keithco88

Before you say it, yes I tried search about 3 times and couldn't find a thread like this. Probably user error, if there is one you know of just point me to it and I'll be happy. I'm looking for my first bolt action rifle. Really my only requirement is that it handle .22LR or .223Rem because I'm not buyin another caliber. I'd like something that has a detachable mag for quicker reloads instead of needing to feed it into a fixed mag near the breech, that just seems ungodly slow and painful. Purposes would mostly be just putting holes in paper. However if I'm gonna invest in something I'd be more than happy to go "all out" and get a gun that I can learn to shoot correctly and keep forever...but I'd really like to know if paying over $1000 for something like a Browning (guessing here, just an example) is really worth it compared to a Ruger or a Savage. Especially if it's a .223 I'd like something I could hunt with provided I find the right load for it, so maybe something with a 1:7 vs a 1:9 but I'm no expert here so if somebody tells me I can take out a deer at a reasonable distance with the right load on a 1:9 rifle then I'm cool with that. If you do refer me to a firearm please provide a link or model #...tracking these things down on some websites (especially Mossberg and to a lesser extent Ruger!) is damn impossible without a model # because of all the variants factories seem to offer. Recommendations/experiences with scopes for any of your referrals also appreciated as this would be the first gun I'd bother putting optics on and I'm a total noob in that space. Oh are bipods worth it or just something else to lug around? Kinda easy to add after or better for factory to do it? (I'm thinking of the M77 Hawkeye and the new MVP from Mossberg here wrt the bipod) Sorry for being all over the place & thanks in advance for either helping me or berating me into submission.

True, I guess I mean more about the company & the 1 year warranty piled with numerous reports of "spotty" service on the XCRForums. I guess I should specify to think twice about the manufacturer, you're totally right, I've not even smelled the gun so ummm...grain of salt and all that

my response email from Robinson Arms: XCR rifles come standard with a piston driven, heavy-duty 3 lug bolt, a free floating quick-change barrel, multi-position gas adjustment, 1913 Mil-STD rails in the 3, 6, 9 and 12 o’clock positions, and fully ambidextrous controls for the safety, magazine release and bolt catch plus a heat and abrasion resistant black finish. The non-reciprocating charging handle is located on the left side of the receiver and also features an integrated forward assist. Weights range from the 5.2 lbs Micro Pistol to the 8.25 lbs Standard with heavy barrel. The XCR also carries a one (1) year warranty. The New Jersey compliant XCR-L is retailing for $1780 for the rifle with a fixed stock and permanently attached muzzle device plus any optional accessories you wanted to add. Pistols start at $1550. Rifles/pistols will ship ($25 per) with a manual, magazine (STANAG pattern, supplied by ASC) and hard case and usually ship in 6-8 weeks. Sights (+$190-$225), rail covers (+$36 for 3) and Cerakote color coatings (+$200; Flat Dark Earth and OD Green available) are not included at this price. Conversion kits in all lengths can be had for $550 (barrel only: $350 each) and include the barrel, bolt, magazine and brass deflector for the chosen caliber(s). Barrels are chrome-lined and are available in 5.56 NATO (1:7 or 1:9), 5.45x39, 6.8 SPC and 7.62x39 with a light or heavy contour and lengths of 7.5" (Micro), 10" (Mini), 11", 12" 14.7", 16" and 18.6" (Standard)*. All barrels feature 1/2x28 tpi or 5/8x24 tpi threaded muzzle ends. Kits and barrels are usually ready in 3 weeks or less and ship for $15. Parts order forms can be found here. To process an order, please fill out and return the attached order form and both pages of the consumer agreement. We would also need your billing and contact information and your dealer's shipping address and a copy of their FFL (they can fax it to the number below or email it to this address). Payment is preferred in the form of check/money order via fax or email, but we also accept credit/debit cards for a 3% surcharge or COD for an additional shipping fee. Your payment will not be processed until your order is ready to be shipped. If you have any questions, feel free to let me know. *Add $100 for 18.6” kit/barrel. A rifle with a barrel shorter than 16” OAL is considered a SBR (Short Barreled Rifle) and is subject to NFA rules and requires a Class III dealer. A $75 processing fee will be assessed to SBR orders and 50% of the total invoice must be paid up front. things that stood out to me: 1) 1 year warranty - SERIOUSLY? I'm not buying this gun on that alone. I can get a longer warranty on a freakin washer/dryer combo 2) $200 for cerakote - talk about stickin it to the consumer. You're assembling the gun right there and have facilities to do it for less than half that price 3) $1780 without sights. Add sights and you're up around $2000...may as well buy a SCAR Unfortunately this could be one of the most revolutionary and efficient guns on the market, but the company seems mis-managed to say the least. I'm buyin a SCAR or assembling a cheap AR while I wait for somethin better. Thanks to those who offered feedback. For those considering, think twice.

I don't know what he's talking about on the mag release, I find it MUCH easier to access than Glock or 1911 releases where you need to turn your grip on the gun, I use the middle finger on my strong hand and my grip never changes during a reload

Hi folks Anybody seen/shot this thing or one of the other variants? Robinson Arms XCR, I'm specifically interested in the -L (http://xcr.robarm.com/xcrl.php) chambered in 5.56 but they've got all sorts of options. Apparently it was part of the SCAR program with SOCOM but got DQ'd on a technicality for not providing blanks or something. I emailed Robinson Arms to ask a bunch of questions, specifically what a "restricted state" version might look like and cost. Will update this thread if I hear back. In the meantime, what I've found online is an xcrForum (xcrforum.com), a couple nutnfancy vids including a 2012 shotshow update with the company president (where nutnfancy & his crew are kinda douchy to the dude...but whatev it's still useful info) and nothing else really meaningful/helpful. The concepts & design seem reasonably sound to me, but I'm no mechanical engineer nor a gunsmith. So...thoughts? Am I gonna be the first person to try and get one of these things? Thanks Keith

RayRay - completely agree...i'm just making the point that, as BlueLineFish says below, it's very possible that our gun laws don't work, but in order to do something about it we need to prove it to the clowns that put them there in the first place.

+1 for TheWombat California has THE STRICTEST gunlaws in the country according to the Brady scorecard and yet this still happened. In addition to what TheWombat has asked I'd like to see: a) was the firearm used "legal" for sale in that state? b) was the firearm legally purchased, transferred? c) was it a firearm that was legally purchased/transferred but illegally modified (i.e. extended mags, serial number filed off)? d) did the location of the shooting have and follow the mandated processes for the incident? Our government (sorry but I'm as fervent in 1st amendment as I am 2nd amendment, so let the media spin it however they want) IS responsible for answering these questions if they continue to insist that the regulations they put on the books are effective. Further the judicial branch of gov't is responsible for uncovering the facts of the case and presenting them with regards to the laws on the books. Neither of these things happen today and we're responsible for finding people who would do this, convincing them that it's worthwhile to run for office, and get them elected. Short of that, demand answers to these questions from our elected & appointed representatives. How the data/situation plays out is how it is. My point is simply that we never get the facts we deserve and are forced to swallow legislation and "justice" based on hearsay with no accountability back to the parties that fed it to us if/when it's ineffective. "Quit b!tchin & start doin!" ~ not-so-Tibetan proverb

pm sent

+1 Super Troopers +1 any Bond movie +1 Breakfast Club I'll add the A-Team movie because it's hilarious, action packed and makes me want to go watch the cheesy original series

that's the most sensible laws I've ever seen...there's no "heretofor" or "aforementioned" or "behest"...pretty nice Question on transport: so you can't put a gunrack in the car or something? needs to be orig manufacturer equipment on the vehicle?

Thanks Bob & SpecialK...much clearer on the implementation based on how other places do it. Especially agree with if you're doing a good job of CONCEALED it shouldn't be an issue.

I have a logistical question: say it does get approved, what stops every shopping mall, business, and public building from saying "you can't have guns here"? Wouldn't we be reduced to carrying it from our house to our car and in a decent chunk of cases leaving it in our car b/c we're going someplace that won't let us have it? I mean it's concealed, so yeah go do it if you really want to, but letter of the "law" is probably on the side of the business that says "not in my building". That being said, I'm of the boy scout "be prepared" mentality and would absolutely carry when possible and I didn't think it presented an undue risk to myself or my family (i.e. i'm goin out to get hammered with the guys). I'm just curious as to how much we'd realistically be able to carry...

+1 for PPQ. Was at the range with it on Monday next to a guy who rented a Glock 19, overheard him say "yeah I think I want either this or an XD". I grabbed him and let him fire a mag through the PPQ. Response "well I sure like the feel of that a lot better than the glock"

I had a similar situation a few months back; but didn't have a person to look at, just my neighbor's alarm going off. I did pretty much the same as you except when the cop showed up I pretty much yelled "My name is Keith. I live next door (point to my house). My neighbor called me and asked me to make sure her dog was ok". The only thing I'd recommend is identifying yourself up front to the cops. From the limited training and experience I have that is helpful to them. Great job though!

blanket question, and maybe this goes to the NJ2AS folks, but where are stats similar to this but with the key piece of data you note as missing about "legally possessed guns"? I'd also add the data point of whether or not the victims and shooters were citizens or not. Avoiding a debate about the level to which laws are meant to apply and/or protect non-citizens, I think this would be the appropriate way to come up with a true number of crimes committed by citizens who legally possess firearms. Good find TheWombat!

am i blind or does mossberg show up in the rifle space but not the shotgun space....i thought the shottys had pieces from mexico but were manufactured (including the receivers) in texas?

but you are stuck with the 10rd factory mags right? I saw ProMag made some 15rd ones but they're out of stock everywhere and a few sites say they're no longer in production... also is the foregrip version legal in new jersistan?

HA, awesome

Plaxico and military service members caught in NY get 20+ months in prison, this chick gets a $200 fine http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/tennessee-tourist-brought-gun-9-11-memorial-misdemeanor-plea-deal-article-1.1046815?localLinksEnabled=false If you live here you're F'd...if you're not from here we'll give you a pass. Just one more reason to move

did Tom send out the scores already? I haven't gotten anything yet

I keep hearing about problems with the extraction plus issues with the manual flip between mags. Eager to get some real-world reviews on this baby

I had a great time and will definitely be doing it again. Once the PPQ gets on whatever USPSA list it needs to be on I'll probably try that out too. Nice to put some faces to screen names too!

I've got a PPQ 9mm and freakin love it. Got mine through Davidson's & shipped to Jim Flynn for an awesome price. Thing shoots like a dream and feels way better in my hands than a Glock did...just personal preference. Not saying it'll survive the same torture tests and all that, but it's a damn sexy gun. I let two of my friends hold it and they went out to apply for FIDs and pistol permits within a week. And yes, TheWombat will "talk" your ear off about it if you ask him nicely

I'm probably gonna get yelled at, but I've taken two courses at the Heritage Guild in Easton and they've both been pretty excellent. Matt Vollers was the instructor I had for both NRA Basic Pistol and the Heritage Defensive Pistol class. I will say that the agenda online for the GFH step 2 pistol class looks much more aggressive than I had at Heritage, and my understanding is Anthony also does a good job of keeping class sizes small. Both my Heritage classes had 8 people in them. I will be trying a GFH class in the near future, but just wanted to say that I'd had positive experiences with the Heritage Guild classes to this point. EDIT: the Easton facility is AWESOME! The indoor range they use for the public is right now used for the classroom range. In the next few months they'll be opening two tactical ranges with moving targets for their more advanced courses. No pictures or anything, but Matt seems really excited about it and based on my positive experience thus far I'll probably try one of their tactical courses as well as one of Anthony's GFH courses (targeting the low-light pistol course for some practical experience!) and will write up a review once I complete...but probably won't be done with both until this fall.

thanks Maks...i totally forgot about that and was calling people...guess I'll have another beer :-)