High Exposure

I am sorry but that's retarded. Does anyone state that they fear Al hand guards will turn onto "thermite grenades" (thermite = Al, Fe, and heat). Similar to stating that anything with iron in it will rust. It is an alloy, not pure magnesium There are two thermodynamic factors at play here when looking at Mg alloys and comparing them to Al: heat conduction (aka Thermal Conductivity) and thermal diffusivity. Conduction measures how fast heat moves through a material. Al conducts heat around 25% faster than Mg but how fast heat is moved away from its source isn't the big issue here. Diffusivity is the more important component. Mg and Al have similar thermal diffusivity. High thermal diffusivity means a higher conductivity compared to heat storage capacity. This means that both materials conduct more heat than they store. This assists the barrel in cooling faster and more efficiently. Most relevant is this: everything being equal - same ammo, same rate of fire, same enviro conditions, wtc...) The outer surface of a Mg alloy tube will not get any hotter than the outer surface of an Al tube. Mg alloy also has the advantage both in lower weight (about 2/3 of an identical aluminum handguard) & higher strength. Also, the Keymod was not designed for recreational "commercial" users. It was an attempt to update the 1913 system with lighter (for troops fighting a 10 year war in the mountains), slimmer, stronger, free float rail that will mount mission essential/force multiplying accessories more securely (no tolerance stacking by adding rails to a tube type hand guard then accessories to rails) and securely retain and hold zero for soldiers that need to attach white & IR lights, visible & IR lasers, grips, BUIS, GL sights, slings, bipods, etc... allowing them quick and easy ability to re arrange their gear as missions dictated on the fly. You may not like the Keymod system, or BCM's approach to it, and that's fine - I am not completely sold on it yet for my uses either, for a few reasons that you mentioned - but please stow the hyperbole. And Sgt Toadette is right - bringing carbon fiber tubes into the discussion is apples to oranges. CF tubes are designed and are fine for competition and recreational guns. They have no place on "social" guns designated to serious work (I am not talking dedicated HD guns, but guns that are going to war).

FYI: PASP has switched to .45ACP and Glock 21 pistols as of late November. Don't know how long it will take to complete the switch.

I have seen it a few times. Often as an example by an instructor (Paul Howe, Kyle Lamb, couple of guys at Blackwater) But I have seen a shooter have this issue had with a GGG Sling Thing - sling mount that attaches to a standard FSB. He was fine unless in prone, then he was off quite a bit. Turns out he was really wrenching don't on the sling when on the ground. It took a while to figure that one out. I have also seen it with a Yankee Hill FF tube with flip up sights, I have seen it on an ARMS rail with flip up sights, once on an MOE Handguard with standard FSBs and the sling attached to the first slot behind the FSB, and a few times with DBAL/PEQ type lasers. The same thing happens if using a non FF rail and being aggressive with cover or resting your barrel on cover regardless of the rail. In any event, in my experience the closer to the barrel nut you can get the front of your 2 point quick adjust sling, the better off the sling works for you. Larger adjustment range, closer to your body when slung, less tangle/hang up problems, less interference with your support hand grip and "switchology", rides higher so it doesn't lawn dart when kneeling, less chance of changing POI/POA issues, sling slides around your shoulder/armor easier, and easier manipulations all around. I like that at the rear attachment point the sling slides from strong to support side on its own. When using a traditional "sling cup" attachment point like the TD PR-4, I usually keep the sling attached to the strong side of the gun at rear and the support side at the front. This builds in slack for switching shoulders making it faster and easier with a QA 2pt sling. It does however have a couple of "snivel" problems - sling rubs the back of my hand and my chin - that I can alleviate by using the cheaper and effective ASAP plate.

Sounds like your Chief needs a refresher on NJSA 2C:39-3 Also sounds like he needs a realistic expectation of what his sidearm ammo can do to the human body. 6" hole, I don't think so. The Federal Hydra-Shock ammo (that is linked to above) is old technology (early to mid 1990's I believe) and has been replaced with the Federal HST line of duty ammo. Finally, I spoke with a Detective Ross at the NJSP firearms unit a couple of days age regarding acceptable ammo that is not considered hollow point, he referred me to: Corbon Powerball, Hornady Critical Defense, and Federal EFMJ.

I have seen broken disconnecters, snapped hammer/trigger pins, and broken and chipped hammers. I have also,seen some of them choke just from getting dirt, mud, crud in there, while other rifles being shot in the same conditions (including Geissele triggers) keep on running. Granted I don't know the firing history, maintenance performed, or the quality of the other parts in the rifles I have seen trigger fail in, but, I have yet to see a Geissele or true mil-spec trigger fail for anything other than a popped primer lodged in the lower.

Awesome, Rock On! I haven't used it or know anyone who has sorry.

After trying a few (RRA, Timmey, Wilson, Geissele, slicked up Colt mil-spec) and seeing many more in use (and failing/breaking) in classes I have taught or been a student in,, I have come to the conclusion that the only aftermarket trigger I would put in a gun dedicated to real world tactical use is the Geissele SSA. It has the track record, the reputation, and the reliability, all in one smooth trigger. I have SSA triggers in all of my carbines except the issued FA rifles (our policy forbids it or I would have put one in there too) and the DMR rifle I built - that has an SD-Combat trigger in it. The Geissele triggers labeled as E (enhanced) as well as the S3G trigger I consider too light for a "social" gun for real CQB work. Stick with the SSA and SSA-D. If you are only interested in tactical training/classes and the carbine is not going to be one you bet your life, or the lives of others, on, then either the Spikes or the RRA should - maybe - serve you well. But if it were my rifle would still go with the Geissele SSA.

What are the holster options? A lot of the aftermarket rails are limited in the holster selections. I know Safariland makes some for 1911 pattern guns with add on rails and light, but they are rail and light specific. Look into that before you decide. A gun with a light for training is great, until you can't find a holster to fit it.

Howard, In response to your original post: The very idea that you should purposefully "spread your shots out" in order to inflict maximum damage during a violent confrontation is, to put it bluntly, pure clown shoes. It is hard enough to hit a critical area if the body that causes rapid incapacitation on purpose. These areas are small and the human body is amazingly resilient. Add in movement, stress, adrenaline, and all the associated effects of being in a fight for your life and you will see how impossible, even detrimental, that could be to do on purpose. Your rounds will spread out enough on their own even when trying to be surgically precise. You don't need to add in any purposeful sloppiness. In my experience, people that subscribe to this theory use it to make themselves feel better about their sloppy shooting. Instructors using this as a hook to make people feel better about their skills so they will be comfortable coming to class - Charlatans. I am curious as to who the instructor is so I can put them on my NFE list. Was is Lynn C. Thompson of Cold Steel? He is a proponent of that along with the "zipper" technique starting by firing into the ground Anyway, as stated earlier, there are two ways to effectively process an attacker with gunfire: 1) CNS shut down - this is the shot/shots that shits the lights off - brain, high on the spine severing the spinal chord. 2) Blood pressure loss - this is a hydraulics problem: let fluid out/let air in. More holes = faster incapacitation. More holes in a critical area = even faster incapacitation, more holes closer together in a critical area = fastest incapacitation. Large blood vessels and the heart are the targets here - these targets are located in the upper chest area. Think a triangle with the corners being the two nipples and the base of the throat. Both ways of reducing a threat are accomplished the same way. Get the best sight picture on a critical body part that you can as quickly as you can and press the trigger as fast as you can getting while getting hits. If you try to be sloppy to "spread the shots out" you will slow down or miss - both of these outcomes are not conducive to winning the fight for your life. Yes, you can hit lungs, liver, stomach, large muscles, etc... and there will be no in increase in your targets morale, but those shots may not have the desired effect of ending the fast enough to save your own life. The bad guy gets a vote in any fight, you need to make him do what you want. You do that by targeting and repeatedly hitting these critical parts of the anatomy. That doesn't mean that you don't shoot an aggressor in the foot if that is all he gives you to shoot at and you can positively ID that it's the bad guys foot. Just have a realistic expectation about the results of that shot. It probably won't end the fight, but it will put your attacker in a worse condition than he was in before you added the new hole in his body. In training for self defense shooting you attempt to be as accurate as possible because in real shooting your ability and accuracy will be reduced by at least 50%. You train to shoot fast because that is what is needed. Training to shoot sloppily in order to have a bigger spread is training to fail.

Of you mean it doesn't matter which direction the sight faces because the iron sight functions the same whether it is on frontwards or backwards, correct, it is nothing more than an cosmetic difference. If you mean it doesn't matter where the light goes, I disagree. This is rifle is used for training and building procedural memory of administrative functions and TTP using .22LR ammo instead if 5.56x45 which saves me money. For me to get the most out of that training I need this rifle set up as close as possible to my other guns, and I need the "switchology" to be the same. ETA: I assume you mean the first thing, but the "?" At the end screw me up....

Yup. The front sight attaches to the rail with a thumbscrew on the left side. I had to flip it because that's the only way to make it fit with the light in that spot.

Tease!!! Yes. Aimpont over EOTurd all day long. Avoid the Mako stuff in general and that stock in particular. It is a gimmick. If you want to carry an extra mag, there are quite a few better ways than that abortion.

I like the ASAP (http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG500/119) plate and the MSA-MOE Sling attachment point (http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG504/104) which requires the Magpul Paraclips (http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG541/slings) on my VCAS slings on the carbines that have the MOE hand guards.

Good point for relevance: I have fixed front (std FSB) and folding rear on all of my ARs.

Interesting. I am the exact opposite. With the smaller diameter of the T1 tube, I will always use a lower 1/3 cowitness as it leaves more of the smaller "window" clear to find the dot and obtain a decent sight picture. With larger "tubes" like an Aimpoint PRO or M4/M4A or even an EOTech (yuck) I can deal with a lower cowitness (anywhere from absolute to lower 1/3 - even the in-between height that the PRO OEM mount offers) as there is more "window" and any object interfering takes up a smaller percentage of what I can see through the tube. I also find it more fatiguing looking through that smaller tube of a T1 at absolute cowitness height. I find the larger tube optics to be more accommodating there as well, requiring less "Turtling" and offering more forgiveness with a quick or sloppy mount while acquiring the dot from a low or indoor ready position. ETA: Either way, I prefer a lower 1/3 co witness with all RDS type optics regardless of the tube size; although if pressed I will begrudgingly accept an absolute cowitness with the larger optics if I have to.

Lower 1/3 without a doubt. It's a more comfortable and less fatiguing head position, and I like a standard FSB over a flip up style, so the higher optic allows me to have a clearer field of vision. It ain't just you. That is a viable TTP and one that is taught regularly to those doing CQB. Some guys even paint a GITD/Hi Vis stripe on their FSB to help center everything. I know I regularly train on that technique with single head shots out to 10 yards, multiple COM shots rapidly out to 15.

Shawn, tell you what, I won't tell you my opinions on what tools you need to sweat a pipe or knock tin or whatever it is you do. And you don't tell me the tools and tactics I need to do my job. K? Great. Thanks. It isn't because "I am the Law" or any bullish!t like that, it is because your version of LE work is so skewed it makes "Cop Rock" seem like a documentary. Get a firm grasp on reality and use some critical thinking and I will buy you a beer and shoot the bull all night. Until then, hush child. ^^ This all day long! I will take many rounds in a small area quickly over fewer rounds in a larger area longer any day of the week. That .07" difference in diameter between a 9mm and .45 doesn't do it for me.

Explain to me when, in the fight for your life, is the right time to talk on the radio. Also explain how nobody else could be tied up on another call, or closer than 5 minutes. Also explain to me what happens if you are the rifle certified officer, but it is in your car. It must be nice to live in your world were everything is simple.

Again with the misconception. We aren't a goddamn platoon with mutual fire. We mostly work alone. So if I am one of the 800 on BLF's case or one of the 22 in my case, you just don't have a long gun. The presence of a long gun in any PDs TOE has absolutely ZERO bearing on what caliber sidearms are chosen.

I have no problem with the 9mm. If you would have read the whole thread you would have seen that not only did I start this thread, but I think it is a good idea It is your statement above about the prevalence of ARs in LE that was based in complete fantasy that I have issue with. You have the situational awareness of a friggin rock sometimes Shawn.

He still doesn't get it....

Then you would lose that bet. Also, not everyone in every dept is certified to use the rifles. I have a 30 man dept. 8 guys are qualified on rifles. What are the other 22 supposed to use, harsh language?

That statement is way out if touch with reality regarding LE work Shawn. A rifle in the rack of your squad car does jack and sh!t for you when you are walking up to a MV on a car stop or are in a house investigating a DV or burglary/robbery when something goes awry. Even though the rifle is available it's the gun you have with you at the time the world turns that is going to save your life.

Wanted to bump this for an email announcement I just got from Magpul. They are now selling their MS1 sling. It is a quick adjust 2 point sling - similar to the VCAS or VTAC. They are then selling the attachment points as a modular system. You can by swivels, single point conversions, clips, extensions, etc.... To set it up how you want. This is great, I no longer have to buy a $40 sling that I don't like just to cut the "clips" off to thread them through my VCAS to attach it to the ASAP plate. I can just buy the clip for $9. This makes my heart soar like an eagle... http://store.magpul.com/product/MAG513/slings