Dan

For what its worth. I own a Arsenal SLR-101 SG here: http://www.arsenalinc.com/slr101sg.htm . Its a great shooter. Only thing that I wasn't impressed with is the stock paint/coating. I plan on re-coating it myself eventually. If you can find one around, they already come with a pinned muzzle break and no lug. edit: spelling

Nice looking pistol. Even lighter than my Taurus PT709.

Its not time yet, but they have this up on their site. http://www.ruger.com/products/gunsiteScoutRifle/models.html Handy looking rifle. Reminds me of a modern Lee-Enfield No5 Jungle carbine http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jungle_Carbine

Sad, but excellent read. The DA was throwing anything to the wall to see if it would stick. Hickey's training and type of firearm were brought into question. They used the defense that it is of the same type/caliber that the local PD uses. Defused the argument and the DA never brought it up again.

Going by the instance where Barrett refused to further service or sell .50 cal rifles any longer to California LE agencies. Stems from them using department owned 82A1 rifles in photo shoots for the press during LE's pushing for the .50 cal ban. http://www.military-quotes.com/forum/barrett-arms-maker-50-caliber-t48435.html

Nice! Welp, I think I communicated my opinions, take it for what they are. I agree with a few posters that there is no right answer (circular discussion), just a culmination of opinions. I hope readers understand all angles of the conversation and can use all of the information when making their choices and decisions on the types of firearms they employ in their HD strategy. Regarding the AR10 Vlad, cool rifle! I'm just glad I'm not your neighbor!

No realistic legal recourse for the damage?

Hah! I admit that I'm, shall we say... highly opinionated. ;p Good question. My logic is around weapon and ammo types in common use in LE pretty much anywhere in the country. I'm talking stuff the patrolman would carry holstered, or mounted in the squad car like a shotgun. I guess you can say pistols in .45, .40, .357 mag, .38, .357 sig, 9mm,. I may be missing some but they are what comes to mind. I'm not sure how many LE agencies still use wheelguns, but at least the .357mag/.38 has a pretty big track record in law enforcement use. Again, minus the "scary" stuff like .50 BMG sniper rifles the SWAT guys might have, or even a M4 they may have locked in the trunk. You just don't see cops walking around with those things slung except in special circumstances... hence not "common" i.e. weapons that people see everyday that cops carry.

Lol, you could be on to something!

Looks like he used a wall hanger, could even be a non-firing replica? http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=f61_1293833620

Funny, I'm in the process of returning two gifts for a Leatherman MUT.

Thanks, corrected my post. LTCF is needed for CCW and Open Carry in Philly... as opposed to being able to open carry in other non-Philly areas of PA without the need of a LTCF.

So there's the example of the BATF working with the NJSP. Its like a free search warrant for the NJSP, which opens up a whole can of worms.. especially when we live in a state in which firearm owners are guilty before being proven innocent. IMHO, even when you are 100% legal with your firearms dealings, our best defense in NJ is to lay low and not draw attention to ourselves. Having your head stick up out of the crowd by having a C&R does not seem worth it for some discounts and other potential small benefits. Out of sight , out of mind.

Edited: - I misread the post. Open carry and concealed carry is legal in Philly with a LTCF. This is always the uphill battle. Those who are responsible for upholding the laws don't understand them. I was reading in a PA carry forum that people were getting harrassed by LE in Philly for open carry even though they have a LTCF. Perfectly legal. As for travel to and from PA, I agree FOPA is definitely designed to protect us. But alas, who wants to be that test case. Its unbelievable that we the people do not have realistic recourse for being illegally prosecuted. NJ can file charges and prosecute people all day long, wasting taxpayer money, while draining defendants bank accounts. People that shouldn't be in that position from the get go.

I already answered this in a previous post: Yup, It would not be the only reason you find yourself in court. They know they cannot apply a law that you broke with the type of gun/round that you use. My point is that if there were questionable circumstances, and you were in a position in which you had to defend yourself in court, that using a weapon type/ammo that is not in common usage by LE agencies could count against you when the prosecutor is building up your character to the jury. In my opinion, a weapon that is easier for the DA or lawyer to demonize to a typical NJ jury, will not help you. If it was .40 cal pistol... the defense is "its the same type of weapon chosen by many PD departments here in NJ."

I agree, less than lethal is a bad idea. If your life is in danger, you will want to stop their attack ASAP. Watch this guy take multiple beanbag hits, pepper spray, etc. http://www.metacafe.com/watch/169222/samurai_sword_vs_police/

I get what your saying here. My view is to draw the line so to speak by using weapons and ammunition that are in current and common usage in the various LE agencies in the state or even country. I also consider what a jury made up of apathetic or even anti-gun NJ citizens would feel when they held up the weapon in question during a trial. So that in my mind would exclude AR types even though police commonly use them. I'd rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6 as well, just I'd like to stack the odds in my favor when it comes to the getting tried part.

I've been told by numerous people not to transport a loaded magazine in NJ. Found this post also: http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=8&f=9&t=212439

Its all good. I think the best we'll do is to agree to disagree as you said Vlad. Regardless, good discussion thanks everyone for the feedback. All points well taken.

I'm not saying the issue is the legality of using the theoretical .500 Magnum as I stated above. I've said time and time in the thread that if you are justified in using deadly force, and you utilized that .500 magnum legally possessed gun, to the letter of the law you are within the bounds. I agree there are no laws stipulating that a particular legal firearm is too powerful/large/scary to use for HD. What I'm saying is IF the DA chose to push for charges, perhaps there's some questionable circumstances, etc. if you are civilly sued by the crook's family. You may find yourself in court, where the DA/lawyer is looking to get you behind bars or take all your money. My conjecture is by using a non-"scary" firearm as your HD strategy, you are mitigating risks of feeding the other side from painting you as some kind of blood thirsty gun nut just pining at the chance to shoot someone.

I agree you should defend yourself with whatever you have immediate access to. Whether it be a shovel or full out tacticooled AR type. If you are justified to use deadly force to defend yourself, so be it. My mitigation strategy is why the front of my safe always has the Mossy 500 ready to go. Assorted EBRs are behind it. My finger-push lockbox in the BR contains a glock pistol. Easy access to both, so I don't have to stop and think. They are the most convenient and quickest to equip in an emergency.

I agree with your challenges. I just looked through Nappen's book on moving to NJ with firearms. This guy is seriously misquoting. Site for PA open carry: http://paopencarry.org/ Pretty odd that you can't open carry in a car but can on the street. Also the site says if you have a CCW from PA or reciprocal state, you can open carry in a "city of the first class" i.e. Philly.

I've been trying to find cases as an example. It is proving difficult as I believe the argument is never the single nail in the coffin. It is something that would be used as part of the culmination of evidence when building up your character. It would be used to inject a hint of prejudice to the jury, which in NJ are most likely apathetic to 2A rights or laws. Found a good thread on another forum. Good read http://www.personaldefensenetwork.com/forum/topic/scary-guns

This is the type of thing I'm thinking about, not the black and white legality on whether it is legal to employ a .500 S&W Magnum for self defense when deadly force is justified. If the DA chooses to go after you, now its up to the jury to decide if it was justified, along with any civil suits that may be brought against you. The DA, or lawyer in a civil suit will bring to question everything and anything about the shooting and your life that they will feel helps their case.

I contend that the shooting was legal, and the weapon was legal also. You aren't being charged for homicide or illegal possession of a weapon. There are more implications than that, such as civil suits brought against you by the relatives of the intruder, like wrongful death or unlawful force as stated in the article. My idea here isn't that you broke the law using your .500 S&W Magnum, it is all about if for some reason the DA chose to charge you, what is going to help or hurt your case in general.