ruger9

Reality is what we make it to be. There are 300 million guns, 100 million gun owners in this country. There is no difference in 1787 and 2013. Unless WE LET THEM PLAY THAT HAND. I don't understand how you can say you "believe" in 2A, then in the same breath say, in effect, "it's irrelevant/outdated." The Bill of Rights was designed to never be outdated. I have always said, shooting will not (and should not) be required. But if the govt ever tries confiscation, that is exactly what you will have. And I don't think that's "crazy" or "bravado" or even "unreasonable." If the govt/whatever forces they use don't want to be involved in that, all they have to do is stop. Stop moving closer to confiscation. Because when that begins, the blood will ALL on the GOVERNMENTS hands, not the peoples. I should post a disclaimer here, since I have been recently informed that I am "pro-revolution": God forbid, nobody wants that, shouldn't ever have to come to that, the threat of the 2A was to AVOID that, yada yada yada

The problem here, nick, is that none of the government thinks your list is "sensible." I think it's a fine list, altho I have a problem with the mag limit, as statistics show over and over again that they are completely irrelevant to crimes/deaths. I think maybe you place too much faith in our elcted officials. Maybe when NJ (or the nation) gets laws like NY just got (not saying NOW, but sometime), you will think differently. And something else to think about... when the day comes that they DO come for them, and you DO surrender them, what playing cards will you have in your hand to accomplish your "Sensible list" then? THAT is what all this comes down to, in the end. Without the THREAT of resistance, the govt will bend us over a chair... it's happened over & over again throughout history. Learn from it, our Founders did and they didn't even have the 19th and 20th centuries atrocities to further educate them.

Honestly, Nick, I don't think you get it at all... the constitution, founding intent, any of it. Pro-2A'ers attitudes like yours are what RINOs are to conservatives. We're all entitled to our opinions, of course. And none of us (with a brain) WANT to shoot at anyone, or want a revolution. But it can't be argued that 2A wasn't written for expressly that purpose. If you feel differently, I'd have to color you as not on our team.

Nick, Am I mistaken, (if I am confusing you with another poster, I do apologize), but are you one of the "what's with all the defeatist attitudes" posters? Or am I mistaken and you are one of the "this shit will never pass" posters?

-I can't get the link to work- Well, IF anything like this were to come to pass, this would be a SHTF move. Actions have consequences.

Really? You should go check out my thread (today) on "The Bonus March." Army vs UNARMED citizens in DC.

Fortunately, bullets penetrate powder blue.

Believe me, we ALL hope you're right. But that IS the reason the 2nd Amendment was drafted, after all. The idea is, the REAL THREAT of Revolution keeps one from ever happening. But we do have to be ready to fight- we can't bluff- bluff, and our lives as Americans is over.

Did England have 47% of the homes armed? I see this operation as being virtually impossible in the US- there's no way they have the manpower to do it. Even with the military. 300 million guns in this country.

Godspeed. Could be us soon. NY could be the 2nd "shot heard 'round the world" (hopefully only FIGURATIVELY)

Or, rebirth of one. Either way, many dead. Only time will tell.

Mansfield Twp, Warren County PP 4 weeks and 4 days. No issues, just took a little longer no doubt due to holidays and of course the rush to purchase caused by the Newtown shooting.

If this passes, because of my wife I won't be able to leave NJ (unless I leave w/o her), so instead I'll be taking a boating trip with all my guns. And oh yeah.... MOLON LABE.

While I don't fall into the "Sandy Hook was staged/tin-foil hat crowd" (and please, let's not even get into it)... I'm starting to think there's more going on here with all the shootings than meets the eye. It seems to be one hell of a "perfect storm"... too "good" to be true..... all copycats? Maybe Maybe not?

It's not just the hard russian primers; the bigger problem is the lacquer/poly coated steel cases. They don't rotate smoothly in the magazines, so they don't feed well, and sometimes don't feed well at all. If you stick with brass, or even zinc-washed (Silver Bear), there are no problems. Some people have reported after a couple thousand rounds thru the gun and mags, it'll even eat the steel case stuff no roblem. But I haven't gotten there yet.

Yup... watch the right hand while they push something thru with the left. In recent years I'm starting to come to the conclusion that "modern" fighting (calls, letters, the vote, etc) are all but irrelevant. Just like the stock market, over time, always goes UP... America's liberties, despite small victories, over time goes DOWN. And in the end, there's only ONE thing that can be done about it. Not a defeatist attitude at all... just starting to get on board with those who say "it's coming, there's nothing we can do but delay it, so let's just get it over with already."

Am I missing it, or is .... REVOLUTION .... not on that list?

hehe... he got you there, and most of us are flawed in that way!

You are among brothers.

TheSingularity, Welcome! I am looking forward to more of your great, bullseye posts.

ktd1597, You're not going to win this one buddy, not here. LEOs are employees of the people. They should have no more rights than the people. Any LEO who thinks they SHOULD have more rights than the people shouldn't be a LEO imo.

Scott Garret is PRO-2A and pro gun rights, and has said he will oppose every measure introduced. He's federal tho- Senator. He's the ONLY one I know of from NJ who has a pro-gun stance. So I guess every OTHER politician is on the "F list"... including Christie, who can't be trusted any farther then he can be thrown (and that ain't far lol)

Not good enough. Retired cops should have no more rights or privileges than the rest of us serfs.

There's no difference. And I'm not blaming the LEOs for it.

Yup. And it's not LEO bashing at all. They are not, or should not, be above the law, or the citizenry. Just like congress should be held to the same laws the people have to follow, so should LEOs.