Sounds like we all have learned some really good lessons here. While honestly we stood very little chance at this level to change their minds we can use what we learned in the future. Remember there is still another 23 or so bils comming down.

While I was not there due to being out of country I was following the audio feed untill I had to go to bed, and the forums.

 

Things that it sounds like we need to do for the future

1) Do not put all for which bills you want to speek for list every one out, possibly leaving one or two out.

2) Find any all star speakers and try to arrange for them to speak more often.

3) Since The anti's never change their playbook research every last thing they said, since they probably try the exact same arguments the next time. For example during the magizine limits Bryan Miller (At least I think it was him, was quite tired at that point since it was like 3 or 4 in the morninig here and I was still up listening to it.) named a numbr of shootings that the bad guy was not stopped until his magizine went empty. I would not be surrprised if it turned out the bad guy had used up all his ammo, and did not have a spare magazine.

4) If possible record our own hidef video of the whole thing, and put it out for the world to see. (bonus if we could get a camera set up behind them so we would see exacty what they are dooing.)

 

Feel free to add more to this list of things we learned.

 

Currently I am trying to download the entire audio file so I my self can research the anti's points.

After I fired off a email to Mainor about how poorly the meeting was organized, and how he and the other 5 stooges should be booted out of office, I got a email back from him at about 10 p.m. last night offering to meet with me to discuss his position on any of the bills, and that I could call to set it up but that he won't be in the office today. I don't think I'm going to set a meeting up. They'd probably end up hauling me out of his office, charging me with harassment, issuing a restraining order and stealing my guns.

Mighty big of him.

Is there anything we can say to him that won't change his mind on the issues but that might make him think twice about railroading through the next wave of bills? I can't think of a carrot we can dangle.

If anyone can find value in this meeting, I'd like to attend.

For example during the magizine limits Bryan Miller (At least I think it was him, was quite tired at that point since it was like 3 or 4 in the morninig here and I was still up listening to it.) named a numbr of shootings that the bad guy was not stopped until his magizine went empty. I would not be surrprised if it turned out the bad guy had used up all his ammo, and did not have a spare magazine.

 

If I remember right he was referencing Tuscon and the fact that the shooter was stopped by civilians while changing his 30-round magazine. His point was that the civilians could have acted sooner if the shooter only had a 10-round magazine. What he fails to mention is that the only reason the civilians had time to act is because the shooter DROPPED the new mag on the GROUND right in front of the old lady who grabbed it and kept him from reloading in time for others to tackle him.

Mighty big of him. Is there anything we can say to him that won't change his mind on the issues but that might make him think twice about railroading through the next wave of bills? I can't think of a carrot we can dangle. If anyone can find value in this meeting, I'd like to attend.

 

Fills up his calendar so he can't spend dedicate more time to additional useless bills?

I'd say send him a letter back and say "The meeting time that works best for me is in the month of November, I'll see you at the polls. Does that work for you?"

Definitely take him up on the meeting. I wouldn't pass that up for nothing. Stay composed and confront him with questions they refuse to answer. We already know what they know and vice versa. Now let's get answers to questions they refuse to acknowledge and/or answer on record! Bring a pocket recorder!

 

 

Sent from John's iPad 2 via Tapatalk HD

Typos courtesy Apple...

After I fired off a email to Mainor about how poorly the meeting was organized, and how he and the other 5 stooges should be booted out of office, I got a email back from him at about 10 p.m. last night offering to meet with me to discuss his position on any of the bills, and that I could call to set it up but that he won't be in the office today. I don't think I'm going to set a meeting up. They'd probably end up hauling me out of his office, charging me with harassment, issuing a restraining order and stealing my guns.

 

Invite him to hear from us at an NJ2AS meeting!

Did you call your assemblymen yet?!?!?! I just did. Got off the phone with both of their offices and both of the workers who answered told me that many people have been calling.

 

If you didn't call yet, CALL NOW. We need these phones ringing off the hook.

 

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/members/legsearch.asp

Was the purpose of this comittee to compose and introduce bills for the rest of the legislature to hear/amend/pass or veto? If so, I can understand why THEY did not care about what the public had to say. They were doing what they felt (or were directed to do) was right for the people of NJ. What is important though, is that all of those that DID get to speak were put on record and HOPEFULLY the rest of our Representatives will watch and/or listen to those procedings BEFORE they start looking at these new bills that were introduced. I think those that did not get to speak were given a form to fill-out to "voice" their opinion. What about those of us that could not attend? Can we also fill something out, or was it for those in-person only?

Anyone reviewing the hearing audio know approximately when mcbethr made his speech?

The problem is that if do that in NJ you might have put yourself out of all the primaries.

 

Negative. If you register as Independent, "Undecided" here in this idiotic state, you can vote in either primary.

 

After voting in a primary, Republican or Democrat, they will change your affiliation to that party. You then have to go back and change your affiliation to back to "Undecided" if you wish to.

 

I've done it every year for the last 5 years or so.

If you meet with Mainor ask him if he will commit to only carrying 10 round magazines. If not, why is he so special?

Key bit from paul Mulshine's column today--

 

 

But before those bills can get to Christie, they have to get past Steve Sweeney.

At the moment, the Senate president from South Jersey is more popular than the governor with many gun owners. That’s a real plus for any statewide ambitions he may hold. But when it comes to future ambitions, Christie’s could easily survive vetoing these bills. But could Sweeney’s ambitions survive if he passed this package?

 

KEEP THE PRESSURE ON! Assembly FIRST, but hit the Senate leadership HARD with calls, emails and faxes

Key bit from paul Mulshine's column today--

 

 

But before those bills can get to Christie, they have to get past Steve Sweeney.

At the moment, the Senate president from South Jersey is more popular than the governor with many gun owners. That’s a real plus for any statewide ambitions he may hold. But when it comes to future ambitions, Christie’s could easily survive vetoing these bills. But could Sweeney’s ambitions survive if he passed this package?

 

KEEP THE PRESSURE ON! Assembly FIRST, but hit the Senate leadership HARD with calls, emails and faxes

 

Link to the full thing:

http://blog.nj.com/njv_paul_mulshine/2013/02/will_gun_control_backfire_on_t.html

 

Amazing to see non anti-2a on nj.com

For example during the magizine limits Bryan Miller (At least I think it was him, was quite tired at that point since it was like 3 or 4 in the morninig here and I was still up listening to it.) named a numbr of shootings that the bad guy was not stopped until his magizine went empty. I would not be surrprised if it turned out the bad guy had used up all his ammo, and did not have a spare magazine.

 

I'm surprised Bryan Miller's head didn't fall off halfway thru the hearing. Any time one of our speakers would mention a valid statistic or fact in support of the 2A he would shake his head while maintaining eye contact with Mainor. As if they already had a binding agreement and he was communicating "this is so annoying!"

Negative. If you register as Independent, "Undecided" here in this idiotic state, you can vote in either primary.

 

After voting in a primary, Republican or Democrat, they will change your affiliation to that party. You then have to go back and change your affiliation to back to "Undecided" if you wish to.

 

I've done it every year for the last 5 years or so.

 

Good info dude, thanks

Everybody needs to listen to Vlad's speech again, you can find it at 6:36:05

After I fired off a email to Mainor about how poorly the meeting was organized, and how he and the other 5 stooges should be booted out of office, I got a email back from him at about 10 p.m. last night offering to meet with me to discuss his position on any of the bills, and that I could call to set it up but that he won't be in the office today. I don't think I'm going to set a meeting up. They'd probably end up hauling me out of his office, charging me with harassment, issuing a restraining order and stealing my guns.

I got the same thing....I sent:"

Dear Assemblymember Mainor:

 

Sir

Roughly 300 Gun Rights supporters, myself included, and citizens of this

State, lost the opportunity to go on record as being opposed to most of

the Legislation that was heard yesterday.....

 

...there was simply not enough room in the building to contain us

all....however I do feel that our opposition should be duly recorded, in

order to facilitate future litigation of these measures. We should have

been able to at least fill out the forms outside the building.

 

I think you conducted "YOUR" hearing in a deliberately sloppy manner,

screwing many people out of having their voices heard...and I am letting

people know about it.

 

Mike E"

 

 

I got in reply:

Sir, I would agree that many people was unable to be heard and some other methods should have been made to allow them to voice their opinions. I'm sorry we don't agree on the bills that was presented and it may be true that many votes were made from emotions. I would really like to meet with both groups, this way I could be educated because there is alot that I may not understand about hunters, collectors, and sports man. If you would like to discuss this further, please call my office. If I'm not there please leave your number and I will return your call. 201-536-7851.

Respectfully,

Asm. Mainor

Sir, I would agree that many people was unable to be heard and some other methods should have been made to allow them to voice their opinions. I'm sorry we don't agree on the bills that was presented and it may be true that many votes were made from emotions. I would really like to meet with both groups, this way I could be educated because there is alot that I may not understand about hunters, collectors, and sports man. If you would like to discuss this further, please call my office. If I'm not there please leave your number and I will return your call. 201-536-7851.

Respectfully,

Asm. Mainor

 

Wow - just wow. My Grammar Nazi is doing backflips.

I got the same thing....I sent:"

Dear Assemblymember Mainor:

 

Sir

Roughly 300 Gun Rights supporters, myself included, and citizens of this

State, lost the opportunity to go on record as being opposed to most of

the Legislation that was heard yesterday.....

 

...there was simply not enough room in the building to contain us

all....however I do feel that our opposition should be duly recorded, in

order to facilitate future litigation of these measures. We should have

been able to at least fill out the forms outside the building.

 

I think you conducted "YOUR" hearing in a deliberately sloppy manner,

screwing many people out of having their voices heard...and I am letting

people know about it.

 

Mike E"

 

 

I got in reply:

Sir, I would agree that many people was unable to be heard and some other methods should have been made to allow them to voice their opinions. I'm sorry we don't agree on the bills that was presented and it may be true that many votes were made from emotions. I would really like to meet with both groups, this way I could be educated because there is alot that I may not understand about hunters, collectors, and sports man. If you would like to discuss this further, please call my office. If I'm not there please leave your number and I will return your call. 201-536-7851.

Respectfully,

Asm. Mainor

 

Ask him

 

Shouldn't you have done that before scheduling "your" BS hearing? You know get the data then make a decision not the other way around.

Anyone reviewing the hearing audio know approximately when mcbethr made his speech?

1:39:15

 

 

Ask him

 

Shouldn't you have done that before scheduling "your" BS hearing? You know get the data then make a decision not the other way around.

 

He's just like The LAPD, shoots first and asks questions later.

 

Oh snap!

 

Too soon ?

Wow - just wow. My Grammar Nazi is doing backflips.

 

LOL. I was thinking the same thing. This guys speaks like a person who never got out of jr. high, forget high school.

LOL. I was thinking the same thing. This guys speaks like a person who never got out of jr. high, forget high school.

I will say this for him....he writes like he speaks, judging from the recording......you know its him and not canned. Does anyone who knows him, think that he is being honest in wanting to discuss it further? My guess is no.

 

...btw...just listened to Vlad.....a true US Citizen....made the hard way

Where are you guys finding a recording to go back and listen to? I missed some chunks and would love to go back through.

Where are you guys finding a recording to go back and listen to? I missed some chunks and would love to go back through.

http://www.njleg.state.nj.us/media/archive_audio2.asp?KEY=ALP&SESSION=2012 (Wednesday, February 13, 2013 10:00 AM Committee Room 4)

"I'm sorry we was unable to agree on the bills passed today, but please understand that I will make myself available to discuss my position on any of the bills. Please feel free to call my office at 201-536-7851..please note that I will not be in the office on Thursday, but if you leave your number I will return your call.

Respectfully

Asm. Charles Mainor"

 

I'm not sure what good calling him would do, but it feels like a challenge.

 

I received the same email from him today after I sent him and email last night.

 

S.

I got the same thing....I sent:"

Dear Assemblymember Mainor:

 

Sir

Roughly 300 Gun Rights supporters, myself included, and citizens of this

State, lost the opportunity to go on record as being opposed to most of

the Legislation that was heard yesterday.....

 

...there was simply not enough room in the building to contain us

all....however I do feel that our opposition should be duly recorded, in

order to facilitate future litigation of these measures. We should have

been able to at least fill out the forms outside the building.

 

I think you conducted "YOUR" hearing in a deliberately sloppy manner,

screwing many people out of having their voices heard...and I am letting

people know about it.

 

Mike E"

 

 

I got in reply:

Sir, I would agree that many people was unable to be heard and some other methods should have been made to allow them to voice their opinions. I'm sorry we don't agree on the bills that was presented and it may be true that many votes were made from emotions. I would really like to meet with both groups, this way I could be educated because there is alot that I may not understand about hunters, collectors, and sports man. If you would like to discuss this further, please call my office. If I'm not there please leave your number and I will return your call. 201-536-7851.

Respectfully,

Asm. Mainor

I hate to give the guy any credit, but it seems like he's expanding on his robo-replies and is actually listening. Which is more than I can say for anyone else on that committee.

I don't know what his motive is, but would it be crazy to sit down and talk to him?

He's kind of dumb, but he doesn't seem evil, like Cryan.

Short video on YouTube titled

Gun Violence prevention hearing bring passion from both sides.

 

 

Wow, I truly think he's progressively freaking out. He's incrementally updating his auto reply, becoming increasingly pleading. Here's what I got, a few minutes after emailing him. "at the meeting the crowd began to disrespect me and at that time I stopped paying attention" Is he serious? Did he just admit to not paying attention at his own meeting? I'm really having trouble hating him. He's so desperately out of his league. And can't write standard English.

 

I have read your email and I thank you for contacting me. Let me start by saying I don't want to hurt anyone, and I do understand the passion that many citizens have towards this issue. I would be the first to admit that I don't look at gun ownership as you do, and it is important that I listen to you. I did try, but at the meeting the crowd began to disrespect me and at that time I stopped paying attention. By responding that way, I may have missed the testimony that would have allowed me to see things differently. I want you to understand that I too am very passionate with my stand on guns, and I continue to reflect on the babies we lost in Connecticut. Since that incident, I tend to look one way, and I shouldn't. So I'm asking you to please give me a call and allow me to listen to your concerns and I can then explain my mind. All I ask is if we see that we can't agree, please let us end the conversation by agreeing not to agree. I'm asking you call my office, if I'm not there please leave your number and I'll return your call. 201-536-7851

Respectfully,

Asm. Charles Mainor