I can hardly even watch this, it pains me so much! Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris is on fire - already badly damaged - looks like horrific destruction. No deaths or injuries thank god, but my goodness, such an amazing, iconic piece of architecture - and LOADED to the gills with priceless artwork. I hate to think of what the total damage will end up being. Sad, sad, sad!

I wonder if Quasimodo got out okay?

Saw some photos and the roof collapsed.  Everything inside is pretty much destroyed.  Looks like an empty shell standing.

I think there's more to this story.  A building like that just doesn't burn like that without help.

Well, it was currently undergoing a very large construction project and was loaded up inside and out with wood scaffolding - that's like a giant tinderbox, if you think about it. Then, some of the actual building - like the spire that burned and fell - was originally made of lead and wood. Can you imagine how old and dry THAT timber was? People look at those buildings and see the stone, but there's often a lot of timber in the construction, too - and certainly on the interior of the building. 

One of the articles said the construction work itself may have triggered the spark. That has me wondering if there was some welding taking place? I don't know. It will be an incalculable loss though - both for the Catholic Church, and for the city of Paris.

They’ve been doing extensive renovations, from what I’ve read, so presumably there are construction materials and activities that aren’t normally present 

the fire reportedly started in the attic.  From what I’ve seen here, even discussing attic work generates a tremendous amount of heat and smoke. 

But all kidding aside, it’s a tragedy on a grand scale  

 

There had to be some accelerant to make the fire spread so quickly.

I still wonder if Allah had a hand in this.

Said the fire started a few hours ago....it's night there...who would be working.....also their vaults contained Jesus's Crown Of Thorns amongst other artifacts and the priests buried within the cathredral........very suspicious a week before Good Friday and Easter...omo.

7 minutes ago, xXxplosive said:

Said the fire started a few hours ago....it's night there...who would be working.....

I dunno, but a project like this might be done exclusively off hours to minimize impact to normal cathedral operations, or they might be working around the clock to finish some aspect of the work before Easter weekend. 

Or it could be something more sinister, but I’m not inclined to jump to conclusions. 

I would also think they have 24/7 security in the Cathedral.

Looks like French firefighters are about as effective as the French military.

I just found this article which gives a little insight... the stone exterior may provide some safety from the outside, but the inside is quite vulnerable indeed: 

The hulking framework of wooden beams that supports Notre-Dame is composed of huge pieces of timber tinder, ripe for catching light. The supports are even called a "forêt" (or forest), because they're enormous pieces of oak. This "charpente" or frame, was built from 1,300 oak trees, enough wood to fill more than 21 hectares of land, La Tribune reported. According to Notre-Dame de Paris, the church framing is more than 100 meters long and the beams that are burning have been standing there since the 13th century.

https://www.businessinsider.in/why-notre-dame-cathedral-a-medieval-stone-church-has-burned-so-quickly/articleshow/68897141.cms

11 minutes ago, Mrs. Peel said:

I just found this article which gives a little insight... the stone exterior may provide some safety from the outside, but the inside is quite vulnerable indeed: 

The hulking framework of wooden beams that supports Notre-Dame is composed of huge pieces of timber tinder, ripe for catching light. The supports are even called a "forêt" (or forest), because they're enormous pieces of oak. This "charpente" or frame, was built from 1,300 oak trees, enough wood to fill more than 21 hectares of land, La Tribune reported. According to Notre-Dame de Paris, the church framing is more than 100 meters long and the beams that are burning have been standing there since the 13th century.

https://www.businessinsider.in/why-notre-dame-cathedral-a-medieval-stone-church-has-burned-so-quickly/articleshow/68897141.cms

I don’t suppose it ever occurred to them to do anything proactive to help prevent just such a scenario? 

I swear the French are a bunch of morons. They suck at everything. They are like life’s JV team. They don’t deserve to have nice things.

18 minutes ago, Handyman said:

I don’t suppose it ever occurred to them to do anything proactive to help prevent just such a scenario? 

I swear the French are a bunch of morons. They suck at everything. They are like life’s JV team. They don’t deserve to have nice things.

I know that such an ancient building as Notre Dame must present very unique fire prevention and firefighting challenges (I mean, water even from a sprinkler system raining down on priceless antiquities would itself be a disaster). It would not be an easy building to protect. That said, people manage to secure lots of old structures, so I have to agree... I too am asking: what the hell went wrong here?!  Notre Dame was a treasure - one of the most visited architectural sites on the globe. How can you not wonder if someone screwed up...? Sloppy construction practices? Inadequate security? Inadequate fire alarms? I guess more information will roll in, but right now, it just seems so senseless that the risk may not have been properly mitigated.

Now, I regret more than ever that on my one trip to Europe I didn't get to France... I always wanted to visit Notre Dame, the Louvre, and Sainte-Chappelle (yet another beautiful Gothic church). At this point, I wonder if Notre Dame's bell towers and rose window will even be left! The building is still burning apparently! I fear the whole thing may end up in rubble.

Once it got going there would be no way to stop it.

Here are some pics of the framing holding up the cathedral.

http://www.notredamedeparis.fr/en/la-cathedrale/architecture/la-charpente/

Retrofitting modern fire protection systems to something as big and old as that cathedral would be nontrivial and may not even be possible (eg depending on the water supply situation in that part of the city). 

Calling the French morons is a bit unfair. The US has tons of old unprotected historic buildings. 

900 year old Christian relic. Perhaps the best known in the world, definitely in the top three. In France, 'Christian' country (supposedly). It's Holy Week.

Sound inviting?

On another note, is this an opportunity for the French to build a "New Green Cathedral"?

Pardon my cynicism; it must be my Jesuit training kicking in.

Spire fell...  It's such a historic landmark you know they're going to rebuild it, but it'll never be the same.

It is frustrating that the cathedral survived a Nazi occupation, but not survive whatever happened today.

I am not Catholic-but my heart breaks-and during Holy Week- a tragedy

50 minutes ago, 45Doll said:

On another note, is this an opportunity for the French to build a "New Green Cathedral"?

 

43 minutes ago, Krdshrk said:

Spire fell...  It's such a historic landmark you know they're going to rebuild it, but it'll never be the same.

I'm delighted to hear Macron say they will rebuild it, however... I have my own concerns from an aesthetic perspective. After all, France is well-known for putting up some incredibly ugly modernist structures which loom over their historic buildings in the most hideous way. 

To this day, I can't forgive the French for plopping that ridiculous glass pyramid blocking the central ediface of the Louvre. (Yeah, yeah.. the French and many critics have grown to love it... but I don't care, I still think it's an abomination. New additions to beautiful historic buildings should complement not clash with the original architecture). So, I cringe to think what they'll come up with for the Cathedral. And since it's a Catholic structure in an increasingly secular (and increasingly Muslim/non-Christian) France - I expect that to be a controversial aspect as well.  The process will not be without controversy!

2 hours ago, Mrs. Peel said:

Now, I regret more than ever that on my one trip to Europe

You can still go, plenty of beautiful cathedrals in Italy and other places. People always wait abs then something happens and it's gone.

plenty of people from NYC and the surrounding area never went to see the WTC thinking it will always be there. 

1 hour ago, Mrs. Peel said:

And since it's a Catholic structure in an increasingly secular (and increasingly Muslim/non-Christian) France - I expect that to be a controversial aspect as well.  The process will not be without controversy!

You've nailed it Emma. You need to see Tucker Carlson tonight discussing France with Mark Steyn. Catch him on the replay if necessary.

Exactly what does lie in 'the heart of France'?

2 hours ago, voyager9 said:

Retrofitting modern fire protection systems to something as big and old as that cathedral would be nontrivial and may not even be possible (eg depending on the water supply situation in that part of the city). 

Calling the French morons is a bit unfair. The US has tons of old unprotected historic buildings. 

I'll double down and continue to contend they are abject morons. 

I know the preventive costs would not have been trivial but doing something would have been frick-all trivial compared to what they have to do now, right?

Water supply? The cathedral sits (or perhaps sat) on a fricken island. We put a man on the moon a half century ago. Some genius could have figured this out. Don't like water? For one of the world's greatest cultural treasures, invest in some halon. 

So say you allow that the place was a fricken tinderbox and that could not possibly be remediated. Failing all of the above, if you have some fricken Pierre on the roof with a torch, you'd better have 10 more Pierres with fire extinguishers above, below and around him watching what was going on. 

 

4 hours ago, 10X said:

Or it could be something more sinister, but I’m not inclined to jump to conclusions. 

Some big shot over there was already quoted as saying they ruled out foul play. I don't see how they could possibly have done that so quickly, unless some frog admitted he tossed a cigarette butt in the attic after he finished his dinner snails.

 

1 hour ago, Mrs. Peel said:

And since it's a Catholic structure in an increasingly secular (and increasingly Muslim/non-Christian) France - I expect that to be a controversial aspect as well.  The process will not be without controversy!

France is rantingly, proudly and stupidly secular. Part of me wonders if this is God's way of saying, "Enough is enough. If you ever want me back drop me a line, but until then I am out of here."

If they tried to rebuild it with any intent to follow the original architecture, it may take a while.  I heard it took about 100 years to build the original main structure.  

If they don’t try to rebuild what was lost.....what’s the point?

Besides, they’ll probably just build some multicultural spiritual center.......

..or a mosque.  Just based on the current population and what they would want.

As for the cause, maybe there was a plumbing torch involved.  Or electrical issue. 

3 minutes ago, Kevin125 said:

..or a mosque.

2 minutes ago, Ray Ray said:

What..... it’s Paris.  There aren’t as many catholics as there were 50 years ago.

Translation: The structure of Notre-Dame is saved and preserved in its entirety.

14 minutes ago, High Exposure said:

Translation: The structure of Notre-Dame is saved and preserved in its entirety.

They keep using that term, Structure.  I do not think it means what they think it means. 

The stone structure may remain but the significant parts that were wood are gone. 

They used the "surround and drown" technique to save the foundation.