Guns seized, charges dropped, still no guns

[Bully 749]

Casual remarks at the lunch truck by a Newark Airport worker about how easy it would be to shoot the president. Colleagues told TSA supervisor, guy was arrested and all his firearms seized. Bows, arrows, hollow points(oof!) and a gun that was apparently stolen from Alabama. Guy was later exonerated but the state refuses to give his guns back (he isn't asking for the hollow points or stolen gun back) but the state isn't giving them up.

 

Shocker.

 

http://volokh.com/2012/05/23/gun-forfeiture-and-the-defendant-who-remarked-how-easy-it-would-be-for-someone-to-shoot-the-president/#more-60288

 

C

[Anselmo 87]

The guy appealed and won. Don't know if he got his guns back yet.

[Qel Hoth 33]

From the link...

 

 

Guess how the New Jersey Superior Court Appellate Division ruled, and then read on.

It is not disputed that the property seized by the State that defendant requests be returned was lawfully acquired, that plaintiff had obtained the necessary permits to purchase the firearms, and that defendant’s possession of the firearms and other weapons in his residence was lawful. Thus, the State has alleged no facts before the trial judge or on appeal that would give rise to a claim of prima facie forfeiture. N.J.S.A. 2C:64–1a(1). Consequently, the State could only seek derivative forfeiture of defendant’s property, for which it was required to bring a civil action within ninety days of its seizure. N.J.S.A. 2C:64–3a.

Not only has the State failed to file a timely civil action, it has provided no extenuating circumstances to request an equitable extension of time. More importantly, the State does not make a claim or allege any facts to demonstrate that the property seized meets the statutory definition of derivative contraband, N.J.S.A. 2C:64–1a. Nowhere in the record does the State allege that the property at issue was used in furtherance of a crime, as an integral part of an illegal activity, or as the proceeds of illegal activity.

Instead, the State argued that forfeiture was appropriate because defendant’s possession of hollow point bullets and a stolen rifle had shown that he was a threat to the public health, safety and welfare. The State compared the forfeiture of defendant’s property to the revocation or denial of a firearms permit if a person is found to be a threat. N.J.S.A. 2C:58–3. The trial judge, without referencing any statute, also used this analogy. We reject this argument as inapposite. This action does not involve the application for or revocation of a firearms permit under N.J.S.A. 2C:58–3, which is based upon a different statutory scheme than the Forfeiture Act. Furthermore, the property held by the State consists of many items, such as knives and bows and arrows, not covered by the firearms law.

Based upon the record before us, we cannot uphold the trial judge’s finding that the State had the right to retain defendant’s property as it was not based upon the required procedure in the Forfeiture Statute. Under that law, the State was required to file a civil action for forfeiture within ninety days of the seizure of the property. N.J.S.A. 2C:64–3a. The State neither made the requisite filing nor proffered extenuating circumstances for an extension of that time limitation. Even when requesting a remand for a forfeiture hearing, the State did not contend that requisite facts existed to prove the elements for prima facie or derivative contraband under N.J.S.A. 2C:64–1a. Accordingly, as the State had not moved timely under the Forfeiture Act, defendant is entitled to have his property returned to him.

 

Appellate court orders his property be returned.

 

Stolen gun he obviously won't get back, hopefully that one found it's way back to it's rightful owner.

 

He should be getting the HPs back though.

[Bagarocks 36]

When ever I was working at NWK Airport, This guy always inspected our trucks in the morning as he worked the overnight. Seemed like a real nice guy, soft spoken with a sense of humor. I've had a cup of coffee with him off that coffee truck more than once.

His day job believe it or not was a morticians assistant.

 

I sure do hope he gets the assistance he needs to get his legally owned firearms returned to him.

[Njgunowner 2]

HP rounds are not illegal to own, therefore they had no argument that they presented some imaginary risk to the public. They are illegal to use in the commission of a crime... which makes no sense to have a separate law for since it's illegal to use any gun or round in a crime.

[reloaderguy 30]

A friend of mine had his guns taken through no fault of himself. It eventually cost him $5,000 to get them back because he had to hire an attorney!

[BigHayden 77]

HP rounds are not illegal to own, therefore they had no argument that they presented some imaginary risk to the public. They are illegal to use in the commission of a crime... which makes no sense to have a separate law for since it's illegal to use any gun or round in a crime.

 

So many people say that, and it's simply not true. If it were, then it would be legal to carry hollow points on a NJ or LEOSA carry permit. You can be arrested for possessing a single hollow point bullet, even if you are doing nothing else illegal, if you aren't within the stated exceptions.

 

I'll eat crow if you can show me the statute that says hollow points are only illegal during the commission of a crime.

[NorthernYankee 94]

So many people say that, and it's simply not true. If it were, then it would be legal to carry hollow points on a NJ or LEOSA carry permit. You can be arrested for possessing a single hollow point bullet, even if you are doing nothing else illegal, if you aren't within the stated exceptions.

 

I'll eat crow if you can show me the statute that says hollow points are only illegal during the commission of a crime.

 

You are correct HP's are pretty much illegal like handguns except under certain exceptions.

 

 

N.J.S.A 2C:39-3f(1) limits the possession of hollow nose ammunition. However, there is a general exception that allows for the purchase of this ammunition but restricts the possession of it to specified locations. This exception provides that:

(2) Nothing is sub section f (1) shall be construed to prevent a person from keeping such ammunition at his dwelling, premises or other land owned or possessed by him, or from carrying such ammunition from the place of purchase to said dwelling or land . . . [N.J.S.A 26:39-3g (2)].

Thus a person may purchase this ammunition and keep it within the confines of his property. Sub section f (1) further exempts from the prohibited possession of hollow nose ammunition "persons engaged in activities pursuant to N.J.S.A 2C:39-6f. . . ."

N.J.S.A 26:39-3f. (1).

Activities contained in N.J.S.A 26:39-6f. can be broken down as follows:

1.A member of a rifle or pistol club organized under rules of the National Board for the Promotion of Rifle Practice and which filed its charter with the State Police;

2.A person engaged in hunting or target practice with a firearm legal for hunting in this State;

3.A person going directly to a target range, and;

4.A person going directly to an authorized place for "practice, match, target, trap or skeet shooting exhibitions."

[Bully 749]

Basically, the whole situation sucks. Reading about stuff like this makes me dislike the state that I used to like. I often feel like I just don't want to live here, in NJ any longer.

 

C

[hd2000fxdl 422]

Basically, the whole situation sucks. Reading about stuff like this makes me dislike the state that I used to like. I often feel like I just don't want to live here, in NJ any longer.

 

C

 

I know how ya feel, and when it gets real bad on some days, I would if I was you, twist the wick 2 times, give 2 primer kicks, turn the ignition on and do a nice strong full kick and point her west and ride around for a while after you cross the river and breath some of the the fresh and free air..

[mipafox 438]

 

 

So many people say that, and it's simply not true.

 

NJGunowner has been saying that for years, he'll never learn. I hope he doesn't learn from some time in jail. I was searching for something a month ago and I found an almost identical post from him but I did not respond because it was a couple years old.