at all if it still was. Then they get bailed out so they can produce "American cars" made in Mexico with European components. Having said all that I still feel that the Z06, ZR1 and CTS-V are some of the funnest cars I ever tore around in. Not all of their products are crap but many of them are.

Now ya went and did it....I have Peter Lugers on the brain! STEAK--with an ATTITUDE! (just like this thread, lol).......

Quite wrong. If you want to discuss politics, become a premier member and do it respectfully. Like it or not, many people I know here personally share different views, even on guns. While someone's view on guns may be a common trait that other Libertarians, Conservatives or other share, there are plenty of people Pro gun, but also are for having a larger government more involved with their lives.... much like someone else I know, granted not on the forum, who is a gay african american, who is also a conservative republican and all for the 2a. go figure.

 

Your blinded view is why people paint a lot of gun owners as they do. I would encourage you to really go out and view each issue individually and form your opinion on the overall person, and not how they react to one issue.

 

Btw, if you want to discuss politics, there are plenty of other forums for that.

 

My point is that I'm tired of twits on the left and right trying to pass laws to save us from ourselves because they know what is best for all of us. As far as guns, no other issue is more clear-cut with respect to freedom, responsibility and our safety/security. No other issue is more politically charged between left brain and right brain thinking. The analogies I present are not for debate, they are to expose how I apply similar logic on almost every issue considering I believe you are free to do and behave as you wish understanding that your rights end where the rights of other's begin.

 

Leave us the hell alone sums up my politics, if you want to marry your cat then go find a church that will do it and I'm fine with that, have fun. Want "free" healthcare there are plenty of other government run systems to choose from, if you can't find one acceptable enough that you would want to move there that should be a good hint for you. Just stop trying to get a simple majority of self-serving asstard legislators or justices to pass or conjure-up laws and rights that force the rest of us to bear some sort of financial burden for your particular crusade. If something is so overwhelmingly important for the survival of our republic there is a process defined for creating Constitutional amendments that would be the proper course of action. If that process seems too insurmountable that is a good indication of how unnecessary that particular issue is for the nation as a whole.

 

Call it a blinded view but frankly I'm just tired of everyone trying to force everyone else to live under their version of America then sending us the bill at the point of a gun all the while wondering in sunned bewilderment how we have become so polarized and why we can't all just get along. I tend to think of my position as more epiphionic having seen the big picture of the arguments on both the left and the right and realizing they are both two heads of the same disingenuous coin, call it a red pill moment if you like.

 

This is not how it was supposed to work and I don't care what issue you pick, guns, healthcare, prescription drugs, recreational drugs, healthcare, marriage, religion, etc. we would all be a hell of a lot better off if we all just got our benevolent federal government the hell out of the business of telling us what is best for us collectively. Most of these issues are not addressed in our Constitution and are best reserved for the states to experiment/regulate thus allowing the people to vote with their feet when they feel they have been overburdened.

This is not how it was supposed to work and I don't care what issue you pick, guns, healthcare, prescription drugs, recreational drugs, healthcare, marriage, religion, etc. we would all be a hell of a lot better off if we all just got our benevolent federal government the hell out of the business of telling us what is best for us collectively. Most of these issues are not addressed in our Constitution and are best reserved for the states to experiment/regulate thus allowing the people to vote with their feet when they feel they have been overburdened.

+1000

 

It went (or maybe still goes) well beyond just the top executives. I have plenty of experience dealing with GM people of all levels. Everyone I saw working at GM was spolied, even the assistants to mid level execs. When they would come out from Detroit for the NY Auto Show they would spend an absurd amount of money. "How does 50 rooms for 5 nights each at The Penninsula Hotel off 5th Ave sound guys?" At $500+ a night per each of those 50 rooms you can imagine how it adds up. Now they can't just eat anywhere. They need to be loaded into a dozen Escalades and driven into Williamsburg so they can eat at Peter Luger's. Don't forget the petty cash since they don't take credit. Now when it was time to go back to the hotel those Escalades were waiting for them. At $125/hour for each car/driver. Yup thats well over $4k just for transportation to dinner and back, not including the Luger bill. Everywhere they went it was spend spend spend and nothing but the best. The examples can go on for ever. Waste was always the order of the day and it would not surprise me at all if it still was. Then they get bailed out so they can produce "American cars" made in Mexico with European components. Having said all that I still feel that the Z06, ZR1 and CTS-V are some of the funnest cars I ever tore around in. Not all of their products are crap but many of them are.

Whats funny is the new Caprice PPV's we have at work are nice cars..but then check out the sticker..body made in Australia by Harden..V8 engine made in Mexico..but the manual was printed in the US..lol

Whats funny is the new Caprice PPV's we have at work are nice cars..but then check out the sticker..body made in Australia by Harden..V8 engine made in Mexico..but the manual was printed in the US..lol

I believe it's Holden,the Australian subsidiary of GM that has been manufacturing big ,beefy,muscle cars for quite awhile. The last Pontiac GTO was also a reskinned Holden.

It went (or maybe still goes) well beyond just the top executives. I have plenty of experience dealing with GM people of all levels. Everyone I saw working at GM was spolied, even the assistants to mid level execs. When they would come out from Detroit for the NY Auto Show they would spend an absurd amount of money. "How does 50 rooms for 5 nights each at The Penninsula Hotel off 5th Ave sound guys?" At $500+ a night per each of those 50 rooms you can imagine how it adds up. Now they can't just eat anywhere. They need to be loaded into a dozen Escalades and driven into Williamsburg so they can eat at Peter Luger's. Don't forget the petty cash since they don't take credit. Now when it was time to go back to the hotel those Escalades were waiting for them. At $125/hour for each car/driver. Yup thats well over $4k just for transportation to dinner and back, not including the Luger bill. Everywhere they went it was spend spend spend and nothing but the best. The examples can go on for ever. Waste was always the order of the day and it would not surprise me at all if it still was. Then they get bailed out so they can produce "American cars" made in Mexico with European components. Having said all that I still feel that the Z06, ZR1 and CTS-V are some of the funnest cars I ever tore around in. Not all of their products are crap but many of them are.

GM just pisses me off. The last portion of their "bail out" money went towards the volt. Wasn't made here. The best thing for GM was for them to go under and let another company emerge.

 

I believe it's Holden,the Australian subsidiary of GM that has been manufacturing big ,beefy,muscle cars for quite awhile. The last Pontiac GTO was also a reskinned Holden.

I stand corrected..heads still a little cloudy this morn..

GM just pisses me off. The last portion of their "bail out" money went towards the volt. Wasn't made here. The best thing for GM was for them to go under and let another company emerge.

 

+1

 

Will never buy a GM.

I believe it's Holden,the Australian subsidiary of GM that has been manufacturing big ,beefy,muscle cars for quite awhile. The last Pontiac GTO was also a reskinned Holden.

The G8 GXP was a fun car. It took Pontiac all those years to get it right and when they finally do they are dissolved. A G8 GXP found sitting in a barn in 20 years with no miles on it will be worth good money. They didn't make many G8's with the 6.2.

I prefer fords but am also a jeep fan

what is this thread about?

what is this thread about?

apparently everything and anything. Teachers , unions, auto industry and 9mm handgun videos. Whatever you want

 

sent from my Samsung Note 2

 

 

I love and have a Toyota and Lexus although I do have a Hyundai in the driveway also and drive Ford and Dodge at work.

 

FREEDOM!

Now ya went and did it....I have Peter Lugers on the brain! STEAK--with an ATTITUDE! (just like this thread, lol).......

 

Yeah, what's up with that? I've been trying to lose, like, 30 pounds as I head back to work finally, and all I'm running into over the last few days are food references. First Laico's and now Luger's....sheesh.