mikelets456

Do they need to seize your home and assets as well because a criminal ran into a wall or you closed a door in his face? I guess you should not be able to be able to sleep in your home for months or longer for your safety...right? Yes, the police have a duty to investigate but for how long? Also, to seize your only means of defense? Where does it end? Seriously, you all keep buying into this illusion of "safety and doing their job" while in the meantime you're TREATED LIKE THE CRIMINAL! Why are you okay with this type of treatment. I strongly urge you read the nice post listed below by "HOWARD": http://njgunforums.com/forum/index.php/topic/55938-why-does-nj-treat-me-as-a-criminal/ My letter of the day to our esteemed lawmakers in the People's Republic of New Jersey: Why is it that the state of New Jersey insists on treating me and others like me as criminals? I have lived in this state for almost 30 years, own real property here, pay taxes here, have never committed any crime; yet the state treats me as a criminal. I want to know why? The state does not require people to get photo ID to vote, as that is deemed a right and rights should not be restricted. Yet when it comes to firearms, I am a criminal unless I can prove otherwise. Why do I have to prove I am not a criminal to get a permit to buy a gun, yet the criminal who illegally has one (if caught) is presumed innocent of breaking that law until proved guilty? Why is it that I can pay my NJ taxes with a personal check, yet you won’t trust me to do the same when I want a firearms permit? Why must I use a money order, you know the form of payment people use when they want to do many illegal things and don’t want things traced? Why is it you will not issue me or anyone like me a permit to legally carry a handgun? Why is it that the only ones that seem to be able to get those are the politically connected or those that seem to know a judge? Why is it that several other states where I do not live, do not pay taxes, do not own real property will issue me such a permit (with a personal check) and welcome me to come there where I have no roots and carry a weapon yet NJ where I have roots will not trust me with the same? Why is it that NJ already with some of the strictest gun laws has so much gun violence, particularly in some of its Democratically controlled regions? Why is it that these crimes are almost always committed with illegally obtained and possessed weapons yet your solution is not to solve that problem but rather further restrict the rights of legal gun owners who never commit crimes? Why won’t you leave us law abiding citizens alone and instead go after the criminals? I would like to know why, and I would like a personalized answer to my questions not a form letter stating your talking points. Thanks, I look forward to your well thought out response ________________________________________________________________________________________ Remember, investigation is that of the criminal. This happened in YOUR house and the CRIMINAL is the intruder...so why are you being investigated, why is your mode of self defense being confiscated, why are you being inconvenienced and why are YOU being treated like the CRIMINAL? Finally...why are YOU okay with that? My goodness, you keep giving power over to the State and then complain when they act like Statists!! Really? I'm speechless...

I would suggest copy and pasting and everyone send to their local papers, local officials, their favorite NJ sites, government officials of the state of NJ and so forth. Title it: Guilty until proven innocent...or something like that. OP, would it be okay to spread this around?

My kids are older and we've always told them to be honest and tell the truth... However, what these government shills are doing is illegal and Unconstitutional. I tell my kids, would you be honest with a criminal that wants to kill you? No...you would not. This is none of their business and I'll simply say "no, I do not and please explain what that has to do with my health"? Then I will kindly ask him or her if they use a condom. I assume the answer will not be pleasant. However, the bottom line is how people PROTECT themselves is none of their damn business!

That's the hard part and where I feel this country has gone to the "place of no return". We were having a discussion last night and how can you compete with "free money, free programs, free everything"? The voter base is brainwashed that if you don't offer something for free they ain't voting for you. We only came up with a few conclusions: 1) Get a Conservative to run as a Dem/Liberal offering free stuff. offering everything you can and promising the world, then when you take your oath of office realizing you need to honor the Constitution. However, most true patriots can't lie so that won't work. 2) Play their game. When they question on raising taxes, explain to them you've been to many houses and the elderly/families are struggling and barely making ends meet. Should we ask them for more money? Also mention how special interest groups are running the schools from far away places...how will that help our children? Ask to create a general fund from those who wish to raise taxes for our children and pay for those that can't afford the tax increase. Kind of a "spread the wealth". My conclusion, it ain't getting any better UNTIL the stock market crashes and everyone loses their money and way of life. THAT IS THE ONLY WAY...until then, it ain't happening.

http://cgobc.org/

See you there!

Are you serious? So if your boss hates guns you can never get a FOID? Is this stated on a letter that you could post? Nothing surprises me anymore but this is something I need to pass around and get some exposure. What's next, my boss' signature to speak freely?

Run as a flaming liberal promising everything for everyone. Slander and lie about all these politicians then when you get into office and take the oath to defend the Constitution, do it!

Yes, this is another "key" point. We hammered the "editor letters" with a few different people per week. That's why you need a network of people to work on this point. The papers don't get too many left leaning responses, so if you can get a group of 10-20 people that are constantly writing it will catch on as the "average" citizen starts to see rational responses from us and crazy/Stalin like responses from the Antis. Amazingly with in a month or so it's gets people moving. When we did this the responses were better than expected from the left. They started writing letters that basically said "we're the teachers and we have the final say over your children..." Needless to say, that REALLY got the average couch potato pissed and the letters supporting us poured in that the editor simply stopped the column for a while. The next thing we know they changed the name of the paper, etc. Don't give up...keep hammering away and the radicals will end up "shooting themselves" in the foot. Luckily the country still has "some" common sense, it's up to us to keep reminding them of it. Plant that little seed and if Stalin can state "tell a lie long enough and people will believe it" I feel if you tell the truth long enough people will believe it!

Don't give up, I'm frustrated as you are...please keep fighting even if it seems you're alone. I've been to every rally, town hall and protest under the sun. I've wrote, called and emailed. I don't care if I'm the only person in the world doing it, I was brought up never give up. True story, back in 2007 our school district in NJ showed an inappropriate video to third graders. We had nowhere to turn...even Church friends told us to drop it. So we prayed. School administrators were rude and condescending even to the point where she said "I guess you'll have to do what you have to do then". School board members were rude and demeaning, NJEA was ruthless, we were demonized and belittled. We were sent hate mail, sent threats and even our bank account was compromised. But God surrounded us with great people and the movement grew to the point where it ( the movie) was pulled. Out of 1000 schools it was the only one that it was yanked and the surrounding schools moved away from it God is good. You guys in NJ were closer than you knew...I really think you should have had twice as many people there today even if it was in vain. Keep up the pressure, petition, call and don't give up. I was there with the school...I was ready to throw in the towel as it seemed helpless but at its lowest point is when it changed. Charge forward, I believe you're closer than you really know.

Yes Mr Miller and could you please show me an example where this happened? Matter of fact, could you please show me where this has been used in a crime in the USA? Also Mr Miller, should we ban Fertilizer, Ammonia, Bleach and a host of hundreds of household items because they could kill 100's of people at once!? We need to ban jet airplanes because they have killed thousands and thousands of innocent people...way,way more than all rifles combined!! For those that have called me a "tin foil" hat wearer...I think you need to look at these moronic statements.

Priceless. Progressive hate the truth when their hypocrisy is exposed.

I understand what you're saying but I've been to so many events, town halls, peaceful assemblies, radio interviews, tv, speaking against these groups, NJEA, etc that playing nice does nothing. I'm not saying we need to scream or be rude, but it's time to be firm and stop taking crap. These people taste victory and our time is just about up. Obviously being nice and standing quietly has not worked but being rude does not either. We need to be armed with the facts and be very cognoscent of the people watching...that's who you want to convince. Don't back down, keep in the public's eye and know convincing facts....if you have to get a little loud do it, but to get your point across. Once again, take into consideration you're teaching the "jury" not the judge. Convince those that are watching because politicians don't give a crap about us...if those watching aren't convinced then its time for a completely different strategy....completely!

I applaud you all ....this is disgusting!! You guys are in our prayers and this ain't just a NJ "thing" it's a USA "thing". I don't care where anyone lives in this country, their 2A rights are in DANGER. Good job with keeping it civil, but more importantly you did not back down. I'm one for being civil and courteous during debates, protests, etc. But I've done that for 5 years and we're still portrayed as racist, bigots. I really don't care anymore because the line in the sand has been crossed...I'm still civil but no longer am I nice!

I'm starting to wonder if these people are inciting us to "rebel" or do they really believe we're stupid peons that need them to make every decision.

When you don't practice or [even] believe it yourself it becomes a moot point with no reason behind why you believe it's a right in the first place. Keep playing by their rules, it's been working great so far... hasn't it? Next time someone asks who grants rights tell them the government because if it ain't "God or nature" then it's government.

Really? How the heck do they get away with that one? If your employer is a flaming liberal and they refuse then you can't get a firearm? I guess they figure the more references the better the chance someone won't sign off. Now I'm starting to see why the Federal government wants so desperately that ALL sales must go through an FFL. If they force every buyer to go through an FFL, then they can slowly add laws that deny legitimate buyers to the point that a speeding ticket shows you're a dangerous individual that can't own a firearm.

Do you know why the Bill of Rights are "God given" Rights? Really, you "cringe" when someone says that...really? Why? See, Progressives believe they are the grantor of "rights" which means they can give them to some and deny them to others. When a Right comes from God it can not be altered, granted or taken away...it is a RIGHT for everyone. You need to decide, either acknowledge that Rights are from God or from Government. There is no in between. If you want to cringe and avoid/deny Rights are from God, then good luck preserving them and you're part of the problem. The time for trying to agree and find common ground with these Anti-Americans is over and if you think removing God from the conversation is going to help then you are flat out wrong. Look where it has got us....you tell me if being PC has helped our cause. Convince me why removing God from our rights will help us advance our freedom from government control. Simple history will show that EVERY tyrannical and BIG government agenda had to remove every trace of God, the Bible and his Word. But I digress...

The anti-gun groups in New Jersey are resorting to flying in Newtown, CT families in order to participate in Democratic campaign meetings and to lobby for gun control. This is New Jersey, it’s amazing they have to fly in outsiders to promote Democrats and make the state more anti-gun. Of course, local gun owners are also planning to visit the State House and remind lawmakers who they really represent. Let us hope that these lawmakers remember that these Connecticut residents don’t vote in New Jersey. I'm sorry, but these families are nothing more than activists now and I'm beyond fed up with the exploitation of these innocent lives that were taken by a mad man. I think we need to fly in families that have been decimated by tyrannical governments when firearms were confiscated. FAR, FAR more innocent children's lives have been taken when honest citizens are no longer allowed or limited defending themselves.

Really? What did they ask him? I'm sure he was not treated as a criminal because it was for the safety of the collective...oh boy.

At some point they'll visit the house of the references...I would NOT put it past this state.

My guess, in NJ, absolutely! There is no "Castle bill/doctrine" in the state and I'm sure they'll do whatever they can to investigate the "crime scene". This would include the firearm used, other guns in your safe, etc. Even if it was a clear case of self defense, I'm almost certain they'll press charges against you and you'll end up being the criminal.

Yes, he does live in Cherry Hill,NJ. It also asks it I've ever shot with him. Is he qualified to us a firearm? His marital status?Character of applicant?What is his/her reason they want a firearm? Seriously? These questions are demeaning, insulting and obviously an "infringement" on one's rights. The thing that stinks, is you either comply or don't get a firearm....I don't recall the 2A being implemented in such a fashion. Also, do these Marxists actually believe criminals will go through this process to get a firearm? It's so obvious what they're doing and at some point they need to be "infringed" for these illegal and unconstitutional infractions.

Yes it is for Cherry Hill. What a POS piece of paperwork

It says all references must be notarized. I thought the police did it but I guess not. This is just another way to make it a pain in the butt and discourage honest citizens from getting firearms.