runcibleman
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Posts posted by runcibleman
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One time a NJ FFL accidentally sent in a NICS check on my behalf incorrectly logged as a handgun (it was a lower receiver, so they should've gone with "Other"). They noticed the issue when the check was denied on account of a "30 Day Violation" as I had just gotten a handgun two weeks before with them. They contacted the NJSP FIU and cleared it up, and reran a check for "Other" which came back all good to go without any delays.
In spite of all that, guess what? I got a call from a nice detective with the NJSP FIU three weeks later, and he asked me to please confirm that I had been indeed denied that check in error due to a miscategorization by the FFL. I said yes, that was my understanding, the FFL sent it in incorrectly and then had contacted them (The FIU) and cleared it up. We chatted a little in a very amicable way, we said good day to each other, and I was on my way. I've not heard or seen them every since and all my dogs are still very much alive.
I am usually disinclined to answer questions by a police officer, but his very professional and polite ways totally disarmed me. He wasn't on a fishing trip, he just wanted me to confirm the FFL's story, or so it seemed to me. It's been some time so I don't think there is anything more to it than that.
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13 minutes ago, Ray Ray said:800 bucks is doable, over a grand is ridiculous. I would rather have a real stock and 4 inches of barrel than spend that kinda money. Or just build one.
Or build one for $1700.
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In before the $2.2k LWRC magick blunderbuss.
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On 7/14/2019 at 1:46 PM, Rufio.Weaponworks said:I dislike the lack of audible clicks in the adjustments with the MRO, ACOG, Accupoints...basically everything they make except the Accupower.
Ooooh, I really like my MRO, but yeah, those asshats! No tactile/audible adjustment clicks? SERIOUSLY! What the eff, Trijicon?
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1 hour ago, vladtepes said:I run a 7.5 in AR SBR with a Black River Tactical comp..I have no problems with the gun at all being unpleasant.. my wife can shoot it all day long..
Only thing nicer than the BRT linear comp was the Griffin Armament M4SD Linear Comp, but good luck getting one, those things are like good dust, and Griffin Armament told me two weeks ago that they have no intention of ever producing another run of them. Should've bought two when they still had 'em!
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37 minutes ago, ChrisJM981 said:I'm probably in the same boat. I do like to tinker and build things, so I won't rule it out.
My advice to any home builders is simply to use an 11.5" or longer barrel, make sure to use a vertical foregrip, and remove the brace from the buffer tube to measure the OAL. If you have any questions (I'm not an attorney) feel free to PM me.
Agreed 100%
Also, the Vltor A5 tube is approximately 0.75" longer, just to keep in mind, and should you go for that, with a rifle length buffer spring and a heavy rifle buffer (if not just directly a Vltor A5H2/A5H3/A5H4 buffer even), you can really smooth out the recoil impulse. This is a cheap and reliable way to reduce felt recoil and really make the platform that much more shootable.
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5 minutes ago, Blacksmythe said:Picture
Yeah, that's nice and all, but as Anthony Colandro keeps saying, you're a law-abiding criminal in NJ. Why would you deliberately try to get yourself in trouble with the law over firearms? At a minimum, you get a felony conviction and life is totally screwed from then on. No more firearms, ever. Do not pass go, do not collect $200, it's that simple.
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2 hours ago, vladtepes said:last I checked you could shoulder it.. has that changed?
I dunno man. PK90 might have gotten a bit confounded there. The regulations aren't all that complicated, they're just stupidly worded and not assembled into one concise, cohesive document.
In NJ you need to heed the NJSP's guidance as well as naturally obey federal law. I am going to ignore those Black Aces whatever things, as those are strange and anyway, the object of most people's inquiry is building an AR-pattern "firearm" per the NJSP's approved pattern like the Troy Industries A4 "Other Firearm", the Modern Materiel SBF, etc.You measure the OAL (which has to be greater than 26") now, per the NJSP as well as the ATF, from the received extension/buffer tube to the end of the barrel, or the end of the muzzle device if that is permanently affixed to the barrel. It's just that simple.
The ATF says you can shoulder a brace, the NJSP hasn't said anything to the contrary. You must ALWAYS have a vertical foregrip attached to the firearm to keep it a firearm, and not a pistol. Start with a blank receiver that was never built into a rifle or pistol before, very simple. Don't buy a completely "pistol receiver" as that's obviously already built to be a pistol. Just get a completed or stripped separate lower receiver and that's where you'd start.
This sort of non-NFA firearm is not an "assault weapon" per NJ law, as the NJSP even point out in their letter, so you can use any flash suppressor etc. Don't use a folding brace as you'll definitely screw yourself with that. It really is quite simple. Please note, I am not a lawyer, but that's my two cents take on it.
I will err doubly on the side of caution and just get a Modern Material SBF, straight from the factory in the permitted configuration, and that'll be that.
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9 minutes ago, Dark Storm said:So this change only applies to non-NFA firearms and any other weapons. The issue is people who have what was a non-NFA firearm with a folding brace now may have an AOW because it is under 26” folded which would make it an NFA item requiring a tax stamp. This does not apply to pistols (no front grip).
Oh, thanks! I didn't catch that detail! So in many states other than NJ, they'd just take a pistol, slap a VFG on it and that was a legal "firearm" provided they could measure >26" with the brace extended all the way? Curious.
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24 minutes ago, Dark Storm said:Some breaking news on ATF length measurements Looks like ATF is measuring folded / collapsed / removed now
Thanks, that's good to know. So basically the NJSP FIU's way of measuring is now apparently the correct way, per the ATF. A collapsing brace needs to be collapsed all the way for the OAL measurement. If you had a folding one, it would have to be folded.
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4 hours ago, PK90 said:So, all this just so one can have a 4" shorter less accurate barrel, an uncomfortable "stock", a useless front grip, and a flash hider which minimally suppresses a flash, AND pay twice the price for it.
GET OUT OF DODGE PEOPLE!!!!
Yo dawg, maybe I want to ride my bike to the range and not have every cop on the way stop me because I'm shlepping a rifle case, but instead have a sexy longer backpack on my back which they'll think is some hipster longboard travel case, esp. if you slap some "Shorties be broke, longies be woke" patches on it. Because if I was taking a separate upper and lower, bro, that's constructive intent!
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7 hours ago, JohnnyB said:If they want to get you, yes. Welcome to the Peoples Republic of New Jersey!
They would have to alter the upper so it could not be mated with a standard lower. I doubt they did that!
It has been said many a time, in NJ you own a gun at the explicit exemption of the authorities, otherwise what you're doing is entirely illegal. This isn't America.
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8 hours ago, nondisclosure said:It’s pretty gross that the NJSP said, we can’t let you build these because you’re too stupid to build something legal out of a receiver.
constructive intent is nonsense. Buy a complete upper, slap a vfg, no intent after about 22 seconds... Build a lower slap a brace and there is no intent after the upper is built. They’ll have a 20 minute window to come in raid the house and kill the doggo before it is a legally constructed firearm.
And if you do it in the garden shed, they'll first flashbang your neighbor's poolhouse and rake all his windows, pop his chihuahua and labradoodle so you have about 45 minutes before they knock on your door, by which time you're good to go.
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Funny though that DSFC Bloom cited that particular bit of our state's criminal code. Here is NJ Criminal Code Title 2C, Chapter 39, Section 5, Subsection e, paragraph 2:
Quote(2) Any person who knowingly possesses any weapon enumerated in paragraphs (3) and (4) of subsection r. of N.J.S.2C:39-1 or any components which can readily be assembled into a firearm or other weapon enumerated in subsection r. of N.J.S.2C:39-1 or any other weapon under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful use as it may have, while in or upon any part of the buildings or grounds of any school, college, university or other educational institution without the written authorization of the governing officer of the institution is guilty of a crime of the fourth degree.
All of section 5 for your reading pleasure: https://law.justia.com/codes/new-jersey/2018/title-2c/chapter-39/section-2c-39-5/
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5 hours ago, shooter28 said:Neither do I. The letter outlined why these guns passed their test so it shouldn’t be scary to build the same thing yourself. It’s like asking if some new company on the block started producing AR15s and everyone needs to check if they are legal to own. Well, do they fall within current laws? Yep? Coo, go ahead and get it.
I’ve started picking out parts. I was originally going to snag one of the upper kits from PSA but I’ve already gotten to the point of wanting to swap so many things out, I might as well start from scratch.
The one thing I can’t remember since I’m crossed between 3 different threads on this topic. Folding braces- extended or collapsed for measuring OAL?
If it's the NJSP FIU measuring it? Surely collapsed. But the ones they explicitly approved were non-folding so I personally would stay away from a folding brace, because things... and doggo doesn't want to get shot by state troopers.
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On 5/24/2019 at 12:02 AM, ChrisJM981 said:Fine. Go to Old Bridge. GFH has training, which the OP asked for. Personally I'd move somewhere other than Newark. Mahwah is nice and the taxes are relatively low. It's also probably 35-40 min from Cherry Ridge. I don't think they have IDPA or USPSA because it's run by a bunch of GD fudds.
It's run by the fuddiest of fudds who hate anyone who hasn't been a member since 1976 or who isn't an LEO, in which case they worship you and lick your boots. If you're anyone else, don't even bother, they don't want your money. And you definitely aren't competent enough to use a holster, only LEO's, even if they shoot themselves in the leg.
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Oh so they have Gunny Asshole from Randolph there, all plate-carriered up, one gun strapped to the plate carrier in a chest holster and another on his waist, limping around and shouting abuse at people like a drunk asshole? Good, because for what is an otherwise nice range, Gunny Asshole sure ruined Randolph for me, that sack of mentally deranged shit.
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20 minutes ago, JackDaWack said:NJSP gave consent for the configuration, I still don't see what the big scare is over building one...
They are an FFL and i bet they will have them for rentals already, or just call and ask them if you can bring your legal firearm to their range ahead of time.... I highly doubt some guy at RTSP is going to know the difference between a troy, MM or DS from a built firearm or attempt to draw a line in the sand over it.
I agree with you, but the overly cautious abused housewives of NJ, which sadly includes too many FFL's and range operators, are so gaslit with the imagined prospect of shaved-headed state troopers kicking down their front door and shooting their dog and then having to spend months in court that they will rather assume that only those few manufacturers have permission, not you and I, even if we follow their same recipe as elaborated in the NJSP's letter to Troy and DSI.
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27 minutes ago, JackDaWack said:Im curious if we will even get a letter clarifying this, the NJSP don't have a law to cite to say you cant build one from a receiver. If you built a rifle from a receiver did you get permission from the NJSP prior?
Well, that's the problem: Do you want to risk being the test case if there is no explicit consent from the NJSP FIU? Let's say on the 1% likelyhood that some shitty range (and yes, they exist, and shitty RSO's exist everywhere, even at otherwise decent ranges - see the plate-carriered asshole at RTSP in Randolph with the two guns always strapped to himself, barking at everyone because he hates himself so much and somehow management hasn't gotten rid of that nasty old cur) would report you and the troopers come out, do you want to have the hassle and aggravation of having the non-NFA firearm seized and possibly be charged until they are proven wrong?
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1 hour ago, CapGuns&SnapsKid said:As of right now it's the Dark Storm DS-15..the Troy A4...and Modern Materiel no?! And we cannot build them
?! funny got an email this morning that the SB tactical SBA4 brace is on sale too for $99..
Well, that's precisely the reservation of many people here. They don't dare presume that they too can safely build their own versions of what some manufacturers (Troy, DSI, Modern Materiel) got approved based on their recipes. (Must start with new lower receiver, not an already partly or fully built rifle/pistol lower, use a brace instead of a stock, always have a vertical foregrip attached, and overall length must be greater than 26" — which the NJSP measured from the collapsed brace to the end of the barrel, or the muzzle device if permanently attached to the barrel)
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1 hour ago, PK90 said:Is that you Darryl?
LOL, that's not good! Wasn't there a case of a Sr. who got his guns seized once when Jr. was charged with domestic abuse, and all because he never put his SSN on his P2P's and didn't use the suffix Sr., so they went after the guy with the most handguns registered, and then of course he had to fight for weeks to get his incorrectly seized property back?
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Dark Storm, maybe it was clear to everyone else (it took me a few more reads and checking your site, buy your newly approved Non-NFA Firearm is not a fixed magazine AR-derived firearm that is NJ legal, has a shorter barrel, brace, etc.:
So once again, for others who might be slow on the uptake like I am: You can have a non-fixed magazine weapon with a shorter than 16" barrel that is based on the AR15 DI mechanism, within the narrow confines of the NJSP's tolerances, per the letter issued to Dark Storm and Troy Industries.
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17 minutes ago, Shocker said:I added a post-it to the local PD copy, highlighting that it was a f2f between brothers...but I didn’t have to do thAt. and neither he nor I ever heard anything further.
EDIT: whoops that’s not really what you were asking. No, I’ve never used anything other than a regular stamped first class envelope
Oh, thank you, that's good to know too. I didn't think about adding a note, as my father and I naturally share the same surname, so I would hope that they'd realize that we were directly related, but now I won't worry about it either way.
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About there weeks ago, someone here working at Reloaderz posted this:
So what's the latest on this? Has the Franklin Armory XO-26 been now declared as NJ legal just because it's manufactured directly as a "weapon", not a rifle, handgun, or shotgun per the definitions of those in NJ law, and labelled accordingly, so it's an "Other/Weapon" on the form 4473?
MP5 Non-NFA?
in Other Firearms & Non-NFA
Posted
So I was looking at Zenith's lineup and saw that some model are just over 26" long with their braces unfolded. And then a thought came to mind...
If Zenith custom made a version of this that has the brace fixed open (i.e. disabled the folding functionality) and added a VFG, would this comply with the interpretation of what an "Other Firearm" is per the NJSP FIU? https://zenithfirearms.com/product/zenith-z-5rs-sb-rail/ Mind you, they're a manufacturer who start with the raw MKE stampings and do the rest themselves, so it wouldn't be modification of something that is a "rifle" or a "pistol", but it'd be built up, by the manufacturer, for retail as a non-NFA Firearm per NJ's understanding.