TheDon

I think there is no topic with such disparate points of view as HD. I respect everyone’s opinion and understand that the situation in my home is different than the situation in another person’s home. I seriously recommend everyone take a course. The most valuable lesson that I learned was that everything I ever imagined about a home invasion was not realistic. More importantly, I learned how my planning and preparing for those unrealistic scenarios actually hampered my ability to deal with the more probable scenarios. i.e., I used to have a mag extension that gave me 7+1 rounds and I carried another 12 rounds in side saddles on my receiver and stock. The course I took taught me that home invasions are chaotic and violent. Within 5 seconds, the time it takes to get off a few shots, the perpetrators will either be fleeing or the situation will have disintegrated to hand-to-hand. A 2-round extension is just something to get snagged. You will not be reloading, so carrying another 12 rounds in side saddles is just added weight and clutter to encumber movement. My instructor told me that many experts still consider an old-fashioned double barrel shotgun to be very appropriate for HD because of its simplicity and ease of use under stress. He said that a standard mag tube loaded 5+1 is more than enough for any realistic HD situation. This made sense to me. If me and 2 of my buddies are invading your home, and you shoot one of them, I can’t say whether I would beat feet or rush you. But I can tell you that I am NOT going to go hide in the dark corners and engage in a deadly game of cat-and-mouse. It is fight or flight, not acting out a scene from an action thriller movie.

Keep in mind that home invasions are nothing like what is depicted on TV. There will be no one sneaking slowly and quietly up the steps trying not to awaken anyone. Home invasions are fast, chaotic, and violent. You will probably be separated from your children. They should be taught to hide in their rooms. Running to you will put them in more danger and hamper you ability to engage the individuals (yes, plural; home invasions are rarely solo acts) who are invading your home.

I'll stand corrected and lighten my attitude about collapsible stocks. For me, the LOP of a standard stock fits me just fine and I can take the recoil for far more shells than I will ever fire in a HD situation. So, for me, they are a "tacticool" gimmick. But others may benefit from adjustible and/or recoil-reducing stocks. I agree they have their place IF they fulfill a function. However, NOT if they are just there for the "tacticool" look.

+1 And, if you think these courses are expensive, they are really not. If you compare the cost of a course with the cost of the ammo you will spend training yourself and the money wasted on features you do not really need/want, they are cheap. And, you learn in one day what it took me years to figure out on my own.

IMHO, that 500 sounded as if it were priced fairly; not a great deal but certainly not a bad deal. It is interesting that even a youth stock is too long for you. I think your situation is probably the only justification for a collapsible stock in a HD configuration. I just sold my collapsible stock from Mesa Tactical last fall. It wasn't junk. I paid well north of $200 for it 4 years ago. I am not sure what they are running today. The felt-recoil reduction wasn't quite the 70% that they claim on their website, but it was substantial. I'll give them 50% tops. Here is a link for the product info: http://www.mesatactical.com/index.php?id=55 Something to consider: If your budget is $800, consider a 590 rather than a 500. I have both, and I feel the 590 is lighter, has better triggers, and is slightly better quality overall. The trigger alone is worth the $$ difference.

I’ll start: Most Unsuitable: Cruiser-style Pistol Grips. You are in your home with kids, wife, and pets. Any weapon discharge needs to be aimed. For shotguns, that means fired from the shoulder with both eyes on target. Shooting from the hip is nonsense. Biggest Gimmick: Adjustable Stocks. You are not going to be adjusting your stock in a HD situation. They just add one more variable to deal with when you can’t afford the time to be mucking around. Second-biggest Gimmick: Shell Carriers and Mag Extension. Unless you are preparing to engage in a running firefight through the hallways of your home while your kids huddle behind their beds, 5+1 rounds of 00-buck should be more than sufficient.

As I removed the rather expensive Mesa Tactical shell carrier from my Mossberg 590-A1 last evening, I thought about all the expensive add-ons that I have installed and removed to my 500 and 590 over the years. I realized that I probably wasted well over $1,500 on pistol grips, tactical stocks, railed foregrips, vertical foregrips, lasers, big honk’n flashlights, shell carriers, mag extensions, slings, a variety of tactical sights, recoil pads, etc., that I no longer use. Most of the stuff ended up being sold online for less than 1/3 of what I paid for it. Both my HD shotguns are now back to pretty much the way they came out of the box. I am back to original stocks, original foregrips, and no clutter. They have top-mounted picatinny rails on the receiver with holographic sights overlooking compact high-lumen flashlights. That is it. I have learned a lot about tactical shotguns over the past 4 years. If I had known then what I know now, I could have saved a bunch of wasted cash. I was curious to know what features others have tried and found to be a either an unnecessary gimmick or not suitable for HD.

I have always been told that either buyer or seller's range is good to go, but the seller's range is better. Seller's home is good to go, but there are obvious risks that you need to consider.

We have two cats as well. I have certainly considered the effectiveness of throwing a cat-bomb onto someone's face as they are sneaking up the staircase. But our Briard is the better protector. If you have ever seen the WB Sam the Sheepdog, that is a Briard. I pitty the fool who attempts to mess with Tobi's herd.

You would probably be immune to prosecution under 2C:39-5. Are you subject to prosecution under any other weapons laws, violating special restricted areas like school and bank properties, or violating any local ordinances, etc., ? It is unclear. So, being responsible, and knowing NJ, I would say don't do it.

In my opinion, storing an unloaded rifle in the trunk of your car is not in violation of any of the subsections under 2C:39-5. You should be safe from prosecution under that stature. But the fact that it is not illegal under 2C:39-5 does not mean it is "completely legal" to do so. i.e., You pick your kids up at school one day. You open your trunk to store your son's saxophone and the school crossing guard notices your gun case. The exception to 2C: 39-5 will not protect you from prosecution for being in possession of a firearm on school property. The same goes for any local ordinances that may restrict firearm possession.

No legal degree. No legal experience. Just an ability to READ. It just irks me when I see advice on this forum that could lead someone into an expensive legal pickle. Telling somone that exceptions under 2C:39-5 allow them to do something is being irresponsible with their money, their careers, and possibly even their liberty. Rather than start bickering over this. I will make it really simple: I will PayPal you $100 if you can cite a NJ permanent statute that permits possession of a firearm. I have read them many times and I guarantee that all you will find are exceptions. There are no permissions. Unfortunately, an exception simply exempts someone from prosecution under one statute. It does not protect him from prosecution under another statute or in any way give him permission.

It is 9:00am Monday morning and you are looking for a place to park. A sign along the road in front of a church says "No Parking Sunday 5:00am to 1:00pm" and there is space available for your to park. Are you permitted to park there? If you answered "Yes", you are a normal person applying common reason to the situation. But you are wrong and you know nothing about Law. The correct answer is, it is not clear. True, you cannot be charged for illegal possession of a long gun if you hold a NJFPID card. But your NJFPID card is not a “get out of jail free card” that allows you to walk around carrying an unloaded long gun, or store a long gun in your trunk for WTSHTF, or whatever. Never forget that this is NJ.

I took my son to CJRPC for the first time on Saturday. After about an hour of shooting he said to me, "Ya' know, I never realized how bad Range 14 sucked until today." Yes. They are really bad.

Oh how bad doth Range 14 sucketh... let me count the ways.

Foul on the political post. This thread is for awesomeness, not politics.

You'll put your eye out with that thing.

+1 I love the funny stuff too. But 100% agree that we should keep the 2 threads separate.

LOL. OK, I gave you that one.

What is with all this talk of "if" when it comes to dying. I hate to burst your bubble guy, but it is not "if" you die. It is "when" you die. We hope it is some time from now and you have many happy years of shooting left. I have heard a number of stories about lucky gunners who find estates and dupe the old ladies out of their husbands guns for a fraction of their value. Recently I heard of a guy who offered a lady $5,000 for 40+ guns. She jumped at the offer not knowing they were worth 10-times that amount. That's why I have a journal that lists the value of everything I own. I have also willed my good stuff to my sons. You can ammend your will by hand without a lawyer at any time. I do it often.

I was of the same opinion in my first post at the top of this thread. That is why I told the OP he was good to go. But, the FFL holders say otherwise. If someone wants to test this, IMHO, they would probably avoid prison. But who wants the legal bills?

You are not reading what I wrote. ;-) I said "Assuming BB guns would be considered firearms..." and then I went on to do the absurd calculation on the number of homes my neighbor would need to get written permission from. Which, of course, would never happen.

I have not had an insurance claim since the early 1990's. Now, with 2 SUVs to insure, I could easily save $1,500 per year going this route. But, if I cause a fatal accident, I could be sued for $500K. It would take 333 years to save $500K. I think I'll pay the insurance.

The local ordinace is silent on BB guns. I know that for hunting in our area you cannot discharge a firearm within some number of feet from a residence. I think it is 450 feet, but I am not sure. Assuming BB guns would be considered firearms... The average lot width in our development is around 150 feet. If the distance is 450 feet, that means my neighbor would need written permission from all of his neighbors 3 houses in all directions for his kids to plink in his back yard. That is like 18 or 20 homes. Thanks. I'll pass along the info.