11 hours ago, jackandjill said:

I was, of course, kidding. In all seriousness, having declared ridiculous background checks, fees, FFL requirements, permits,  NICS etc as "reasonable regulations", I don't see any court ruling any differently for requiring that ammo be shipped to an FFL. 

In fact, I don't see any court declaring any registration of firearms, ammo etc as unconstitutional at all. Not that its not valid argument, but thats the way courts are, atleast for now. 

I will be happy to be proven wrong. 

True but there are other ways of regulation.  I point to liquor, cigarettes, gas, NyQuil, etc.  Interstate commerce could also come into play as an excuse they could use.  I also predict ammo may end up with special taxes applied just as liquor, cigarettes, gas, diesel fuel, home heating oil, etc.  If Governor Buck Tooth tries to move ahead with some of his other wacko socialist ideas he'll need to reach to the moon to find monies.    

Yes CA has Agri checkpoints and they will use them for ammo. However unlike when fireworks were completely banned in NJ ammo is not banned. So as Peel said you went to the range in Nevada and that was what your brought with you. A little tough to say you brought fireworks with you if they were banned at the time in NJ.

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10 hours ago, voyager9 said:

I’m curious how this wouldn’t violate interstate commerce. Are there other examples besides actual firearms similar to what they’re trying to pull with ammo?

Agree

 

SC needs to rule on these infringements.  need Ginsberg to die now and Kennedy to retire

18 minutes ago, capt14k said:

Yes CA has Agri checkpoints and they will use them for ammo. However unlike when fireworks were completely banned in NJ ammo is not banned. So as Peel said you went to the range in Nevada and that was what your brought with you. A little tough to say you brought fireworks with you if they were banned at the time in NJ.

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Booze and cigs have tax stamps.  How many cartons can you bring your friends when you make that trip south before you're breaking the law?  How much booze are you legally allowed to bring across state lines before you're considered a rum-runner?  I guess one could bring anything but like anything else it's whether they catch you or not.

 

But I put to you can this grow into something that when it's announced, will it become like pistols and autos?  That an out of state FFL will not sell to NJ people?  Will i have to go to Montana for ammo? I don't know........ 

Booze and cigs have tax stamps.  How many cartons can you bring your friends when you make that trip south before you're breaking the law?  How much booze are you legally allowed to bring across state lines before you're considered a rum-runner?  I guess one could bring anything but like anything else it's whether they catch you or not.
 
But I put to you can this grow into something that when it's announced, will it become like pistols and autos?  That an out of state FFL will not sell to NJ people?  Will i have to go to Montana for ammo? I don't know........ 

Ammo doesn't have tax stamps. There is no license or other requirement to buy ammo in free states

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Anyone know anything about reloading supplies in the CA law?  I don't reload now, but when this comes to NJ reloading could get a lot more appealing to me.

BTW today is the anniversary of congress ratifying the bill of rights.  If they only knew.

17 minutes ago, capt14k said:

Ammo doesn't have tax stamps. There is no license or other requirement to buy ammo in free states

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Yes.  I'm predicting the worst.  I thought that's what we do here :).  

Get ready to set up a UPS box in PA or DE and have ammo shipped there

6 hours ago, JohnnyB said:

Hmmm.....Might be vinyl.

good point. same end result though.

Yes.  I'm predicting the worst.  I thought that's what we do here .  

[emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

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Reading CA Prop 63, if you take ammo out of state, you CANNOT bring it back in. You better dump it all at the range if you dont like getting caught.

How they are going to enforce it is different matter, but if you are caught with it, expect fines / penalties what-have-you. 

Over arching point is, they WANT you to break the silly laws they made. 

Sometimes I do wonder if "Criminals" are the ones exercising true freedoms everyday.  

I strongly recommend everyone to read that Prop 63 document I linked earlier. Every paragraph is a chilling, unbelievable, can-they-do-it sh*t. 

4 hours ago, jackandjill said:

I strongly recommend everyone to read that Prop 63 document I linked earlier. Every paragraph is a chilling, unbelievable, can-they-do-it sh*t. 

Chilling isn’t the word. It shows how far they’ll go with their regulations if not stopped. All this shit really has to go to a decent SCOTUS. I wonder how Ginsberg is doing these days?

11 minutes ago, BobA said:

Chilling isn’t the word. It shows how far they’ll go with their regulations if not stopped. All this shit really has to go to a decent SCOTUS. I wonder how Ginsberg is doing these days?

I am praying every day. 

19 hours ago, jackandjill said:

Dont know about nics (yet), but you bet there will be requirements for "log book" and FFL fees. People will then resort to driving over to next state and hauling it in. Then antis will have another "loophole" to rant about. ... on and on and on... 

 

Scratch that part about driving from another state. Apparently in CA its illegal to do so starting 2018.  Its actually worse than it looks (let that sink in for a sec). 

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Can I buy ammunition online or from a catalog?

Yes, but you can’t ship it to your home any more starting Jan. 1. You can still buy online or from a catalog, but you now have to ship ammunition first to a licensed vendor who can charge you a processing fee.

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Will I have to undergo a background check to buy ammunition?

Not in 2018. While you will have to go through a licensed dealer to transfer or buy ammo in California starting Jan. 1, background checks won’t start until July 2019.

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Will I have to buy a special ammunition permit under the new background check rules?

Probably not. Proposition 63, approved by voters in 2016, included a provision that would have required ammunition buyers to pay the state up to $50 for a four-year permit to buy ammunition. But legislation signed the same year by Gov. Jerry Brown appears to have overridden that provision – at least for the time being. Rather than requiring a permit, the legislation Brown signed says ammunition buyers will instead pay a $1 state fee for a background check at the point of sale.

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Can I drive in ammunition I bought out of state?

No. On Jan. 1, it will be illegal to import into California ammunition purchased in another state. The legislature passed a bill in 2016 that would have allowed hunters to bring in up to 50 rounds from out of state without taking it to a dealer, but Proposition 63 overrode that, according to the Department of Justice.

 

 

Reference: http://www.sacbee.com/news/state/article189213039.html

I wonder if cali  politicians really think this is going to deter criminals

2 minutes ago, silverado427 said:

I wonder if cali  politicians really thing this is going to deter criminals 2A community

FTFY. Yes, they do, with slight correction above. 

24 minutes ago, silverado427 said:

I wonder if cali  politicians really thing this is going to deter criminals

Politicians don't really care about that.  They only care that they appear to care.

are california gun owners fighting this?

17 hours ago, JohnnyB said:

Ammo will be a bit harder to control! There are a few fireworks stores in PA strategically placed near bridges to NJ. It is easy to have a car watch for NJ tags leaving one of those few places. Ammo is available at many gun shops in PA and Delaware.... Not as easy to have a plant at every one!

Y'all do know that temporary plates are cardboard printouts now, right?

Just drive over the border with legit tags showing, find a lot someplace to park in for a minute, "install" the fake temp plate, drive to shop, get goods, leave, stop at same lot, remove temp, drive on.  "plant" will have the temp tag.

are california gun owners fighting this?

Yes NRA & CRPA have already filed suits on multiple grounds. Including violation of Interstate Commerce and Second Amendment Rights on the grounds Prop 63 will limit their access to ammo which the Supreme Court has previously ruled the Ammo for Firearms is also protected under the Second Amendment because without Ammo they can not be used for their intended purpose. They are hoping for another injunction.

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17 hours ago, sota said:

Y'all do know that temporary plates are cardboard printouts now, right?

Just drive over the border with legit tags showing, find a lot someplace to park in for a minute, "install" the fake temp plate, drive to shop, get goods, leave, stop at same lot, remove temp, drive on.  "plant" will have the temp tag.

ALPRS

3 minutes ago, 1LtCAP said:

ALPRS

take different bridges.  78 out, 22 back.

Just now, sota said:

take different bridges.  78 out, 22 back.

that is a much better idea.....my point was though, that if you're in pa with "temp" tag installed......those are registered now. if a local pa pd has alprs, it'll flag ya, 'cause the temp tag won't come back to that car. then you'll be in deep poop.

what if someone or some organization opened a business something like a farm co-op just over the bridge in PA ,  for example "The NJ Precious Metal Co-Op"    we can have our ammo shipped there and just pick it up when ever you can.  

20 hours ago, silverado427 said:

Can I drive in ammunition I bought out of state?

No. On Jan. 1, it will be illegal to import into California ammunition purchased in another state. The legislature passed a bill in 2016 that would have allowed hunters to bring in up to 50 rounds from out of state without taking it to a dealer, but Proposition 63 overrode that, according to the Department of Justice.

Would FOPPA cover an out of state person traveling through CA with ammo bought in another state? My guess is if this was a NJ law the out of state visitor would be spending some time in jail.

3 hours ago, 1LtCAP said:

that is a much better idea.....my point was though, that if you're in pa with "temp" tag installed......those are registered now. if a local pa pd has alprs, it'll flag ya, 'cause the temp tag won't come back to that car. then you'll be in deep poop.

Aw come on. Getting charged with fictitious plates, having your car towed and waiting on the side of 78 for an Uber on top of everything else you might be charged with isn’t your idea of fun?

13 minutes ago, BobA said:

 having your car towed and waiting on the side of 78 for an Uber on top of everything else you might be charged with isn’t your idea of fun?

Only if it is a rest stop on 295 outside of Trenton

 

46 minutes ago, BobA said:

Aw come on. Getting charged with fictitious plates, having your car towed and waiting on the side of 78 for an Uber on top of everything else you might be charged with isn’t your idea of fun?

 

32 minutes ago, voyager9 said:

Only if it is a rest stop on 295 outside of Trenton

No no.  I stopped there.  Was about 30 minutes early for a meeting in Trenton and figured it would be a good place to catch up on some email before my meeting.  Not a good place to catch up on email.

9 minutes ago, maintenanceguy said:

 

 

No no.  I stopped there.  Was about 30 minutes early for a meeting in Trenton and figured it would be a good place to catch up on some email before my meeting.  Not a good place to catch up on email.

#ThatsTheJoke

well this certainly took an awfully weird turn for the worse, lolol