High Exposure

Personally I think it is a gimmick and waste of $$. Carrying Less Lethal and lethal ammunition for the same weapon system is a big No-No. Too easy to confuse one for the other under stress and hit someone with a beanbag when you really wanted a slug or with 00B instead of rubber shot. Bad JuJu. Less lethal platforms are dedicated to LL only, they should never pull double duty.

The OEM mount for the PRO can be set to two different heights with the addition or removal of a riser in the mount. With the riser in place, the center of the optic is about 1.535" above the rail. I am not sure in the exact height without the spacer but I think it is around 1.2" giving you an undesirable upper 1/3 cowitness on an AR. On the AR platform you need the center of the optic at 1.75" for a standard lower 1/3 cowitness, and at 1.38" for an absolute co witness. I don't know for sure but my guess is that these heights make the mount useful across a wider range of platforms, as the Aimpoint is not solely an AR optic. I have mine in OEM mounts (sans riser) on an MSAR STG-E4, an MP5, and an 870 in addition to a Colt R0933 "Commando" (with the riser installed). The OEM mount gives me useful mounting options for all four platforms. Although... I am thinking about getting an ADM Low Mount for use on the MSAR. I would prefer if the optic was just a tad lower. ADM makes good gear - I have one of their MRDS mounts and I like it a lot - and they make the lowest aftermarket PRO mount I could find.

Hey, I can't argue. I am still looking into converting a Saiga myself. Just deciding on caliber... The was a decent price on converted 5.56 Saigas posted the other day in the "Hot Deals Discussion" if he isn't married to the 7.62x39... http://www.jgsales.com/saiga-ak-style-rifle,-223,-16-barrel,-black-synthetic-stock,-new.-p-63105.html If I had the dough lying around right now I would get one myself....

alowerlevel, I don't get it either.... KWGOOD1980, you do realize that you can pin a stock at any length you wish right? So the point about a shorter length of pull you are alluding to is moot. Even so, I keep my stock 1 click out in armor, 2 clicks out slick even when working tight spaces. Also, you keep referring to not having full auto as if that matters for HD/CQB/FISHing. I don't know anyone who is trained in HR or CQB tactics that thinks FA is the way to go. It is about precision and surgical shots, not "firepower". I have FA capability on 2 issued carbines, as do my colleagues and teammates. We never use it in CQB. You also hint that you feel if an AR doesn't have full auto you are better off with a pistol - as if 5.56x45 is only superior to pistol calibers if full auto is a feature? I am not tracking brother..... Yes, FA has a specific role in certain instances, but lacking that capability it isn't a deal breaker that relegates the AR platform to the bottom of the heap. I would take a semi only AR over a FA pistol or subgun all day long to defend my home or to hunt badguys in theirs.

Falling off the wagon? Do we need to hold an intervention?

Double check with Larue. The OEM PRO mount is a weird height. Not quite lower 1/3 not quite absolute cowitness. Call them and they will set you up.

With a T1, not a PRO.

When I used a mag I kept it in a Larue Flip To Side mount, it rocked.

Aimpoint PRO or T1. If you have the cash, get an Aimpont 3x Magnifier in a FTS mount.

Usnmars or Parker, anything else on those USMC Winchester 1895 leverguns? I am curious and I still can't find anything on them...

A Kentucky long rifle because they don't jam [sic].

1) I prefer the BFG non-padded VCAS quick adjust 2 point sling.2) I prefer the Aimpont T1 and I also use the Aimpoint PRO. I prefer no magnifier. I do most of my shooting inside of 100 yards and find I am just as accurate but measurably faster without the 3x mag. 3) White light as opposed to IR light for use under NODs. I require a minimum of 200 lumens as that gives me target acquisition (I can see if there is a target or not, but not ID friend or foe) out to 100 yards and target ID (friend or foe) at 50 yards under normal night time/weather conditions outdoors. I prefer 500-600 lumens as that effectively doubles my target acquisition and ID distances. The issues with single point slings as I see them are numerous. They offer no stability when shooting. The provide no support when slung. They flop all over when moving with a slung rifle. They turn your rifle into a lawn dart when slung and kneeling. They have an uncanny knack to whack you in the crotch repeatedly. (Which by the way is a sure way to reduce your effectiveness either in training or a gunfight) Their only real advantage is that you can quickly and easily switch shoulders. Something that can also be accomplished with a quick adjust 2pt sling, which also does everything a single point doesn't do listed above.

I have put 10s of thousands of rounds through ARs. I have never had a malfunction that wasn't purposefully set up by me for training purposes. I did have to install a new action spring once in the middle of a 3 day class. The carbine - an issued Colt M4 had around 7500 rounds through it - was showing sins of weak and inconsistent ejection, but the gun still ran right up to when I swapped the spring. Do you have or have heard of a levergun that has 7500 rounds before it's first issue? I have fired maybe 200 rounds through friend's leverguns - a Winchester, a Marlin, and a Remlin in .30-30, .38/.357, and .45-70 respectively. I had multiple malfunctions on all three, one of which required serious work and new parts to get the gun running again. By my friend's account, they were all maintained well and had moderate round counts at the time. To sum up - I have had many more "clicks" than "bangs" with leverguns than with my AR, even though I have given the AR many more chances to fail. I trust my carbines completely and I will take my chances of finding parts to keep it running, if necessary, with the most popular civilian owned firearm in the nation.

That book keeps me up at night. It is my big fear of what could happen because in my mind, an EMP strike is the attack we are facing. It is the easiest way for David to slay Goliath. Lob 1 of those over the US, and let us tear ourselves apart.

First, the M16 FOW is what it is. "Civilian" ARs are in that family - like it or not. It has the same manual of arms, fires the same cartridge, same ergonomics, same operation cycle and principles, same ammunition feeding device, same BCG. To say otherwise is delving into useless esoteric minutae at best. Oh, and just to pick nits, the Military certainly uses "ARs" if by "AR" you are referring to "Assault Rifle" - a rifle firing a medium cartridge with the ability to fire in full auto/burst. An "M16" - by military designation - is a select fire rifle, chambered in 5.56x45 with a 20" barrel and a rifle length gas system. An M4" is a select fire rifle, chambered in 5.56x45 with a 14.5" barrel and a carbine length gas system first spec'd out by the USMC and finally adopted by the US Army. I can buy the exact same rifle (in either configuration: M16 or M4) from a number of companies, including Colt who manufactures the M16/M4s for the US Government - minus the FA feature feature of course - and other than some cosmetic changes required by NJ an US Army M4 or USMC M16A4 will be the same rifle that I just purchased. Second, what the heck are you talking about? You are all over the place... Iraq, DMRs, combat ranges over/under 200 yards....? None of that is relevant unles you live in a Shopping Mall/Costco and have 200 yard shots in your home. We are talking about FISHing here. CQB, not field engagements. You brought up HD and stated that an AR is "Little long to bring up quick and around corners". I say shenanigans! I am as fast, if not faster, with any of my carbines than anything else. I train regularly for FISHing type jobs and do it operationally on a regular basis. The Tactics, Techniques, and Procedures (TTPs) required are easy and intuitive and the basics can be learned with minimal effort. With the correct TTPs any sized room can be cleared quickly and efficiently with an AR, and with a higher chance of desired results if the situation dictates that I need to go loud. My 14.5" AR (hey, wow, just like an M4!) extends just as far from my body as holding a pistol in an isosceles stance. There are TTPs to quickly negotiate tight corners, small rooms, ladders, stairs, etc with a rifle that will allow me to put 5.56 rounds on target, instead of relying on 12g or a pistol rounds if I have to give someone the bees. I have better control over a slung AR than a pistol for weapon retention and the 5.56x45/.223 has less penetration through sheetrock, wood, and other US domestic building materials. ARs are inherently more accurate, softer recoiling, and allow for faster and more accurate follow up shots than either pistols or gauges. These are just some of the reasons why direct action teams, LEO in addition to Military, all currently rely on ARs to complete their missions, and at all boils down to the same basic result - because they flat work. As for your linked articles, get that trash out if here. I don't have the time or the energy to go over how those articles are out of date and out of touch with reality. One quick example - all 3 talked about the HK 416 being the next über-rifle. News flash - the limited number of 416s that were in service with some very special units have since been pulled from their TOE due to reliability issues. How's that for über? Another touted the XCR as a competitor for the next service weapon. Get real. I have yet to see an XCR get through a 2 day carbine class without puking let alone be reliable enough to bet my life on. The M16 FOW has been putting bad guys in the ground since the 1960s and is carried by the best Soldiers, Airmen, Marines, and Sailors out there - including the guys that are so special they could carry anything they want. Even in countries that don't issue the M16/M4 to their regular troops, their SF contingents carry M16/M4 variants. So what is an acceptable tool for HD in your opinion? (Please God, don't say a .45 and a machete...) Congrats Gunnz! Good luck with it. Learn all you can about it and don't be afraid to tinker with it.

Impossible! Revolvers never break or need to be repaired.

One Second After by William R. Forstchen

Why not get a 2 peice FF rail that has a cut out for the FSB. Troy, Daniel Defense, Centurian Arms, MWI, all make outstanding models like this. It will install in minutes, and you don't have to mess with grinding, cutting, shaving, or taper pins. I prefer a standard FSB to a folding front sight anyway. It is always up, meaning one less thing you need to do in the event of an optic failure. It is mounted directly to the barrel, so it is less likely to lose zero or get bumped on a rail. And with a lower 1/3 co-witness, you stop seeing it in your sight picture after a few rounds. Win, win, win.

I'm an a$$hole(He's an a$$hole, what an a$$hole) I'm an a$$hole (He's an a$$hole, such an a$$hole)

Personally, I agree with your opinion here 110%. Building an AR is stupid easy and the best way to get onto ARs regardless of price... Like I said, 98% of the time my answer is "I will show you what to buy and you can build your own. I will help you of you gut stuck". But...... In this particular instance it is not. Some people are too lazy to build their own, and want to just walk into a shop and buy a rifle. Some people are so mechanically inept they can break a ball bearing and have no business being around tools. Some people are WECSOG graduates and can take a bunch of perfectly good parts and build a peice of junk Some people get so overwhelmed by the choices out there they just give up. Some people subscribe to the "parts is parts" philosophy and try to build the cheapest gun they can, then wonder why it doesn't run. Some people have no business building a firearm and should just buy their rifles. Based on the OPs own posts - not having tools, unsure of his ability, uncomfortable with the platform - I think he would get more out of buying his first rifle and learning how it operates while cleaning, inspecting, shooting it. When he is comfortable, then he can think about building one.

Yes, I am familiar with a Winchester 1895 Levergun. I still see nothing about them being an issued item to the USMC. There is a lot about Russians, Latvians, Spanish Republicans, and what not. Maybe I am missing it... The only Model 1895 rifle issued to the USMC that I know of was the Winchester produced Lee-Navy M1895 straight pull bolt gun (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1895_Lee_Navy) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_weapons_of_the_United_States_Marine_Corps#Retired

Instant gratification. Based on his statements, he is hesitant - bordering on reluctant - to build one himself, and he doesn't know what he wants. So, IMO he should buy a bare bones model, learn what he likes and what he wants to do with it, then upgrade to fill that role or build a second rifle to fill that role. S&W is the only non mil-spec AR I would recommend BTW, and for the price of a sport ~$600 he can't go wrong. I usually tell people to build their own rifle and have helped a lot of my friends do so. In this case, I just don't think it is the way to go.

The Winchester built M1895 Lee-Navy was a straight pull bolt action rifle, not a lever gun. (Issued to the Dept of the Navy in 1895, Marines didn't get it until 1897) I can find no reference to Marines ever being issued a lever action rifle. I know TR bought some and issued them to his fellow officer in the Rough Riders but that is about it...

Shhhhh.... Vlad G...... Don't let reality interfere with fantasy! Don't you know that the AR is a glorified .22 that is made by Mattel and is the worst gun ever made. Just as any soldier and they will tell you. It jams [sic] all the time and that teeny tiny bullet couldn't hurt a mouse.

Marlin Firing Pin Spring: FITS: 1894 - Common Parts; 1895 - Common Parts; 30AS/AW, .30-30; 336 - Common Parts; 336CC, .30-30; 444, .444 http://www.midwayusa.com/product/938750/marlin-firing-pin-spring-marlin-336-444-1895-all-models-1894-all-models